plor20:
5 hours ago
 AH :
Thank you, both of you, for these details.
Thank you for all the excerpts too. It was enlightening. XD

You're welcome. ^^

 H19279:
For Jingers, they thought so. They called XL manupulative and considered his acceptance of the bug is a kind of tracking method to keep WXL in check because he needed her blood for healing etc...

It's like they didn't read the book or watch the drama at all.  They completely miss the main requirement of the LOVE Bug, that the people have to be in love with each other.  Nor do they understand, it's about love and connection, not 'keeping someone in check.'  If one of them is worried about keeping the other in check, then it becomes the fatal Heartbreak Bug and can kill both of them.

And XL didn't need her blood for healing.  The dude has nine lives.  He survived centuries before, and most of the time after, he got the bug without her healing blood.


 H19279:
Who had to suffer after the transferring of the bug? XL lost at least 3 lives (offically; if he lost life to wake XY up and saved Jing, he could have lost 5 lives). He suffered the same heartache for decades. He might have the same sleeping issue (he knew she had it). He had only 1 time of blood while getting injured in Xuan Yuan (in my opinion he delibrately went to her room because he wanted to use that way to reveal his identity). The other time he sucked her blood was because he got badly injured after saving her from the whirlpool. And it was XY who begged him to stay with her there and wanted him to get the blood for healing. Those Jingers still believe that XL took advantage and wanted to control XY until the last chapter of the book

Yes, exactly.  Who suffered the most because of the Love Bug?   Who actually got manipulated into doing things he wouldn't have done (like not killing CX repeatedly)?  If he was using the Love Bug for an advantage and to control XY, he was doing an extremely poor job of it, given he didn't get the girl -- or her blood -- all while saving Jing's life repeatedly and making their 'happy ending' possible.

@kokuto,

They completely miss the main requirement of the LOVE Bug, that the people have to be in love with each other

they said the bug was mysterious and she could plant it on CX. Thus it didn’t need mutual love. XL one direction love is enough to plant since the most critical requirement is willingness .

I think you saw their comment about “the bugs recognized as old friend “ 

 H19279:
37 minutes ago
 AH :
In the first 60 years of her sentence, she and Chi You write letters to each other. Eventually Ah Heng stops writing, but Chi You continues to send her letters. 
they exchanged letter. Ah Heng spent more than 20 year to grow mullberry, made silk and weaved and made a special robe for Chi you. His signature red robe was made by Ah Heng. Chi You returned to Jade mountain once during the first 60 years and Ah Heng gave it to him. She said if he wore the robe, she would come to see him every year in the spring festival in Jiuli. 

Yes, although she originally down-played her role in making the robe and it's significance as part of her denial / unwillingness to directly acknowledge her feelings for Chi You. 

Ah Heng putting so much time and effort into making the robe and sending it to Chi You, but then not overtly acknowledging its obvious significance / meaning reminds me a lot of XY putting so much time and effort into making the ice crystal ball and sending it to XL, but then sending it with a note that veils its obvious significance / meaning. 

The agreement to meet Chi You once a year for as long as he continues to wear her robe comes later in the story, when Ah Heng has progressed and acknowledged her feelings for Chi You more directly. 


 H19279:

 AH :
After 60 years (once Ah Heng has recovered from injuries she previously sustained), Chi You resolves to jailbreak / kidnap Ah Heng from Jade Mountain, but she chooses to leave with Shao Hao instead. 
When Ah Heng and Chi You was about to leave Jade Mountain, Shao Hao came their and declared clearly with the Royal Mother that he came to pick up his fiancee. Ah Heng had no choice but to follow Shao Hao. Shao Hao came there to pick up Ah Heng because he lost the game to Qing Yang. They fought each other and the loser had to pick up Ah Heng. When Ah Heng got home, Qing Yang created heavy snow to make frozen mulberry fruit for her despite serious injury. 

If I remember correctly, Chi You knocked Ah Heng out and tied her up with a vine. He was already in the process of taking Ah Heng away from Jade Mountain when Shao Hao arrived, and Ah Heng chose to break free of his bindings and went back to Jade Mountain to meet Shao Hao (leaving Chi You behind to do so) and then ended up leaving with Shao Hao. She had good reasons for doing so, but it seems to me that she made a clear choice to leave Chi You and to go to Shao Hao at that point. Not because she had romantic feelings for Shao Hao or anything like that. But at that point she wasn't willing to choose to go with Chi You, regardless of the consequences. 


