marriage-arraging in "any which way," even confusing who's the bride and who's the groom, getting lost when called to fight btw. on the path to that Abyss where he himself sealed those Chimei beasts... should we wonder why the ancient gods have become extinct? πππ Jeez, if this one survived for being the least muddling among them... I wonder how were the othersπ
I think itβs hilarious but your sense of humor must be different. I do agree there is too much politic talking…
I watched both '94 and 2010 version and agree with PeachBlossomGoddess's short description of the differences but - if you can get well along with older cinematography - I suggest you to try first the '94 version. It's true it appears "more fictionalised" but paradoxically, it's more faithfull to Luo Ben's original novel (which contained phantasy elements, too, it was normal to mix truth with invention like Zhuge Liang's invocation of the wind, the writers of the time had a hard time to check out their - more ancient - sources: if you read Pliny the Elder's Historia Naturalis, an ancient encyclopedia on biological sorts, you'll find mythical and invented creatures/animals mixed together with real ones) and it's more comprehensive of all complicated subplots the original contained, in particular, both the Yellow Turbants quelling and the Red Cliff Battle are rendered more intelligible. I didn't know there were disputes between '94 and 2010 version fans, I am a fan of both versions π. Now, knowing about this fandom dispute, I would instictively say: do you prefer Liu Bei's (and Zhuge Liang's) or Cao Cao's stories? If you prefer Liu Bei, go with '94 version. Unfortunately, that version represent Cao Cao too superficially, he is a flat image of a bastard villain & usurper. On the contrary, the 2010 version strongest point is how it described Cao Cao: he is an antihero here, too, but this antihero is a ML, who displays so many shadows of humanity in all things he undertakes or opposes to. It is mainly due to the Chen Jian Bin's convincing performance, it is this brilliant actor who made Cao Cao flesh and blood, because the scriptwriting is very unstable in this version: hillarious moments (like incidental killing of his ally and friend who provides him a refuge) are exchanged with unconvincing, boring or dull scenes in a series consisting of 95 episodes. Neither Chen Jian Bin's brilliance can keep the audience that long, because it's humanly impossible. Conclusion: there are strong points for both dramas, as well as they both have their flows. But they are both better than anything I've seen in recent years.
So, let's return to today: why Chinese dramas don't produce such a good stuff any more? Last year, I didn't drop only four dramas: Ripe Town, Mysterious Lotus Casebook, I'm Nobody and My Journey to You (the latter only because of the aesthetics, interesting directing and playing, not because the plot was smth. special). This year I've endured Detective Dee, only because van Gulik's novels were among my childhood readings but the drama delivery is quite dissapointing.... To console myself, I've rewatched Ming Dynasty 1566. I think I'll drop this one, too, but will give them a chance tomorrow
So I would guess that Heiyan is actually Di Renjie's brother π€
Di Ying? Heiyan is an antisystemic organisation founded by the remnants of previous dynasty, not a person. But I think you are right, his brother can be related somehow to Heiyan
I can't tell that, but I remember Diao Xiao Guan (or Gan or Chan, depends on transliteration) helps Di to resolve crimes in Chinese Lake Murders, one of RdG's most known novels, with the plot (mistery on a floating brothel boat, murder of a bride on her wedding night, replaced in her coffin by another murdered person) which was used and re-elaborated in so many other c-dramas... It would be silly if the authors missed to use it.
Remind me again who or what is Heiyan and why is ml pursuing it?
In the case of Baekje gold smuggling, the imperial envoy mentioned they are remnants of the previous (Sui) dynasty who were supposed to be wiped out in "14th year of Zhenguan reign" thanks to a "great contribution" of Di Renjie's father. Zhenguan is the emperor Taizong (Li Shimin), father of the emperor in this drama. He also said they went in hiding all over the nation. Heiyan is the major antisystemic force in Tang, that's the reason why they entangle with local gangs using them to undermine the system and the rule of Li family. Di Renjie wants to know why his father committed suicide, was he threatened by Heiyan etc.
Here, the emperor is still alive. Wu Zetian's real power comes later, as empress dowager and regent, and after…
yeah, but women were more or less patronized by almost all other religions, doctrines and philosophies. Confucianism has its merits, too, it created a uniformed stable mandarin class employed in administration and bureaucracy. That class created the most powerful system of the world for 800 years. Empires need a strong thought of what is "order" to keep its different parts together and not to undergo fragmentations, especially on its periphery. That class, spread in all imperial provinces and counties, embodied the order and the system. We see that aspect in the drama, forces which rule in Lan Ward are local gangs.
