Bye folks, I'm not watching the last episode!https://twitter.com/CJnDrama/status/1335388487348965376?s=20
I still believe :) I mean forcing so much kissing scenes, i've never seen this many in Kdrama, between two couples that don't belong. The writers are forcing things more and more. Which makes me think of a plot twist.
After a brief spike, TV ratings are dropping again.
This might be controversial so please if you're going to comment something on my post, please don't make it hate;…
Love triangles where both men have equal chance are more interesting. Love triangles that are shown to be one sided, and where one man has substantially less time are frustrating.
"NDS's character development isn't over yet and it's getting there. Besides being entangled in SDM's life, he has his own issues. He never felt worth it and what people praised him for have been his biggest guilts - one of them being the Math Olympiad contest. Since he cheated on the contest, he's always been feeling like he isn't living up to what people knew him for and felt like a loser. And even after HJP met him, he was told that he was a failure and his company wasn't worth investing in (I'm not mad at HJP here and I'll explain why this is important)."
I disagree, NDS character will not develop, until he stops being rewarded for his mistakes. It's all a matter of perspective, the problems, hindrances that NDS sees are actually not true barriers. They are artificial manifestations of his own mind, and thus just like a flight simulator, can only give him a modicum of experience for the real thing. But so far, the real barriers have never visualized, instead, most of his so called "trials" are met with reward instead. So he is not getting proper character growth, in fact it has emboldened him on the truth of his actions.
All these failures like cheating on the math test, getting SST acqhired and etc... has never been punished, he has reaped the rewards of his mistakes. So, a child, who never realizes how wrong he is, is going to keep doing those mistakes. The only character who was calling NDS on his mistakes was HJP, but HJP is the one person NDS chooses not to listen to the most.
"The way I see it, HJP serves his role as the second lead--- someone who hinders the main lead couple. But not through his charms or anything that you see on the surface, it's deeper than that. He has always been someone giving harsh critiques of people with the intention of helping them and NDS is a victim of this. Though it might've felt like HJP crushed NDS's spirit, if you think about it, just like how it was with SDM, NDS wouldn't have ever gotten to his place with 2STO and his improved confidence if it wasn't for his competitiveness of HJP. HJP is more successful than him and he used HJP as a sort of motivation to not only be with SDM but also gain his self-confidence and self-worth. For both the main leads, HJP was a mentor to get to where they are. And we see why NDS is suited for SDM towards the end of ep. 15 (and probably 16) because he got character development throughout the drama "using" HJP as competition. NDS became a better version of himself and doesn't lack anymore. The screenwriters made him like that at the end of the drama, not the beginning or middle since he needs to mature."
HJP doesn't hinder the main couple, the main couple hinders themselves without HJP's help. In fact it's been shown multiple times how it's actually HJP who is the sole reason the couple is even together. I think a misunderstanding some audience have with HJP is the term success. Everyone keeps saying, oh HJP is successful, and he has a car, a nice watch, a nice apartment. And yet, time and time again, the show has placed emphasis that monetary success is not equal to true happiness/success. In fact the reason this concept is seen by some audience as success is it's prevalence of a success marker in other dramas. But in this one, money is not being used as a marker, true love is. HJP even says it in Ep. 15.
Using a person, HJP, as competition to achieve something is contradictory to the assessment of character growth. FYI. SDM actually shows a clear example of this. All her life, she has treated WIJ as her competition, and that is what drives her, until she fails. It is only when she let go of her competitive nature with WIJ that she finally matured, and her character grew.
"But it would've been cheap on the screenwriter's side if they made HJP an arrogant guy. After all, he is supposed to be how the main leads get their character development. If viewers had something to hate about HJP, then he wouldn't really be a good competition or role model to the main leads, and they would not change to their better selves the way they did now. And though others may disagree, I think this was another good job on the screenwriter's behalf. They made it in a way that he was "mean" enough to make NDS compete with him, but they also made him a likable character. That's how people are sometimes in real life. HJP is a successful man and he got there with hard work and harsh criticism. And he expects the same to be passed on to those he is mentoring. We are so used to seeing successful people like him have faults and a villain side to them. But he doesn't. He's such a lovable guy, who can put aside his professional and personal life. That's why I love him in here. He's a genuinely nice person who has worked hard to get where he is and there isn't anything to hate about him."