 H19279:
Chi You came to Cao Yun peak to find Ah Heng. Chang Yi helped Ah Heng to distract Qing Yang when she hid him in her bed. Later Chi you fought agaist qing Yang and got injured. Ah Heng followed him but stopped by Chang Yi. However, he let her go after she begged him. And then the poison in Chi You's body leaked out and endangered his life etc...

Althought she didn't confessed to Chi You that she did many thing because of her love, what she did showed her care and love. She told him that she owned his life so only she could take his life. she poison herself etc.

I agree that her actions at that point betrayed her true feelings. When Chi You was in danger, she went to great lengths to help him. 

But at that point she was still denying / avoiding acknowledging her feelings. So I don't view the actions she took to help Chi You survive at that point as Ah Heng "committing" to her love for him.


 H19279:
Before Ah Heng died because of Zhu Rong's fire and gravity attaction by YuYuan, Chi you loved her but he also doubted her love, he was always alerted and afraid that she used his love to kill him since he was the enermy of her family. After her death, he regretted and when she was reincarnated as a magical stone (they sensed her soul inside), Chi You did his best to resurrect her and fully committed.

"Chi You stared at Ah Heng, "I was born in a deserted mountain, grew up among wild animals, my family background, education and demeanours are not comparable to Shao Hao, nor can I be like him, giving you status. the most noble, let you become the queen of a country, making the whole world respect you. If you follow me, you will definitely be scolded by people, but... If you still don't want to remember everything about me, I will give you the only thing I have." Chi You punched his chest hard and said loudly, "It's my heart!""

I have not been able to find much in English about this part of the story, so thank you for those details.

That said, I feel like this is in line with what I was saying above. Ah Heng did love Chi You, but she didn't "commit" to that love in the sense that she initially denied and avoided it, later hid it, and never made it her top priority. It sounds like Chi You himself doubted her feelings, even though he later regretted those doubts. 

I do believe that Chi You was more committed than Ah Heng. Although he wasn't willing to renege on his promise to Yu Wang or to abandon Sheng Nong to avoid facing her on the battlefield. 

That also reminds me of the dynamic between XL and XY in some ways. XY tried so hard to deny and avoid her feelings for XL. In chapter 32, her mind refused to even contemplate those feelings, even when she was under the thrall of XL's compulsion. Whereas XL didn't try to deny or avoid his feelings for XY, at least in his own mind. His suggestion to transfer the Lover's Bug and his acceptance of the Lovers' Bug is evidence of that. And he was willing to make XY a top priority. But he wasn't willing to abandon Gong Gong and the Sheng Nong remnant army to avoid being her family's enemy. 


 H19279:
Although Ah Heng had to marry Shao Hao (she tried to run away but Chi You didn't come because of Jan Emperor's death), she tried to get out of the marriage. She and Shao Hao got alliance agreement from the first day of marriage. 

She initially wanted to avoid the marriage and tried to meet with Chi You as promised, but wasn't she convinced by her brother to go through with the marriage in order to protect the people she cared about? She needed to have the status of being the Emperor and Empress' daughter in order to marry Shao Hao. If she broke off the engagement, the Yellow Emperor would no longer have a strategic reason to continue keeping Lei Zhu in the position of his official Empress and he could raise his favourite wife, Consort Yu, to that position instead. Which would lower the positions of Ah Heng's mother and brothers and put them in danger. 

On top of that, if she chose to marry Chi You that would likely put Chi You in danger too. 


 H19279:
Their love story got a lot of obstacles. Many times, it was as if they could have be together, blessed by some of the relatives. Then big event happened and cut off their chance. That was why she said so in the excerp that you quoted. They could not cut off their family connection, their responsibility with the country men (for her and him). 

Agreed, there were many obstacles. 

IMO, Ah Heng had many reasons for not fully committing to her love for Chi You. Arguably more reasons than XY had for not committing to her love for XL. 


 H19279:
Ah Heng took medicine to delay the delivery so that it made XY's birth match with her time with Shao Hao.

Interesting. I guess that medicine was the thing that caused Ah Heng to be in a coma for the first year of XY's life?


 H19279:
When Chi you was back, XY was 3 year old. He was jealous and wondered why Ah Heng was back to Shao Hao and had kid with Shao Hao. But then he still wanted to be with her, willing to forgive her.

This feels consistent with the idea of Chi You being more committed than Ah Heng. 

 H19279:
When the evil fox demon kidnapped XY, Ah Heng asked him to search for XY (Chi You came to Xuan Yuan for Yun Xang's wedding). At that point he still thought that XY was Shao Hao's daughter but he still did it for her.

