Robin

I think it is more complex than that. Toxic relationships are not as rare as we think. series/dramas/movies at the same time reflect our societies and maintain this particular mindset. I don't think it is specific to BL though. So, in a way, since it is quite widespread, IT IS DEPICTED as NORMAL, even if it is not. But it is a good thing that nowadays we are more and more aware of it, I guess ?

Stereotypes should be criticized. Consent is always a valid debate. However, there is also another taboo. And I think in a way those "problematic" BL display the taboo (even if I don't like how they display it). Sexual assault and violence can be higher in this "community" than in the heterosexual counterpart. Monsters in this "community" exist. But the victims of those monsters also (and most likely victims of their intimate partners). So in a way, those "BL" series "reflect" this dark side.

In fact, I like both I think ? I'm not sure if I like one more than the other. Or I'm not aware of it ? But generally speaking I like looking for the context of a series or a movie (if I've got time lol) : the director's motivation, the actors' points of view, locations etc. It gives another dimension to what you're watching or reading etc.

Unfortunately, it is quite common. Sexism is so widespread (even internalized). That's why those kind of attacks against "female" authors always bother me because you can always "feel" the misogynistic aspect behind. They are not even aware of it.

I'm sorry if I was too harsh. Well, I understand in a way where you're coming from. It's like someone else is always talking in your place. Basically, you are mute. But you can still decide to not be mute anymore and create those works with better representations. For instance, if Thai LGBT people are waiting for better representations in artistic creation mainly made by "straight" people, they will wait a long time...

But I'm still not convinced about that first affirmation you've made about how BL is written and made for straight women. I'm not totally convinced that people interested in BL are exactly "straight". That's my opinion.

I think you are also right about the religious explanation. I've looked into it. It is because the head is where the soul is. So it is improper to touch the head, since it is considered sacred (unless you're someone close).
Also, apparently to hold hands in Thailand is considered indecent in public ? Well that's what they said in some traveler's tips.

But how do you know that that this female audience is predominantly straight ?

And I'm just saying the motivation seems to me more complex (the "turn on" argument is not enough)....If it was the case, you wouldn't have some shows like The Untamed being so popular...

It is based on another novel though (and to be frank, the novel it is based upon is on another level). I couldn't get into the Untamed, because when you've read the novel....the novel is really great (except the extra chapters) for the plot, the universe, the ambiance, the characters. Heaven's blessing is very nice too. You have some fantastic BL/ML novels (more so than the BL series and dramas), more various and complex too.

They should have made some kind of transition scenes to explain more Tine's inner struggle, I think ? In the beginning of the show, you have Tine's voice. It would have been interesting to put it again in this episode, to understand what is going on with him lol

"The truth is that a lot of BL is written by and for straight women". But I really wonder. Is it really the case ? Do we really know the public who enjoys or writes BL series ?
And you say yourself you're lesbian and you're watching a BL series, I guess (since you post a comment here). You don't seem to fit in the affirmation you've written. I also think you don't watch 2gether because it "turns you on" ?

Perhaps ? That's why I'd also like a Thai point of view on the show. I feel like they are some cultural aspects we miss (or don't understand ?) when we are not from the same country. It is frustrating lol

Yes, it seems "off" in this episode (but the stares are still there though). While in ep 10 you have Sarawat pushing Tine on the bed and the hug they have before feels definitely different, compared to the interaction they have in this episode.
This show is so confusing lol

Apparently, in Thailand, patting the head seems to be a very intimate gesture (the top of the head is considered as sacred). It is seen as highly improper if a stranger does that. That's why when Mil tried to do it to Tine, Tine was shocked. Every culture has their own code of intimacy ?

Yes, why don't they "hold hand, hug, cuddle" ? PG13 is not an excuse but the sponsors (and a more "public-friendly" channel) might have a different idea...the general public also....

And I'm convinced the harassment Bright has endured is more or less (indirectly) linked with his support for legalization of same-sex marriage in Thailand (but perhaps I'm seeing a scheme). Some people are not ready yet (and perhaps will never be).

