timystic

Is everyone just ok with the casual anti-black racism at the beginning of the show?

I'm not a fan of the way it's more of a soap opera than a historical drama, and will be dropping it most likely because of that. I also think it doesn't really do justice to how powerful and cunning Empress Gi actually was.

BUT I don't get why you're complaining about the FL "cheating" when the emperor in all these shows has multiple wives / concubines? And that includes the MLs of this show and many others. Are men allowed to sleep with lots of women but not the other way round in your moral compass?

Also "simp" is a horrible word which is largely meaningless imho. I hate shows where the FL has to give up her whole life for a ML because of so-called love. Because that's not love - that's codependency.

I mean, obviously it's heavily dramatised and fictionalised. But she was an incredibly powerful woman who held her place in a very patriarchal society. The love triangle is not based in reality - you're right - but she certainly wasn't a "nice" person. She was pretty much hated by Goryeo and the Ming dynasty too (who defeated the Yuan Empire). She was also a concubine of low status who managed to climb her way to Empress despite everything being against her.

This is an interesting read: https://chinachannel.lareviewofbooks.org/2018/06/15/redeeming-empress-gi/

Ok, but that's not the story here? She's trying to survive in a world which would easily kill her. If you actually read about her real life you'd understand. Oh and also read about how harems work. For a non-Moghul in the Yuan dynasty she achieved remarkable things. Obviously - like all empires - it's covered in blood, deceit and betrayal. Because that's life.

I'm guessing history isn't your forte? It's based on a true story...

I'm guessing you didn't follow the smear campaign against Liu Yuning when AJTL came out? Because that specifically targeted him for not being attractive... Though how, in either case, makes no sense to me.

I'm on the second episode and so confused. Who is which prince? What logic or reasoning does the FL have to justify blaming the Crown Prince? I know he's pretending, but how can the ML be a Crown Prince if he is seen as disabled? And who is the third prince? And if the FL's family were killed why is she talking to her father? Shouldn't he be dead too?

I know minis don't make sense, but this is more ridiculous than most.

I'm convinced that the reason this is rated so low here and on douban is because it is women-led strategizing. There's a lot of male-led ones which haven't faced the same amount of criticism despite the complex amount of characters, poor acting by the leads, etc.

Do you why they were cut? I can't seem to find any info on this.

Wow. 6 episodes in and already this drama has got my brain jumping. It's a little hard to follow at the beginning, but each episode reveals a little more - like a flower unfurling from bud.

Liu Shishi is as fabulous as ever too.

First episode and currently wishing this was GL, because the chemistry between Luo Ling Yu and Zhou Yang Ling is sizzling.

Likewise

Thank you. I just like to know what I'm getting into.in advance so I can prepare - especially with miscommunication tropes / angst.

I just watched several episodes of angst (just finished ep 20). The comments only talk about healing, which is my issue.

Angst occurs when the FL doesn't ask about the ML's child. When she kisses him but rejects him. When the friends need to explain the mains past relationship because apparently they can't communicate with each other.

Read my initial post more clearly.

I still don't understand why every romance has to be plagued with couples who don't know how to communicate honestly and openly. I don't think I was prepared for this level of angst based on the comments below.

How many pairs of glasses does HSY have?

I'm on episode 20, and trying to figure out whether to continue. The romance is dry and the actors lack chemistry - but mostly I don't see where the plot is going?

I tend to only drop dramas in a rage quit kind of way, or if I find them uncapitivating... So this is kind of new. I'm just not sure if the rest of the drama is worth the hours as there seems to be no big reveal or plot direction.

The clothing is more 1980 than 1890. It feels really anachronistic in a way that's really disorientating.

I'm a big fan of focussing on telling stories about people who experience sexual assault and abuse as survivors rather than victims. Being a survivor is about agency and power rather than pity of forever being treated like a disempowered victim. The plot change (and the way SY responds in his messages) makes the story focus on her victimhood rather than the fact that she is fighting back.

My argument isn't about whether she is believable or not, but about what story they chose to tell and how that impacted the construction of her character and the plot - a drama is not real life, it is a social medium through which we share stories.

Unless the next few episodes really address the possible RAD or Avoidant Personality Disorder or definite PTSD, I think your view of making the character more complex falls through because it will turn into a story of man saves woman without the healing curve that exists in the original novel. And in my experience, a lot of dramas tend to use romantic love as magical healing dust.

I just feel a lot of the change was discordant to everything that had been built up for 20 episodes (which was largely in line with the novel) - like her quitting journalism, or the lack of empathy she has for SY, or even the trust she has built around her friends and mentors.

In essence, this change isn't about creating more complexity but actually completely changes the character of the FL. At the moment, the only reasons I can find for the narrative change is that it makes the reconnection moment that more dramatic, it shifts it back into a typical male-saves-female romance plot, and it allows the drama to visually explore WYF's traumatic past through SY's travels which makes it all the more dramatic.

She is denied growth if you compare it to the novel, where she doesn't run away but instead just protects SY by not telling him things. And then, instead of making SY a knight in shining armour, she goes to him in Yihe to apologise about what happened after high school and explain why she went to Yihe in the first place. It means she makes the intiative to trust him rather than him having to save her from herself.

This plot change makes her run away again which means she repeats the mistake she made out of school (when she felt she had no support) and runs away again. This destroys all the growth she made in the 20 odd episodes before.

No-one expects her to be bubbly or one-note, but repetition is not complexity.

I don't hate her character in the drama, nor do I not understand the meaning behind it. I just feel like it kills her agency and growth in favour of making her more pitiable.