Wait, wait, wait. What? I thought Ah Heng and Chi You were "dead" (but really only partly dead and hiding in the cherry blossom forest inside the desert) and Yun Xang was definitely dead by the time the nine-tailed fox captured XY? He captured XY at least 90 years after Ah Heng left her on Jade Mountain (70 years on Jade Mountain + 20 years shunned and alone in the mountains before being captured). How could Ah Heng have asked Chi You to search for XY at that point?

And when XY described her escape, it was something that she managed single-handedly with no mention of Chi You. So if Ah Heng knew that XY had disappeared or was being held captive by an enemy and asked Chi You to look for her but he didn't find her... the two of them still went to battle knowing that their daughter (Chi You knew XY was his daughter by the end of Once Promised) was missing??

Or did the nine-tailed fox capture XY more than once, but with different faces (so XY didn't recognize him the second time he captured her)?

-----

Chapter 9 of LYF:

“That bastard fox demon hated my mom, and not just because my mom’s………friend injured him. It was also because my mom killed my ninth uncle and he was best friends with my ninth uncle. Whenever he thought of my ninth uncle, he would curse my mom with the most vicious loathsome insults. But mom was dead so he could only torture me. I was raised by him for 30 years, tortured by him for 30 years. One night he said that in two more full moon nights then he could eat me. He sang a sad song and got drunk and didn’t shut the cage completely. I had been devising how to run away for 30 years so I opened the cage and came out and secretly poisoned his drink then snuck back in the cage. He didn’t sense anything odd and the second day I tried to get him drunk by purposely mentioning my ninth uncle. He beat me up and started drinking again and ingested the poison that I developed from all the weird things he had been feeding me. He collapsed on the floor and returned to his true fox form. I climbed out the cage and he opened his eyes and looked at me. I picked up a knife and cut off each of his tails. After I cut off a tail, I would show it to him. His entire fox mouth was covered in blood but in his eyes was the sense of release. He closed his eyes and I lit a fire and burned the entire cave down.


 H19279:
And by the end of the book, it revealed that it was Ah Heng tried to attract Chi You first. Chi You always thought that he had lured Ah Heng (all sort of pretending to glue to her in the 2nd encounter). However, Ah Heng told him before his death that she knew everything, she pretended to know nothing. She lured him first.

Yes, in their second meeting, Ah Heng was the one who used a fake reason to approach Chi You first (asking if he knew the way to Buo Fu Castle, even though she already knew the way). 

To me, that serves as proof that Ah Heng was attracted to Chi You from the beginning and that she played a role in their fate /  the creation of their relationship. But I don't interpret this as conveying the idea that Ah Heng was actually the one "luring" or pursuing Chi You throughout the early stages of their relationship. 

-----

Chapter 19 of Volume 2 of Once Promised:

Ah Heng cried out, “Qi Yo, Qi Yo, please hold on. I’m taking you to see our daughter right now. You still haven’t heard her call you daddy.”

Qi Yo weakly murmured, “Okay, I’ll hold on….” as his eyes closed.

Ah Heng tried to be cheerful and chatty. “I’m not silly in the least. You’re so sneaky and think all along that you tricked me? But you never knew that I had a secret I never told you. You’re the one who was actually tricked, not me. Remember our first meeting? Not the meeting I don’t know about, but the real first meeting……”

Qi Yo wanted to tell Ah Heng that he remembered, he remembered every tiny detail about her and imprinted it in his heart. But he used all his strength and didn’t hear his voice speak up. Only Ah Heng’s voice as it gradually got softer and softer.

“It was sunset with the dusk was red rimmed, and you were standing in the desolate mountainside……”

The first time she met Qi Yo it was a red rimmed dusk. He wore all red and his black hair was not tied back as it blew in the wind around him like a wild being. He stood tall and proud in the wilderness staring into the distance. She couldn’t see his face clearly, only his black hair blowing around him giving him a commanding aura of unfettered arrogance.

His form appeared to be stepping on the entire world under his one foot. It was so powerful that Ah Heng was unconsciously attracted to him and walked towards him.

The second he turned around and met her eyes, there was so much emotion contained within and such intensity. She didn’t understand exactly what was going on but she knew her heart skipped a beat for him.

She knew exactly the way to Buo Fu Castle but she couldn’t help herself and walked up to him to ask, “Excuse me sir, can you tell me the way to Buo Fu Castle?” And with that they started their ridiculous and frustrating journey together to Buo Fu Castle.

