RemmyB

I disagree with you. Most 'anti' comments are backed up well with detailed explanations of what they don't like specific to the episode and examples to boot. If this comment section was an English essay that'd be passing grade lol.

And I don't even understand how it is 'anti-fanning' to begin with - is there an inherent agenda of bias to dislike. How many people are actually still watching AoS 18 episodes deep who don't like the show/don't want it to be good. Criticism isn't antifanning by default, and if criticism continues every week it may be symptomatic instead of the fact that a show has had those consistent problems and not yet resolved them dsiudisudisu

Filler =/= bad, filler means a few things: it could be a scene not advancing the central plot, it could be a self contained storyline that doesn't have significant overarching implications, it's scene purely for entertainment value, etc etc. It also is sometimes interchangeably used to refer to slowed pacing for scenes that could be tightened up much quicker without losing any meaning. E.g. in alot of anime especially (most infamously is One Piece) replaying the same moment from different angles four or five times. Thats adding some filler to what is technically the same scene, but it's prolonged artificially which isn't inherently bad, but can irk people due to a) slow pace and b) more importantly, a slowED pace. If the audience enjoyed the previous pacing than if suddenly a series is slower by comparison to how it began it can be frustrating to digest.

You could really enjoy a filler sequence. You could enjoy an entire episode of filler - its not inherently a bad thing, but it doesn't mean it isn't -> filler.

My issues with the dialogue:
1) As you point out, this show has leaned heavily on 'tell, don't show'. These characters describe everything they are doing, there's absolutely 0 inference occurring or room for inference left.
2) If its not out loud, its internal monologue vociferating about the exact motivations, thoughts and plans of action for the characters. This manifests as endless internal monologue throwbacks to flashbacks even 10 minutes earlier. Sometimes even most bluntly the flashback is occurring for a scene that is happening AT that very moment, e.g. when Mudeok and Uk are getting interrogated by Park Jin.
3) Even the rhythm of dialogue is paced very theatrically, but in a consistently stilted way. Again I think the director just has to pad for time because the Hong Sisters did NOT write an additional 10 episodes worth of script for a part 2, the AOS team was just forced to stretch out 20 episodes worth with filler and elongated pacing. E.g. the way Park Jin speaks from the getgo? How every single sentence he not only speaks at 0.5x speed, he pauses almost religiously halfway through every single one and it takes 3x the time to finish any thought? Suddenly every other character is speaking with the exact same plodding tempo. It can get very frustrating.

Agreed. It should be mindblowing that the hyped up episode 16 preview took the entirety of 17 and 18 to resolve (and even then Naksu's entire action sequence lasted all of about fifteen seconds). But it wasn't at all, it's par for the course right now

God. When Mudeok/Naksu was running through the entire 'I'm not a maid anymore, I shouldn't cooking/doing subservient servant work' I was just not having a good time. It's not as though it added some brilliant and deep insight about institutionalisation, it was a filler gag reel that was needlessly injected to pad out the 3rd last episode of the season. Even the dialogue pacing is very protracted at times, frustratingly so.

Whichever producer(s) demanded this 20-->30 episode extension has my total chagrin. Just severely marred a show that had the potential to be an all time great. Imagine if the last 10 episodes had the filler cut out - 9-18 could've been done from 9-14 instead easy and have been all the better for it

The episode was very ehh.

I wish more of the ep 16 preview happened in this one. Jang Gang's return didn't pack much emotional nor dramatic punch sadly. Brighter note I liked the ending, and it was well acted by JSM.

I think a recurring issue (for me) is that it really doesn't feel like part 1 is building up to something worthwhile right now. The tone is as magnitudinous as it was 6, 7 episodes ago. Thats something I really enjoyed early on, the portent of the life threatening Crown Prince Uk duel shaped the story really nicely and made every moment feel more earned I would say? But with these episodes there's no seriousgravitas being presented, pulling the overarching story along.

Lastly, **** yes finally some Mudeok/Naksu action. If for nothing else that's the one thing selling me on watching episode 18

I didn't expect to have a change of opinion but somewhere in the last few weeks I ended up enthusiastic to see Go Yoon Jung play Naksu again. I think it's just the intrigue of seeing Naksu's raw emotions with Uk acted out in her real body. What will be really interesting is to see if Go Yoon Jung can nail the mannerisms of Somin Naksu

Agreed. No part 2/condense the 30 episodes into 20 and this could have been an even bigger hit

Perhaps the next 4 episodes will be altered to change this

Perhaps the next 4 weeks will be altered to change this

My expectations throughout this show:

Before I started watching this - 'wow, these trailers look incredibly campy while the posters look really profound and epic. I have very low expectations but the premise is intriguing, I'll give it a look.'