And this is exactly the reason people support HJP more than NDS. Because people don't like seeing good people being used like a doormat by SDM. And they don't like people like NDS to punch HJP and be antagonistic, then cry for help from HJP afterwards. It speaks poor volumes on both NDS and SDM for doing it to HJP. What we see instead is that the Main Lead HJP is trying to achieve happiness, and second leads NDS and SDM are hindering him. Start Up then becomes about the journey of HJP, and the trials he has to go through in the form of SDM and NDS.
"Let's say that HJP DID have a bad aspect of him that made viewers and other characters hate him. Wouldn't it be so easy for NDS to use that against HJP and win SDM's love? Do you see where I'm going with this? It would've been so easy for NDS and SDM to be together, and if HJP did have a bad side, the main leads would've lost an amazing role model that they could've matured from. That's the greatness of his character: he serves as a second male lead and a little bit like a villain but also a friend/mentor in need. That's why it's good that HJP is the perfect guy. Knowing that HJP can divide how professional and personal life and knowing how successful he is, NDS worked hard to get to his level and be as confident as him, aka not feeling inferior anymore as mentioned in ep. 15."
No, the reason the love triangle has never been a proper one is because HJP is never given the chance to be a proper competitor, contrary to what other people believe. If this has been a proper love triangle, there wouldn't be as many sore feelings as HJP got a proper chance, and she still chose NDS, but that is not the case. And, pretty sure nobody considers HJP a villain, even for a second.
In fact, there has been zero barriers to SDM and NDS love, but SDM and NDS themselves. SDM and NDS's relationship has been written too much like a Mary Sue, a literary device that is losing relevance in 2020.
"And finally, as for HJP's love life. It breaks my heart that SDM doesn't end up with him. He has had a hard childhood and now, he cannot get the girl he likes. This is the aspect that's splitting viewers and I totally understand, I was split too and this is the one part I wish the screenwriters can do something about. Even though I don't want HJP to be the bad guy, I hope he gets somewhat of a happy ending. If not, I think I'll be fine too because he made the girl he likes a better self of her and was there with her through some happy moments in life. That's just sometimes how our stories turnout. Even in real life. That's just what life is I guess. I know this is fictional and is supposed to be an escape from reality but considering how the drama is about startups it's going to get real with the characters as well."
This seems contradictory based on what you wrote, FYI.
I think we have been looking at this all wrong. It's never been about HJP being honest with his feelings, or NDS being honest with SDM. The story has always been about SDM finally being honest with herself.
We assume that SDM was a cruel woman for three years for leading HJP. But what if, that is not the case. The reason that for three years SDM was not able to let HJP go, and the reason she feels awkward around her, is because she hasn't yet been honest with herself and admit her growing feelings for him.
Its very telling in Ep. 15, that she still doesn't know why she likes NDS, how she was still looking for a sign of whether she should be with NDS. The bid for the smart city, is a symbolism of being with NDS or not. And for the first time the audience is starting to see SDM's doubt.
Throughout the show, there is a lot of physical touch between NDS and SDM, touching her shoulders, kissing, touching her hair and etc... While HJP and SDM are NEVER been shown, awake, to physically touch each other. But in that one scene in Ep. 15, SDM catches HJP, it's even slowed down. This is the first time they touch each other knowingly. HJP even has time to look at her.
At the beginning of Ep. 15 there are mentions of ghost that could completely stop or confuse the algorithms of Tarzan. I see this as a symbolism of how Tarzan represents SDM and NDS love. And how the "Ghost" of sdm's past, IE. the memories she shared with HJP, will cause the smooth sailing of Tarzan (SDM and NDS Love) to stop unexpectedly.
Also, I noticed how everything from the past is slowly coming true. In episode 1, SDM's dad promised Halmoni he would get Ae Hyun and WIJ back, and give her a building. In the present, Ae Hyun and WIJ have come back to the family, and Ae Hyun has leased a commercial space for Grandma. SDM even uses the dad's name as the name of her company, ensuring that the father, even in spirit, has come back home as well. The only thing missing is the boy whom she shared the most parts of herself, HJP.