It wasn’t until many years later that she finally knew what all the intense emotions in Qi Yo’s eyes were conveying. What she thought was their first meeting was actually a reunion to Qi Yo, a reunion after a hundred years and it wasn’t the way he would have wanted it.

If she didn’t approach him then they would have passed each other by. He would be his Sheng Nong Great General. She would be her Gao Xing Empress.

He always thought it was his doing that turned a chance encounter into a lifetime’s fate. He will never know that it was actually she who kept him in her life that first night.

If she could do it all over again, Ah Heng didn’t know if she could ask again. “Excuse me sir, can you tell me the way to Buo Fu Castle?”

“Qi Yo, do you think I should have asked?”

The person on her back didn’t answer her as his arms laid slack around her. Ah Heng’s tears tumbled down but she kept pretending everything was fine as she injected power into his body.


 H19279:
So the biggest difference between Ah Heng's and XY's love story is Ah and Chi You always thought about each other and they stayed truly, committed to their feeling, expressing their love to each other explicitly. On the other hand, XY always tried to avoid admitting her feeling to XL and did her very best to distract herself from the thought of loving him.

I personally see a lot of similarities between Ah Heng's denial, avoiding and hiding of her feelings and XY's denial, avoiding and hiding of her feelings. But at some point Ah Heng does accept her feelings for Chi You and they have a real relationship. I agree that that part is different from XY, even though I think it's noteworthy that Ah Heng did not marry Chi You and continued to hide their relationship from the world until it was exposed. 


 H19279:
Ah Heng fought for being with Chi You. XY did not.

Unfortunately I'm not familiar with all of the parts of the story where Ah Heng fought to be with Chi You. I'm more familiar with the parts where she chose to not fight to be with Chi You. 

IMO, the biggest difference is between Chi You and XL, not Ah Heng and XY. 

Chi You openly pursued Ah Heng from the beginning. He was very consistent and persistent. He wanted Ah Heng to love him and to be with him. 

XL took many steps to hide his feelings from XY. When he took actions that seemed to reveal his feelings, or when XY seemed like she might reveal her feelings, XL would quickly say or do things that were designed to make XY question XL's feelings for her. He intentionally pushed XY away. 

@AH

Or did the nine-tailed fox capture XY more than once, but with different faces (so XY didn't recognize him the second time he captured her)?

the 9 tailed fox demon kidnapped XY twice in her life. first time when she was a kid during Yun Xang’s wedding. it was Chi You cut off one of his tail and gave it to XY. In chapter 4, XY told XL that the 9 tailed fox was actually 8 tailed one. She told CX and YSQ in chapter 9 more detail about the fox demon with 8 tails.

“He should have killed me the moment he caught me. But he was consumed by hatred and greed. He used various special creatures to feed to me, forcing me to eat eat many disgusting things, all so that he could make me nice and plump before eating me. He intended to use my mythical blood to help him recover his lost powers……Oh, I forgot to tell you, he wasn’t a Nine-tailed fox by then, just an eight tail since he got a tail cut off so his powers were severely depleted. He raised me for thirty years and right when he was about to partake of the victory, one day he accidentally got drunk in front of me.” (Chapter 4)

-------------------

He hid me in a remote cave where he built a nest and a cage to raise me in. He said he was the Nine-tailed fox, a hundred years ago my mother’s………friend cut one of his tails off. He was greatly injured and his powers were severely diminished. Because of my special body, he wanted to raise me for tens of years to become the best medicine.” ........................ 

That bastard fox demon hated my mom, and not just because my mom’s………friend injured him. It was also because my mom killed my ninth uncle and he was best friends with my ninth uncle. Whenever he thought of my ninth uncle, he would curse my mom with the most vicious loathsome insults. But mom was dead so he could only torture me.  .........

" I picked up a knife and cut off his eight tails one by one. After I cut off a tail, I would show it to him. His entire fox mouth was covered in blood but in his eyes was the sense of release. He closed his eyes and I lit a fire and burned the entire cave down.” (Chapter 9, the orange text reflected the original text where 8 tails was mentioned)

P/S: XY's ninth uncle asked the 9 tailed fox demon to kidnap XY to force Ah Heng to tell in front of everyone who was XY's real father in order to humilate her and her family (her mom, and brothers)

 AH :
A prison of a kind indeed, but one she agreed to impose on herself. A "prison" that she could have escaped from at any time if she really, really wanted to (as she almost did in chapter 14 - and in chapter 16 she ignores + successfully forces herself to walk away from TSJ, until she remembers that she told CX that she would meet TSJ for CX's sake).