Here, the emperor is still alive. Wu Zetian's real power comes later, as empress dowager and regent, and after…
In those which aired till this moment, no. Besides, this drama is not about Wu Zetian, RvG made occasional references to her rule (she was in charge because her husband was disinterested and sick) and is interesting only because some cases are connected with "high politics". For some reason, screenwriters and directors (see Tsui Hark's blockbusters) love to put her everywhere in every movie or drama which adapts or is inspired by Di Renjie.
Which other cases from the series are closely adapted from RvG's books?In the case 4 - The Rain Master Legend,…
the divinity depicted with bird features is Leigong (well, rain and thunder go together) "Leigong is depicted as a fearsome creature with claws, bat wings, and a blue face with a bird's beak". Yu Shi instead is announced by a shangyang bird which predicts rain. He should have a monkey face but in folk tales & arts animal features of mythological creatures can easily switch, eg. Egyptian Toth is presented sometimes with a head of ibis, sometimes with a head of baboon. The mask in this drama actually reminded me of Toth, even the wooden statue has a beak of ibis or similar water birds.
Which other cases from the series are closely adapted from RvG's books?In the case 4 - The Rain Master Legend,…
I am not an expert, but there is a rain master in Taoist mythology: Yu Shi. He accompanies Leigong, the god of thunder and they are both supposed to have birdlike features. Can't tell anything on that specific "love story", whether it was made up or not.
im on ep 4 and just shocked at how the commandant could yell and insult the freaking empress in such a rude way.…
Here, the emperor is still alive. Wu Zetian's real power comes later, as empress dowager and regent, and after that period, when she proclaimed herself as emperor. In this early stage, everyone looked on her as on a shameful social climber: she entered the palace as a concubine of the former emperor, technically her father-in-law, and although she was still a child (who never saw the old emperor) when he died, she was supposed never to marry again. She was a nun for a certain period of time, then re-entered to the harem, obviously not as an empress (her family background was too modest) and climbed through the ranks of concubines, gradually becoming the favourite. The gossip of the time tells us that the empress (that one was from a powerful family) was deposed due to her schemes, she accused the empress of murdering her daughter, while she was the one who killed baby daugther with purpose to frame the empress. The truth about all these will never be known, but the rumor was real and highly probably most of the people hated her, especially among Confucian scholars. Historical (and van Gulik's) Di Renjie was a Confucianist, too, the clashes of pov-s between them (she appointed and removed Di as a chancellor twice) are due to a clash of confessional-philosophical currents of the time.
Which other cases from the series are closely adapted from RvG's books?In the case 4 - The Rain Master Legend,…
The Rain Master Legend is adapted from van Gulik's short story He Came with the Rain, not from a novel. There was a folk tale about the Rain Master which Dee found in pwanbroker's library, not in the puppet play. Puppet plays appear in other stories, but I think they've introduced this detail here because of the romance with Ms. Cao, it looked like they were going to "a cinema" together, it's ok. I've searched for the collection of short stories in English (because I didn't read them in English and every country's publisher choses both the title and stories to include/exclude): Judge Dee At Work
I instead don't remember the case of smuggled gold on that island.
I wish we had one more epilogue but I don't hate the stylistic choice of leaving the ending fitting with the tone…
You've expressed exactly my thoughts. Givin' us one more epilogue wouldn't kill them. And putting the veil down was sexier then puttin' down the underwear π
How is this comparing to "Strange Tales of Tang Dynasty"?
It's the same genre (modernized gong'an), the ML in SToTD is supposed to be a student of judge Di and conveys the very same vibe and some of the cases reminds you of some of van Gulik's stories. Acting is great in both of them and being similar it's difficult to judge which one is better. This one is better as a production quality, music, visuals, but it's slower in pacing. Such a pacing is intentional because this is an adaptation of van Gulik's stories-cases and the "mystic" element is not that emphasized as in SToTD. So, our judgment will be influenced by the preferences we have for the stories. But generally, if you liked SToTD, you will like this one, too, no matter if you are acquainted with van Gulik's stories or not
Surely not, please not MaRong love triangle, such an irritating character, she gives me a headache.
yup, I remember very well all three Tsui Hark's movies (the one with Andy Lau as well), I've seen them on the big screen with my son who was a kid then. Both Lin Gengxin and Feng Shaofeng made a great impression on me, but I've liked that rigid and solemn Mark Chao's Dee, too. Later they were all broadcasted on public and private tv-s accross Europe, Sea Dragon was nominated at Venice film festival and 4 heavenly kings won at Bruxelles fantasy film festival, Tsui Hark is generally well known here as a blockbuster director. Lin played a role of a young medical apprentice - his character is not originally van Gulik's and none of the three stories is from his series of novels. Many writers, from every continent, wrote stories on Di Renjie - thing that van Gulik actually wanted, he wanted other authors to get the inspiration from his hero. Comparisons are inevitable, but I like this drama very much, the visuals are stunning, ML is great and although re-written, we get the same overall vibe from the original van Gulik's stories, for some reason (probably because these stories were my childhood readings and I feel "familiar" with them) I prefer this drama to Tsui Hark's movies. Maybe because of this subjective preference, I enjoy the story without thinking too much.