The reunification of SDM past is slowly coming true, and it's only missing one vital piece now, HJP.
Now, it's up to SDM to be honest with herself, and be the one to make the first move.
Ok. time for one last prediction before the last episode. Apologies to the 1% nation if I give you more hope!
I am just thinking and going back to the letters. Because Young SDM and Young HJP never meet, the letters were never her knight in shining armor. Instead, the letters represented to both HJP and SDM, comfort. It gave them someone to vent to, someone to share their happiness and dreams with. More important that a pen pal or a boyfriend/girlfriend, the connection of SDM and HJP through the letters has always felt more like friendship. I would even say that SDM's best friend is HJP. Nobody understands SDM more than HJP, and he has shown this consistently with how he acts for her betterment, without her asking for it. If you watch all the HJP and SDM scenes, as little as they were, don't you get the feeling they are best friends more than anything? They talk so comfortably, so casually, she shows him her inner most weaknesses. She even tells HJP about her feelings of love for NDS, as painful as it was to hear for HJP, this just goes to show she really values his friendship.
It's interesting that in the present, their pen pal relationship has been replaced by a mentor/mentee relationship. Without SDM knowing the truth, she already felt a kinship with HJP. The number of times she wanted to share good news with HJP, or bad news, all reminded me of the letters they wrote each other 15 years ago. The number of times she is antsy in contacting him, finding him. It's the same feelings she had whenever she saw his letters in the birdbox. It's an emotion she cannot explain. She goes the extra mile for him, but she doesn't' know why. It is only when he leaves her side, that she will realize a big part of her heart is missing, and the answer to why she is always looking for him, and why she always values his advice, will become clear.
Also, we very clearly see that when NDS points out all his faults, and ask why SDM ask she likes him, she is at a clear lost for words. In fact, notice how her eyes are looking everywhere but at NDS. She gives NDS a nonsensical answer, and because NDS is so insecure, desperate, and in love with her, he would have accepted any answer. If SDM had repeated, because of your big hands, for NDS that would have been enough.
I think another important point we should consider is that NDS has never been one to believe in fate. He eavesdrops for information a lot of times, he doesn't believe in superstitions, he cheated on his test when he was young, and in Ep. 15, he gets his own wish rather than let SDM find it. What this tells me is that NDS is someone who doesn't leave things to chance, he doesn't believe in leaving things to fate.
Compare this to SDM and HJP. Both are huge believers of fate. We often see SDM praying, hoping for signs, or divine intervention. In Ep. 15 she is hoping for a sign from the tarot reading app. And she hopes for a sign by finding NDS wish as a deciding factor of when to bid or not. HJP also waits for signs, the right moment, to act. He only acts on his feelings when Yong Sil gives him a good fortune. This shows that both HJP and SDM believes in fate.
With this in mind, I feel that NDS, someone who is forcing destiny, will finally be strike down by fate itself. And SDM will rebuke his proposal in lieu of her real soul mate HJP.
With this in mind, I feel the following things will happen in episode 16.
I feel that when SST wins the contract, the first person SDM feels like telling the good news, is not NDS but rather HJP. This reminds me of the drama Jealousy Incarnate where GHJ wanted to tell JJS character the good news before the other guy. I think a similar scene will occur. She will start to realize the the first person she wants to tell when things are good or bad is HJP. And this will make her realize her feelings for him, and he will turn down NDS proposal. In episode 15, HJP says, it hurts a lot right now, and that's how I know that I genuinely liked you. I think in Ep. 16 SDM will start to feel this pain, and that's when she will begin to realize she has feelings for HJP also.
Also I want to remind everyone, SDM is actually able to verbalize what she likes about HJP. Fake or otherwise, the feelings were real, and she knew exactly the reason she fell for him. All the times she described fake Dosan, were the manifestations of why she loves HJP.
With NDS, she doesn't know.
Also notice that HJP in his car with fortune plant and letters, what is surrounding his car? It is cherry blossom leaves from the look of it. The same leaves that has always surrounded the love of Young HJP and Young SDM in the first episode. And HJP getting both the fortune plant and the letters means, he will be getting SDM back as well.
HJP does not know it yet, but the winds of fate has started to blow his way.