Could she, really?  I mean, the whole tragedy of XY is that her trauma forces her to make these really crappy choices.  If she could escape her trauma so easily, she could have made a life with XL.  But she can't.  She can't escape the prison of the 15 Year Promise and the false hope that Jing holds out, because she's convinced herself that is what she wants the most.  And Jing knowingly manipulates her into that prison and makes sure he shows up and does the minimum to keep her in that prison, whenever she thinks about walking away.

“Xiao Liu….I……I know I am engaged and have no right to say this to you…..and I never dared to….but…….I will call off the engagement, I will call off the engagement! You wait for me for twenty years….no…..no, fifteen years. You give Tu Shan Jing fifteen years, and after fifteen years I’ll give you back a Ye Shi Qi.” 

Xiao Liu asked, “How do you want me to wait?”

“You…..you won’t let another man……into your heart.”

This shows that Jing KNOWS exactly what he's doing.  If he loved her and wasn't trying to imprison her with this 15 Year Promise, he would have simply confessed and not try to bind her to him or make these conditions.


Xiao Liu couldn’t help but smile. “You said everything boils down to a business transaction, so why do I feel like I’m not getting the better end of the bargain here?”

Shi Qi shook her hand. “That doesn’t include love, only love can never be measured by profit or loss. Family love, sibling love, friendship love, romantic love, it seems so easy but is a rare treasure that cannot be bought with any amount of money.”

Even XY recognizes this is a deal and a manipulation, and she's getting screwed.  Jing tries to deny it, but notice, he IS measuring it by profit or loss, cause he's trying to make sure he doesn't lose XY, once she assumes this new life and gender.  And he repeatedly treats her and her love like something that can be bought from both CX and XL.


“I waited for you all night and thought you weren’t coming.”

Xiao Yao said angrily, “If you thought I wasn’t coming, then why keep waiting?”

Jing didn’t know how to answer. If she didn’t come, then he didn’t know where else to go. In this dark deep place, he once experienced the sweetest happiness, but the one who gave him the happiness was Xiao Liu. It wasn’t this girl before him now. If she took back her promise, he would completely understand.

Xiao Yao got on her knees and faced him, her eyes reflecting her anger. “Do you think waiting all night was hard? You have a fiancee! You step out with her all the time together, and then you find any opportunity to remind me of my promise to you. If you don’t trust me, then why ask me to promise? Let me tell you, last night I tried to keep the promise and almost died!”

Xiao Yao shoved Jing hard. I don’t want to play anymore. I take back my promise! You scram back to Qing Qiu and go marry Fang Feng Yi Yang!”

Jing didn’t dare do anything back to her but he also didn’t budge. “I won’t marry her. She doesn’t like me so she likely doesn’t want to marry me either.”

And here even XY realizes and points out that Jing is trying to manipulate her into keeping the promise.  And when called on it, he plays the pitiful victim card.  It's not even, 'I won't marry her because I love you,' but it's 'I won't marry FFYY because she doesn't like my pitiful self.'


Xiao Yao burst out laughing. “Now I know why the young girls are putty in Zhuan Xu’s hands with his honeyed words. Even though I know you’re not telling the truth, I still like hearing it.

“I’m telling the truth, Xiao Yao. I never imagined you would look like this. If I had known you were like this…..even in the dark prison I would have never dared to reveal my greatest wish….” Jing’s back was straight but his head was still lowered, like a tree growing in darkness. “My body, my voice….do you know why I never got my crippled leg healed even knowing I can? Because I know that even when I’m healed, the real injury is inside that no medicine can heal. I can wear clothes to cover up my hideous scars, I can use rare medicine to cure my crippled leg, I can talk less to conceal my voice, I can lie to everyone that I can still the dashing Young Master of Qing Qiu, but I can’t lie to myself……Xiao Yao, I’m not good enough for you! This time, there will be many handsome, smart, physically whole young men…”

And that's how Jing keeps her in this prison.  He tells her what she wants to hear, even if it is a lie, and plays the pity card -- which is yet again another manipulation.  How can she leave her prison when this pitiful man NEEDS her?  How can she ABANDON him, when she's his only hope for love?  And conversely ... This guy is such a loser he'll never leave me.


Xiao Yao smiled. “You have fifteen years, Jing. What are you planning to do?”

“I don’t know, but I know I will come back to you. I’ve promised to listen to you for the rest of my life…..” Jing’s forehead rested on Xiao Yao’s forehead and he prayed, “Please keep your heart for me.”