Jeez, if this one survived for being the least muddling among them... I wonder how were the othersπ
I didn't know there were disputes between '94 and 2010 version fans, I am a fan of both versions π. Now, knowing about this fandom dispute, I would instictively say: do you prefer Liu Bei's (and Zhuge Liang's) or Cao Cao's stories? If you prefer Liu Bei, go with '94 version.
Unfortunately, that version represent Cao Cao too superficially, he is a flat image of a bastard villain & usurper. On the contrary, the 2010 version strongest point is how it described Cao Cao: he is an antihero here, too, but this antihero is a ML, who displays so many shadows of humanity in all things he undertakes or opposes to. It is mainly due to the Chen Jian Bin's convincing performance, it is this brilliant actor who made Cao Cao flesh and blood, because the scriptwriting is very unstable in this version: hillarious moments (like incidental killing of his ally and friend who provides him a refuge) are exchanged with unconvincing, boring or dull scenes in a series consisting of 95 episodes. Neither Chen Jian Bin's brilliance can keep the audience that long, because it's humanly impossible.
Conclusion: there are strong points for both dramas, as well as they both have their flows. But they are both better than anything I've seen in recent years.
So, let's return to today: why Chinese dramas don't produce such a good stuff any more? Last year, I didn't drop only four dramas: Ripe Town, Mysterious Lotus Casebook, I'm Nobody and My Journey to You (the latter only because of the aesthetics, interesting directing and playing, not because the plot was smth. special). This year I've endured Detective Dee, only because van Gulik's novels were among my childhood readings but the drama delivery is quite dissapointing.... To console myself, I've rewatched Ming Dynasty 1566.
I think I'll drop this one, too, but will give them a chance tomorrow
Tnx
Heiyan is the major antisystemic force in Tang, that's the reason why they entangle with local gangs using them to undermine the system and the rule of Li family. Di Renjie wants to know why his father committed suicide, was he threatened by Heiyan etc.
Confucianism has its merits, too, it created a uniformed stable mandarin class employed in administration and bureaucracy. That class created the most powerful system of the world for 800 years. Empires need a strong thought of what is "order" to keep its different parts together and not to undergo fragmentations, especially on its periphery. That class, spread in all imperial provinces and counties, embodied the order and the system. We see that aspect in the drama, forces which rule in Lan Ward are local gangs.
Besides, this drama is not about Wu Zetian, RvG made occasional references to her rule (she was in charge because her husband was disinterested and sick) and is interesting only because some cases are connected with "high politics". For some reason, screenwriters and directors (see Tsui Hark's blockbusters) love to put her everywhere in every movie or drama which adapts or is inspired by Di Renjie.
In this early stage, everyone looked on her as on a shameful social climber: she entered the palace as a concubine of the former emperor, technically her father-in-law, and although she was still a child (who never saw the old emperor) when he died, she was supposed never to marry again. She was a nun for a certain period of time, then re-entered to the harem, obviously not as an empress (her family background was too modest) and climbed through the ranks of concubines, gradually becoming the favourite. The gossip of the time tells us that the empress (that one was from a powerful family) was deposed due to her schemes, she accused the empress of murdering her daughter, while she was the one who killed baby daugther with purpose to frame the empress. The truth about all these will never be known, but the rumor was real and highly probably most of the people hated her, especially among Confucian scholars. Historical (and van Gulik's) Di Renjie was a Confucianist, too, the clashes of pov-s between them (she appointed and removed Di as a chancellor twice) are due to a clash of confessional-philosophical currents of the time.
I instead don't remember the case of smuggled gold on that island.
Givin' us one more epilogue wouldn't kill them.
And putting the veil down was sexier then puttin' down the underwear π
Acting is great in both of them and being similar it's difficult to judge which one is better. This one is better as a production quality, music, visuals, but it's slower in pacing. Such a pacing is intentional because this is an adaptation of van Gulik's stories-cases and the "mystic" element is not that emphasized as in SToTD.
So, our judgment will be influenced by the preferences we have for the stories. But generally, if you liked SToTD, you will like this one, too, no matter if you are acquainted with van Gulik's stories or not
Comparisons are inevitable, but I like this drama very much, the visuals are stunning, ML is great and although re-written, we get the same overall vibe from the original van Gulik's stories, for some reason (probably because these stories were my childhood readings and I feel "familiar" with them) I prefer this drama to Tsui Hark's movies. Maybe because of this subjective preference, I enjoy the story without thinking too much.