News 
I guess we know who is flying away from this mess :((((
There is a difference :) Subtle as it may be.
If they wanted to increase HJP's prominence, they could, I don't know increase his airtime, instead of decreasing it, LOL :)
So let me add this line. HJP arrives too late as NDS has saved the day. Through the door HJP can see SDM and NDS kissing passionately for 2 minutes.
Writer-nim, for your next drama, I suggest you use a map.
For me personally it went downhill after Ep. 3. And i'm only invested in the happiness of HJP.
The storylines of SDM and NDS was pretty obvious at around episode 6-7. So it kind felt like a bore to watch predictable scenes get acted out.
The started to lose complexity. And the extended love triangle left most viewers feeling empty.
After a brief spike, TV ratings are dropping again.
"NDS's character development isn't over yet and it's getting there. Besides being entangled in SDM's life, he has his own issues. He never felt worth it and what people praised him for have been his biggest guilts - one of them being the Math Olympiad contest. Since he cheated on the contest, he's always been feeling like he isn't living up to what people knew him for and felt like a loser. And even after HJP met him, he was told that he was a failure and his company wasn't worth investing in (I'm not mad at HJP here and I'll explain why this is important)."
I disagree, NDS character will not develop, until he stops being rewarded for his mistakes. It's all a matter of perspective, the problems, hindrances that NDS sees are actually not true barriers. They are artificial manifestations of his own mind, and thus just like a flight simulator, can only give him a modicum of experience for the real thing. But so far, the real barriers have never visualized, instead, most of his so called "trials" are met with reward instead. So he is not getting proper character growth, in fact it has emboldened him on the truth of his actions.
All these failures like cheating on the math test, getting SST acqhired and etc... has never been punished, he has reaped the rewards of his mistakes. So, a child, who never realizes how wrong he is, is going to keep doing those mistakes. The only character who was calling NDS on his mistakes was HJP, but HJP is the one person NDS chooses not to listen to the most.
"The way I see it, HJP serves his role as the second lead--- someone who hinders the main lead couple. But not through his charms or anything that you see on the surface, it's deeper than that. He has always been someone giving harsh critiques of people with the intention of helping them and NDS is a victim of this. Though it might've felt like HJP crushed NDS's spirit, if you think about it, just like how it was with SDM, NDS wouldn't have ever gotten to his place with 2STO and his improved confidence if it wasn't for his competitiveness of HJP. HJP is more successful than him and he used HJP as a sort of motivation to not only be with SDM but also gain his self-confidence and self-worth. For both the main leads, HJP was a mentor to get to where they are. And we see why NDS is suited for SDM towards the end of ep. 15 (and probably 16) because he got character development throughout the drama "using" HJP as competition. NDS became a better version of himself and doesn't lack anymore. The screenwriters made him like that at the end of the drama, not the beginning or middle since he needs to mature."
HJP doesn't hinder the main couple, the main couple hinders themselves without HJP's help. In fact it's been shown multiple times how it's actually HJP who is the sole reason the couple is even together. I think a misunderstanding some audience have with HJP is the term success. Everyone keeps saying, oh HJP is successful, and he has a car, a nice watch, a nice apartment. And yet, time and time again, the show has placed emphasis that monetary success is not equal to true happiness/success. In fact the reason this concept is seen by some audience as success is it's prevalence of a success marker in other dramas. But in this one, money is not being used as a marker, true love is. HJP even says it in Ep. 15.
Using a person, HJP, as competition to achieve something is contradictory to the assessment of character growth. FYI. SDM actually shows a clear example of this. All her life, she has treated WIJ as her competition, and that is what drives her, until she fails. It is only when she let go of her competitive nature with WIJ that she finally matured, and her character grew.
"But it would've been cheap on the screenwriter's side if they made HJP an arrogant guy. After all, he is supposed to be how the main leads get their character development. If viewers had something to hate about HJP, then he wouldn't really be a good competition or role model to the main leads, and they would not change to their better selves the way they did now. And though others may disagree, I think this was another good job on the screenwriter's behalf. They made it in a way that he was "mean" enough to make NDS compete with him, but they also made him a likable character. That's how people are sometimes in real life. HJP is a successful man and he got there with hard work and harsh criticism. And he expects the same to be passed on to those he is mentoring. We are so used to seeing successful people like him have faults and a villain side to them. But he doesn't. He's such a lovable guy, who can put aside his professional and personal life. That's why I love him in here. He's a genuinely nice person who has worked hard to get where he is and there isn't anything to hate about him."