Xiao Yao’s hands sank into his hair and she grabbed it. “I can tell you’re a sneaky one, even if I want to forget it, you’ll find ways to keep reminding. You say you don’t dare hope, but then you don’t let go either.”

Jing’s voice conveyed his torment, “I….I just cannot…..I know you deserve better, but I cannot…..I’m sorry…..”

Xiao Yao quickly said, “I understand, I understand.”

Jing said in a low voice, “You don’t understand.”

Xiao Yao was honest. “I don’t understand, but I have to try and reassure you.”

There Jing is again with promises he has no idea how to keep, but begging her to keep hers.  And again, even XY realizes he's manipulative -- reminding her of her promise and telling her what she wants to hear, as well as making her responsible for reassuring him and providing his life happiness.  How is she supposed to leave this prison, again?

And Chapter 16 is more of the same.  She tries to walk away from the promise prison, and Jing shows up again, to remind her!  And this time uses his transactions with CX, as well as his usual manipulations.


Xiao Yao said to herself: he’s Tu Shan Jing, not the broken and battered Ye Shi Qi that no one wants.

...

“I’m fine, I just hate you a little.” Every time when she steeled her heart, he always had a way of softening it. Was it because she saved him and took him home that she just couldn’t be heartless with him?

“I’m sorry, I know I shouldn’t appear!” Jing didn’t know what Xiao Yao was thinking, all he knew was that Xiao Yao was very unhappy but earlier she was very happy with Fang Feng Bei.

And again, XY KNOWS what is going on.  She knew that from the very beginning of their relationship, that saving Jing and his 'gifts' of help incurred an obligation on her part.  And Jing once again admits, he's isn't thinking about what makes XY happy, but what makes him happy... and keeps XY in her promise prison.

So no.  I don't think XY can simply escape from the Jing's promise prison, especially given how he works to keep her in there.  Between her fears of abandonment, and the hopeful games and pity parties Jing plays, XY isn't able to free herself anymore than she is able to take the first step and confess her love to XL.


 AH :
A prison that, in the context of her trauma, complexes, and circumstances, seemed to give her some semblance of security. Or maybe hope for future security and simplicity.

It's a false sense of security.  The security of the abused for being abused, because that's what they know as normal.  It's like a long time prisoner, that only feels comfortable in prison, instead of outside and free.  Magnified even more for XY because she has a crippling loneliness that she wants alleviated at any cost. 

I'm pretty sure it isn't about future security and simplicity, when the prison is described thusly:

Darkness like death, silence like death, the most infamous jail cell in the vast wilderness made any prisoner seek death, but to Shi Qi and Xiao Liu, as they talked they didn’t even feel like time was passing. Shi Qi was so grateful that Zhuan Xu locked him up in the same cell as Xiao Liu, and only here did he have the courage to reveal his greatest wish. He even wished now to never leave, he was willing to spend an entire lifetime here with Xiao Liu. 

 AH :
A bit like the unusual feelings that TSJ and WXL had about being locked in the dragon bone prison together. WXL felt that being locked there: (1) simplified complicated things; (2) felt right; and (3) felt calming. She suggested that they never leave. TSJ felt grateful to be locked up in the prison with WXL and wished to never leave.

1,2,3 are a reflection of what FFB proposed when he taught XY archery.  "Why not give up everything and come explore the world with me?   Except one is in the light and is about a life in the world.  Whereas this is hidden, in a tiny space encompassed by a dark prison.

But Shi Qi is grateful to be there where he can reveal his greatest wish and keep XY all to himself for life ... in the death like prison.  Yeah, that's not future security, that's a murder suicide pact.

There's a reason why Tong Hua had child XY spend 30 years in a cage at the hands of a fox demon, with only him for company as he tortured and depowered her and why Tushan Jing is has the traits of a fox demon and is in a cage when he robs XY of choice and freedom and puts her in his promise prison.

 H19279:

@kokuto,

They completely miss the main requirement of the LOVE Bug, that the people have to be in love with each other

they said the bug was mysterious and she could plant it on CX. Thus it didn’t need mutual love. XL one direction love is enough to plant since the most critical requirement is willingness .

I think you saw their comment about “the bugs recognized as old friend “ 

Again, they aren't reading what is actually in the text or what was said in the drama.  The Love Bug was UNSUCCESSFULLY planted on CX.  That's why XL worried about it staying with CX -- an UNSUCCESSFUL planting was plain bad news all around.