First 2 episodes - 'holy shit. Maybe the best 2 premiere episodes of any series I have seen to date. Reminds me of how I felt with While you were Sleeping.'

3-4 - 'Okay, comedy is definitely an integral element to the show. But episode 4 was great. The world building is really excellent.'

5-6 - 'Now it's starting to slow down with some romantic tropes I'm not entirely sold on. The leads have incredible chemistry though'

7-8 - 'Holy shit this really is going to be my series of the year.'

9-10 - 'Hmm the pacing has slowed significantly. I guess these episodes are meant to be a break of pace from a frenetic first 8.'

11 - 'Nope, the filler's continuing. Dammit, this show isn't going to be perfect after all. Also, the romance is honestly being a little rushed now or is that just me? '

12 - 'Much better. YES, Naksu the looming threat is you WILL be petrified. Please worry about these complications more than these love line sidestories.'

13-15 - 'Dammit I'm not enjoying this show anymore. I now understand why most korean series stick to a single 16 episode season. And it isn't just me after all: the romance is definitely weaker and less organic now that the cat's out of the bag.'

16 - 'Okay, better. I'm not a fan of the climax they're building towards for the end of part 1, so much unresolved and so many storylines have been dragging whilst many other highlights haven't even been explored yet. But the preview looks good. Hopefully this will ramp up until the end.'

That's fair. For me personally I do think the 2 main characters are actually quite multi dimensional while some of the other characters at the forefront have the potential be well characterised, but haven't been executed well at all to date. The series has a huge supporting cast, many are rather flat in characterisation but there are also many who are not. But if you didn't enjoy the first 6 episodes I doubt you'll love the later episodes anymore - for me those earlier episodes are the peak of the series and the rest of the series will only seem more and more of a slog I suspect.

Looking at your profile pic too, you're a fan of Chicago Typewriter and perhaps Yoo Ah In also. YAI being famous for being very artistically selective with the projects he works on your stance is understandable from that point of view. If you're looking for well written and fleshed out characters in a historical setting, have you seen Mr Sunshine? Set in early 1900s Korea; that might be up your alley.

Indeed. Thats why I always say, there's no way Part 2 was the decision of the director nor the writers. It just doesn't make sense tonally and it's really damaged alot of aspects to the show, the totally different quality of the series from episode 9 onwards is really palpable.

It seems to me a late producer decision after they remembered just how much they splashed on the budget of AoS and they saw an opportunity to milk it for more money until they could guarantee their acceptable profit margins

If it's any consolation I just finished episode 16 and the ending developments + the preview showed me the possibility of alot of those things we have been missing back on the horizon. Badass Naksu again, tension, refocus on the main storyline, some of that excitement that fizzled away reappeared for me finishing off this one. Hopefully with that 1 week break also, AoS can cap off part 1 on good terms.

I have to calibrate my expectations. It's hard to accept certain plotlines when I think of them as the end of this part 1 of the series.

Instead I am trying to conceptualise Alchemy of Souls as a 30 episode show, and problems like the love triangles, or fake Bu Yeon/So Yi are just complications around the midpoint. Makes it easier to digest when you don't think of it as a big finale.

YES that ending, and especially episode 17's preview is fantastic. Thank god, it reminds me of old Alchemy of Souls again before Uk enters Songrim. Definitely feel that excitement I missed.

Was so tired of neutered Naksu, let her be the badass centerstage heroine once more. Bring on the higher stakes.

And bring on... that character from this episode's ending; let's see how the overarching story will march on again.

How are the first 2 episodes thus far? What dramas would you guys compare it to and why? I have enjoyed Kim Min-jae's previous works, he seems to be playing something very different here.

I agree to much of this. Splitting into a second part has just grinded the pacing unacceptably for me and introduced so much lackadaisically written filler content

This show would be stronger in 20 episodes because they could eliminate so much pointless content/problems. It would literally fix (almost) everything I'm struggling with at the moment with this show:

A) Seo Yul loveline could be either finished in the first 10 episodes or done away with entirely. They knew each other as kids, Yul cared for Naksu, he doesn't really want to kill her/remembers her as a decent human and is conflicted between his duties and his care for her. There. No need for a loveline when we already know Naksu/Uk is endgame
B) Yoon Ok's character wouldn't exist. Nothing to do with her character being offensive, her character is lovely and so is the actress. She's just pointless and motionless drama when we already know Naksu/Uk is endgame
C) General pacing of scenes. Especially with Park Jin scenes, the way he speaks his lines lately have been more and more draggy.
D) Naksu would get her power back much sooner. Naksu as an undercover maid is slice-of-lifey filler content we have already seen PLENTY of. We got to see about 20% of an opening episode where she's an all powerful mage, but she's been in her current unfluctuating state for another 14.8 episodes at this point with no sign of that changing until the end of part 1.
E) Jang Gang could reappear in the story much sooner. Should he really be reserved for the climax of part 1 also? We are aware of how central is this character from the moment the show begins but there's been radio silence on him since.
F) So many flashbacks. Some flashbacks are understandable/meaningful. But many flashbacks are just time padding, so often the flashbacks are to a scene literally in the same episode 20 minutes ago.
G) Awkward romantic scenes between the leads as you have alluded. Part of the awkwardness is - why are these two sidestepping around the romance so much? Again it's something that feels like it exists just to pass time. These two have great chemistry. UNTIL these trite scenes with stilted dialogue about how 'this love is an antidote/poison' for 5 minutes on the top of the same bridge. How much more romantic could it have been if there wasn't this outspoken love between them? Let Uk bring Naksu to the top of her tree. Let Uk and Naksu save each other again from murderous conspirators and wild soul shifters and petrification. Forget all this extra fluff that is nowhere near as compelling.


Pacing was literally perfect until episode 8 and then a switch gets hit and we get filler pacing, which is a welcome 'break' of pace from the frantic first 8. Then another one. Then ANOTHER one. And then another one, another one, and another. Goddammit I really like this show and I was really into everything about it, its a shame it makes me feel this way nowadays.

Thanks for such a detailed reply and I agree with you, AoS has alot of great aspects to it aside from the (main) romance.

Thats why it is frustrating for me personally when the show is too fixated on the romance alone instead of progressing the romance alongside the plot. E.g. the scenes I mentioned, the bed cuddling scene the gate of energy scene, episode 12's ending as well are all really good in my opinion because they naturally stem out of the plot moving forward, its more organic and just stronger overall

I also love the secondary characters, especially when they have their own storylines moving forward at a good speed, and I like them less so when their storylines only exist for the main characters/don't progress much at all. E.g. Heo Yoon Ok the character herself is lovely but within the story she doesn't really have any intriguing purpose to her beyond a love triangle which we already know the answer to. On the other hand Master Lee I have already voiced how brilliant his character has been, I also think the Crown Prince has solidly interesting character arc and dimensions to him. I wish the remaining 5 episodes can live up to AoS's potential.

For me, the warmth scene, the end of episode 2 after his gate is opened, the scene where he brings her to the bed after she falls asleep and the beginning of episode 8 when Uk reveals his soul hasn't been shifted/he hasn't been killed, those were the best scenes for me.

Once the stakes have quieted down a bit and the leads have openly confessed the momentum and the unspoken rawness of their feelings for one another has not really resurfaced I agree. We saw it again briefly at the end of episode 12, when Naksu begins fearing for her own 'running wild' and petrification again but without those life and death situations to really bring out the suppressed romantic affection the lead characters share, the chemistry doesn't resonate as hard

I'm getting frustrated with this drama personally, I really feel now the 30 episode choice was a producer decision and not of the writers or director.

Good things about this episode: Master Lee and the entire court scene was (mostly) brilliant, his character has unexpectedly been something in this series that has delivered over and over. Tension was built up very well here from the start of the episode right until its climax

What I am not feeling anymore first and foremost however, is the chemistry. Chemistry is a subjective thing so I hope plenty of people are still loving it but the chemistry of the leads for me, has really fizzled to a stop ever since the leads became open about their feelings. The peak of the chemistry has been thus far - 1. when Uk finds Naksu again after she has been tortured and his gate of energy has been opened, 2. when Naksu relents and warms Uk's body with her own to keep him away from death

The chemistry really peaks for me when Naksu and Uk are going through the ringer, when they're thrust in life threatening circumstances over and over and they are basically alone in the world in their protection and care for one another. When the chemistry is not strong for me is when the characters are narrating the romantic scenes to each other, going through the prompts of 'this love is like X' or 'I love you like XYZ etcetera etcetera..' it just doesn't have the same organic feel to it.

I know people crave the kiss scenes and intimacy but as I said, I think a 20 episode series would've been so much stronger and I would have loved an even slower burn right until the end. If Uk realises his feelings earlier on like he does here still would work great but Naksu reserving her open emotion until very end would have been far better.