The fact that "in a tale of thousand stars", they have changed the gay soldier in a gay forest ranger should tell you that (self)censorship exists....

It is more easy to treat an intimate touch (touch the breast) as a joke than display it in a more serious and sincere way. True depictions of same-sex love is more "thought-provoking" (with tenderness, care, etc.).
And I think we'll take into account that 2gether has tried to do that : display sincere feelings. It is not perfect. It is not as revolutionary as we want it to be...but they have tried, for a broader audience (yes, we're not in a niche market for this show).
Or perhaps we'll see all of that in the last episode ? Unless it ends badly ?
Whatever.
Only time will tell, I guess.
But for sure, the series is certainly not perfect.

The first episodes were really good. Sometimes I wonder if the first episodes were filmed later (after episode 11, for instance ?). Perhaps that would explain the odd development of their chemistry. They seem more at ease in some scenes and more "cold" in others ? That's why I'm intrigued with this show lol.
To me, their chemistry fits more with a "push and pull" interaction that's why the beginning of the show works so well.
I'm not a fan of TharnType (the plot is -huh- really illogical), but indeed, the chemistry of the main couple is of a very different kind, more confident.

Thank you :)
But in a way I agree with some of the comments. This kind of chemistry does not seem to fit the current status of the relationship displayed in the show. Unless they have done it to prepare a future break up scene. But the break up needs to be better inserted. Indeed, it seems too confusing.

It is getting worse because in a relationship, you are more "vulnerable". You "expose" yourself more towards the person you love ? There is a risk, the risk of commitment. Tine was never serious with his previous girl crushes. It is his first serious relationship and he was already someone with very low-self esteem. But I agree that they could have added some scenes which explained it better.

I don't know...I think people has their own idea of what is a good chemistry based on their own experience. But not everyone is like them. Does an asexual couple act the same as a "sexual" couple for instance ? No. But I more or less agree that the chemistry they have is not at a stage of an established couple ? perhaps ? But still, you have Tine who is very insecure. It is also his first relationship with a guy ? The only thing I find incoherent is how easily he's agreed to move in with Sarawat....but since he's someone who can hardly says no, he doesn't want to disappoint him, perhaps ?
However, the pace and the editing need to be more polished for sure.

But Tine was never that confident to begin with. He has a very low self-esteem. I don't think it is that incoherent in terms of character development. However, the show has flaws for sure.
I found some times ago an interesting tumblr post analyzing Tine's character: https://nerjaveika.tumblr.com/post/614737192604123136/tines-character-analysis
She has summarized it like that :
- "1. ‘I’M NOT WORTH YOUR TIME’
- 2. PLACES OTHERS ABOVE HIMSELF
- 3. HE CAN’T SAY “NO”.
- 4. HIS CONFIDENCE IS ‘ALL TALK - NO ACTION’ (the "Chic" persona)
- 5. NONE OF HIS PREVIOUS CRUSHES HAD ANY MAJOR FEELINGS FOR HIM
- 6. Deep down TINE BELIEVES WAT’S BETTER THAN HIM"

Perhaps the solution is to change your mindset since it is a PG-13, and "public-friendly" show, etc.
So, of course it is a "gay" show but "not too much gay" (huh, let's not scare the BL novices and the general public - I'm sarcastic there-). Depictions of love between same-sex people is still not seen as socially acceptable as having a girlfriend....

If you think like that, then, you won't expect anything and enjoy what you have. I'm not saying criticism is not ok but the complaints here are getting a little pointless....

However, I still don't understand where the "bromance", "2friends" chemistry comes from...I don't see it...Friends are more comfortable...huh

That's why I've called it the "restrained" chemistry....Not friends, not "bros", not "lovers"....an in-between feeling ? That's why I think this show is interesting, for the "weird" chemistry (I disagree with the "lack" of chemistry part, no there is something...open your eyes)

PS : Also, can we stop assuming that the chemistry between them is like between two "straight" guys ? Only them know. Not us. Especially when Bright has said in an interview he doesn't know if he's straight (why do people still label him as straight when even him doesn't know....?????)