Oh, well this is a change.  Before they claimed it was the Friendship Bug.  Now they are claiming it is the Willingness Bug.  It's amazing how they cherry picked the heck out that conversation where the LOVE Bug was explained.  SMH

Yes, I believe that was when Winny claimed the original Chinese text wasn't good enough for her, she preferred the English translations.

 Kokuto:
Oh, well this is a change.  Before they claimed it was the Friendship Bug.

@AH had some exchanges of view about how TH use the word friend with them. So for them, when the word "friend" is used for XL it literally means friendship. @AH pointed out some cases XY also regarded Jing as "friend" in several context; then they replied that if you chose to understand it as literally, you should check the whole 51 chapters :)) Ah then they said TH describled the FL's feeling very straightforward. I gave them the introduction of the first book about the "snake on grass and lines on dust" which stretched thousand miles. Did they claim me disqualifed and liar?

Thank  God that there was still a reasonable Jing fan who said that I am not liar and the text about the writing technique was correct and they should also take them into account when doing the analysis. However, those to made the main content are very consistent with their style of analysis. 

Sometimes I hope I can have a healthy, scientific debate with them using original text to support the points but such hope shattered. 

 nathsketch:

Jingers love to point out the toxicity and the abusive behaviors of Xiang Liu and Cang Xuan, but their hypocrisy when it comes to Jing is astounding.

Not a single one of those characters are flawless, much less “green flags” (I hate this expression so much), but they don’t seem to get it. 

And the very fact that TH deliberately choose to keep him from growing as a character is proof that he remains toxic til the very end.

 H19279:
Sometimes I hope I can have a healthy, scientific debate with them using original text to support the points but such hope shattered.

Nope.  Especially not in the Jing thread.  Don't waste your time there.

 AH :
She initially wanted to avoid the marriage and tried to meet with Chi You as promised, but wasn't she convinced by her brother to go through with the marriage in order to protect the people she cared about?

She still came to Jiuli and waited for Chi You the whole night but he didn't come. She was so desperated. She carved his name hundreds of times on the tree sterm.  Chang Yi showed up in Jiuli and told her the whole picture of her marriage, tried to convince her to progress it. And on her wedding, when they were on the bridge to Gao Xing, Chi You showed up but loss to Shao Hao, he returned her the robe. Ah Heng could not do anything there but she tried to get out of her marriage.

She spent 3 years teaching the people in Gaoxing to grow mulberry and making clothes to have chance to go out. She sent back the robe to Chi You. She came to Jiuli but Chi You did not show up (he actually went there but did not want to meet her). 

If I remember correctly they solved their misunderstanding during Chang Yi's wedding. Yellow Emperor wanted her to be checked by the royal doctor because of no pregnancy after long marriage. Thus Ah Heng and Chi You freed to Jiuli after he gain the legendary map (in the shape of an egg) in Yu Yuan. He gave her half of the egg map. Zhu Ju (?) was sent to follow her by Qing Yang (Ah Heng didn't know it) to steal the other half. Chi You knew about Zhu Ju's action but thought that it was planned by Ah Heng. He misunderstood her miserably. They returned Yu Yuan and Zhu Rong wanted to take advantage to kill Chi You (while he was fighting with Yan Long who lost 1 hand during this fight). It was Ah Heng shielded him and got the magical flame by Zhu Rong. She was burnt from inside and fell into Yu Yuan with Lie Yang. Chi You then realized his mistake of untrusting her. 


 AH :
Before Ah Heng died because of Zhu Rong's fire and gravity attaction by YuYuan, Chi you loved her but he also doubted her love, he was always alerted and afraid that she used his love to kill him since he was the enermy of her family. After her death, he regretted and when she was reincarnated as a magical stone (they sensed her soul inside), Chi You did his best to resurrect her and fully committed.

"Chi You stared at Ah Heng, "I was born in a deserted mountain, grew up among wild animals, my family background, education and demeanours are not comparable to Shao Hao, nor can I be like him, giving you status. the most noble, let you become the queen of a country, making the whole world respect you. If you follow me, you will definitely be scolded by people, but... If you still don't want to remember everything about me, I will give you the only thing I have." Chi You punched his chest hard and said loudly, "It's my heart!""
I have not been able to find much in English about this part of the story, so thank you for those details.


That said, I feel like this is in line with what I was saying above. Ah Heng did love Chi You, but she didn't "commit" to that love in the sense that she initially denied and avoided it, later hid it

Because  Chi You had not trusted her before her 1st death, when she was resurrected, she pretended to lose her memory about him. That was why Chi You kidnapped her to Jiuli and tried to convince her as such. 