And this is exactly the reason people support HJP more than NDS. Because people don't like seeing good people being used like a doormat by SDM. And they don't like people like NDS to punch HJP and be antagonistic, then cry for help from HJP afterwards. It speaks poor volumes on both NDS and SDM for doing it to HJP. What we see instead is that the Main Lead HJP is trying to achieve happiness, and second leads NDS and SDM are hindering him. Start Up then becomes about the journey of HJP, and the trials he has to go through in the form of SDM and NDS.
"Let's say that HJP DID have a bad aspect of him that made viewers and other characters hate him. Wouldn't it be so easy for NDS to use that against HJP and win SDM's love? Do you see where I'm going with this? It would've been so easy for NDS and SDM to be together, and if HJP did have a bad side, the main leads would've lost an amazing role model that they could've matured from. That's the greatness of his character: he serves as a second male lead and a little bit like a villain but also a friend/mentor in need. That's why it's good that HJP is the perfect guy. Knowing that HJP can divide how professional and personal life and knowing how successful he is, NDS worked hard to get to his level and be as confident as him, aka not feeling inferior anymore as mentioned in ep. 15."
No, the reason the love triangle has never been a proper one is because HJP is never given the chance to be a proper competitor, contrary to what other people believe. If this has been a proper love triangle, there wouldn't be as many sore feelings as HJP got a proper chance, and she still chose NDS, but that is not the case. And, pretty sure nobody considers HJP a villain, even for a second.
In fact, there has been zero barriers to SDM and NDS love, but SDM and NDS themselves. SDM and NDS's relationship has been written too much like a Mary Sue, a literary device that is losing relevance in 2020.
"And finally, as for HJP's love life. It breaks my heart that SDM doesn't end up with him. He has had a hard childhood and now, he cannot get the girl he likes. This is the aspect that's splitting viewers and I totally understand, I was split too and this is the one part I wish the screenwriters can do something about. Even though I don't want HJP to be the bad guy, I hope he gets somewhat of a happy ending. If not, I think I'll be fine too because he made the girl he likes a better self of her and was there with her through some happy moments in life. That's just sometimes how our stories turnout. Even in real life. That's just what life is I guess. I know this is fictional and is supposed to be an escape from reality but considering how the drama is about startups it's going to get real with the characters as well."
This seems contradictory based on what you wrote, FYI.
We assume that SDM was a cruel woman for three years for leading HJP. But what if, that is not the case. The reason that for three years SDM was not able to let HJP go, and the reason she feels awkward around her, is because she hasn't yet been honest with herself and admit her growing feelings for him.
Its very telling in Ep. 15, that she still doesn't know why she likes NDS, how she was still looking for a sign of whether she should be with NDS. The bid for the smart city, is a symbolism of being with NDS or not. And for the first time the audience is starting to see SDM's doubt.
Throughout the show, there is a lot of physical touch between NDS and SDM, touching her shoulders, kissing, touching her hair and etc... While HJP and SDM are NEVER been shown, awake, to physically touch each other. But in that one scene in Ep. 15, SDM catches HJP, it's even slowed down. This is the first time they touch each other knowingly. HJP even has time to look at her.
At the beginning of Ep. 15 there are mentions of ghost that could completely stop or confuse the algorithms of Tarzan. I see this as a symbolism of how Tarzan represents SDM and NDS love. And how the "Ghost" of sdm's past, IE. the memories she shared with HJP, will cause the smooth sailing of Tarzan (SDM and NDS Love) to stop unexpectedly.
Also, I noticed how everything from the past is slowly coming true. In episode 1, SDM's dad promised Halmoni he would get Ae Hyun and WIJ back, and give her a building. In the present, Ae Hyun and WIJ have come back to the family, and Ae Hyun has leased a commercial space for Grandma. SDM even uses the dad's name as the name of her company, ensuring that the father, even in spirit, has come back home as well. The only thing missing is the boy whom she shared the most parts of herself, HJP.