 AH :

 H19279:
When Chi you was back, XY was 3 year old. He was jealous and wondered why Ah Heng was back to Shao Hao and had kid with Shao Hao. But then he still wanted to be with her, willing to forgive her.
This feels consistent with the idea of Chi You being more committed than Ah Heng.

 H19279:

If I remember correctly that Chi You got seriously injured in the same event he killed  Qing Yang. It took him 5 years to recover in Bei Ming sea. So what could Ah Heng do in such situation while she was pregnant and her lover killed her brother. She needed to protect XY too. And after that they still reunioned. 

---------------------

After the discussion about Ah Heng-Chi You, I realized one thing that how come that XL and Chi You were so different in expressing their love?

They both have animal instinct, they were very straigtforward and loved freedom. They both were owned great gesture and favor by Sheng Nong headers or general. They were both taught by their saviours and became general for Sheng Nong army, carrying enormous responsibility. However, the way they express their love was opposite. Chi You told Ah Heng that he would take her away, shake off the responsibility after the last battle (to secure the liberation, independence of Sheng Nong from Xuan Yuan). We don't see any XL's sign on any possibility to spare something for his own's happiness.

 H19279:
@AH had some exchanges of view about how TH use the word friend with them. So for them, when the word "friend" is used for XL it literally means friendship. @AH pointed out some cases XY also regarded Jing as "friend" in several context; then they replied that if you chose to understand it as literally, you should check the whole 51 chapters :))

I would love to read these "Friend" threads but don't know how to search the forums. It's such a jungle! But I have my own strong opinions on this word because it holds so much meaning from a cultural side, and if your culture doesn't have this kind inferences, then again, it gets lost in translation.

 Kokuto:
There's a reason why Tong Hua had child XY spend 30 years in a cage at the hands of a fox demon, with only him for company as he tortured and depowered her and why Tushan Jing is has the traits of a fox demon and is in a cage when he robs XY of choice and freedom and puts her in his promise prison.

Thank you for all references to this metaphor. It just continues to strongly support how messed up this whole oath situation is.

 plor20:
There's a reason why Tong Hua had child XY spend 30 years in a cage at the hands of a fox demon, with only him for company as he tortured and depowered her and why Tushan Jing is has the traits of a fox demon and is in a cage when he robs XY of choice and freedom and puts her in his promise prison.
Thank you for all references to this metaphor. It just continues to strongly support how messed up this whole oath situation is.


 Kokuto:
There's a reason why Tong Hua had child XY spend 30 years in a cage at the hands of a fox demon, with only him for company as he tortured and depowered her and why Tushan Jing is has the traits of a fox demon and is in a cage when he robs XY of choice and freedom and puts her in his promise prison.

Another foreshadow image is that Jing used the spider to weave a net for them to rest during the trip (Chapter 36 or 37?). And TH used butterfly to compare with XY several times in the book. So, Jing - the spider trapped the butterfly - XY. They got engaged shortly after the trip

 Kokuto:
I don't think it is oversight on Tong Hua's part.  She wrote XY with those contradictions, IMO, to show how XY deluded and lied to herself to 'protect' herself from facing reality and choices.  It's not that she's stupid.  It's that she chooses not to admit what she knows or sees.

To be fair, not many people are self aware or willing to look at themselves honestly.  It's much easier to blame others, than oneself.

I developed a very strong, unimpressed perception of XY when she became a princess. Despite her leisure, power, and influence, she made some really questionable decisions and knee-jerk reactions based on her trauma.

I'm not going to let her play the trauma card. These feelings are intense because, while I could relate to XY when she was WXL, I couldn't when she became the gilded princess. What happened to the courageous, carefree, kind, and frank WXL? Even XL questioned this, which is why, in their last face-to-face encounter, he coldly told her she is finally the WXL he remembered in Qingshui town.

Have you ever dealt with a person like XY, someone with strong emotional and psychological deficiencies? I ask because it is very exhausting and traumatic. I still have PTSD from it, and reading and watching a protagonist allude to those same traits was alarming. I've also witnessed this same person consistently involving themselves with Jing-like characters, and codependency just throws off our whole family - it's drama after drama.

I am not shy to say that this has a strong influence on my worldview of XY. I would also argue that it's fair game to draw in these kinds of feelings in interpreting XY as a character since TH has said that the choices in her book mirror reality. Hence, we can also conclude that, in reality, codependent relationships like YaoJing's don't end up in happy endings.