The reunification of SDM past is slowly coming true, and it's only missing one vital piece now, HJP.
Now, it's up to SDM to be honest with herself, and be the one to make the first move.
I am just thinking and going back to the letters. Because Young SDM and Young HJP never meet, the letters were never her knight in shining armor. Instead, the letters represented to both HJP and SDM, comfort. It gave them someone to vent to, someone to share their happiness and dreams with. More important that a pen pal or a boyfriend/girlfriend, the connection of SDM and HJP through the letters has always felt more like friendship. I would even say that SDM's best friend is HJP. Nobody understands SDM more than HJP, and he has shown this consistently with how he acts for her betterment, without her asking for it. If you watch all the HJP and SDM scenes, as little as they were, don't you get the feeling they are best friends more than anything? They talk so comfortably, so casually, she shows him her inner most weaknesses. She even tells HJP about her feelings of love for NDS, as painful as it was to hear for HJP, this just goes to show she really values his friendship.
It's interesting that in the present, their pen pal relationship has been replaced by a mentor/mentee relationship. Without SDM knowing the truth, she already felt a kinship with HJP. The number of times she wanted to share good news with HJP, or bad news, all reminded me of the letters they wrote each other 15 years ago. The number of times she is antsy in contacting him, finding him. It's the same feelings she had whenever she saw his letters in the birdbox. It's an emotion she cannot explain. She goes the extra mile for him, but she doesn't' know why. It is only when he leaves her side, that she will realize a big part of her heart is missing, and the answer to why she is always looking for him, and why she always values his advice, will become clear.
Also, we very clearly see that when NDS points out all his faults, and ask why SDM ask she likes him, she is at a clear lost for words. In fact, notice how her eyes are looking everywhere but at NDS. She gives NDS a nonsensical answer, and because NDS is so insecure, desperate, and in love with her, he would have accepted any answer. If SDM had repeated, because of your big hands, for NDS that would have been enough.
I think another important point we should consider is that NDS has never been one to believe in fate. He eavesdrops for information a lot of times, he doesn't believe in superstitions, he cheated on his test when he was young, and in Ep. 15, he gets his own wish rather than let SDM find it. What this tells me is that NDS is someone who doesn't leave things to chance, he doesn't believe in leaving things to fate.
Compare this to SDM and HJP. Both are huge believers of fate. We often see SDM praying, hoping for signs, or divine intervention. In Ep. 15 she is hoping for a sign from the tarot reading app. And she hopes for a sign by finding NDS wish as a deciding factor of when to bid or not. HJP also waits for signs, the right moment, to act. He only acts on his feelings when Yong Sil gives him a good fortune. This shows that both HJP and SDM believes in fate.
With this in mind, I feel that NDS, someone who is forcing destiny, will finally be strike down by fate itself. And SDM will rebuke his proposal in lieu of her real soul mate HJP.
With this in mind, I feel the following things will happen in episode 16.
I feel that when SST wins the contract, the first person SDM feels like telling the good news, is not NDS but rather HJP. This reminds me of the drama Jealousy Incarnate where GHJ wanted to tell JJS character the good news before the other guy. I think a similar scene will occur. She will start to realize the the first person she wants to tell when things are good or bad is HJP. And this will make her realize her feelings for him, and he will turn down NDS proposal. In episode 15, HJP says, it hurts a lot right now, and that's how I know that I genuinely liked you. I think in Ep. 16 SDM will start to feel this pain, and that's when she will begin to realize she has feelings for HJP also.
Also I want to remind everyone, SDM is actually able to verbalize what she likes about HJP. Fake or otherwise, the feelings were real, and she knew exactly the reason she fell for him. All the times she described fake Dosan, were the manifestations of why she loves HJP.
With NDS, she doesn't know.
Also notice that HJP in his car with fortune plant and letters, what is surrounding his car? It is cherry blossom leaves from the look of it. The same leaves that has always surrounded the love of Young HJP and Young SDM in the first episode. And HJP getting both the fortune plant and the letters means, he will be getting SDM back as well.
HJP does not know it yet, but the winds of fate has started to blow his way.