Sandy Prater

Yes, but I have to admit that she was a great villain and wonderful to hate. I missed her when she was gone, and it seemed like the story wasn't as good with just the Ou family to contend with.

1. The oldest Ou son. Shiyi's mother stumbled upon his secret meeting with the pirate, and he feared she overheard their conversation and could expose his partnership with them.
2. When Erniang's husband died and she miscarried her baby, the Duke had no heirs. The plan was to adopt a kid from within their clan. Erniang was panicking b/c the Duke could either allow Erniang to become the adopted mother (therefore maintaining her position, power, and wealth as mother to the heir) or directly adopt a kid as his son (skipping over Erniang and leaving her basically a penniless widow dependent on the Wang family for handouts). It's what the Jiang woman was using to pressure Erniang to try and get the Marquise to look into Wang's death. The child chosen is a family member/member of clan but not Erniang's husband's kid. He had none, which I found to be a bit ridiculous considering how dedicated he was at lechery.
3. You mean why was she kicked out? Because she burnt an embroidery meant to be a gift to the king - considered to be a crime that could endanger the entire Xu family. What happened to her? She was sent to a farm the Xu family owned to work as a servant, but was brought back at the last episode by LingYi as a means to make amends for his cold treatment of his concubines and given a choice of what she wants for her future - she chooses to follow her son to his school.
4. No. She is not related to them. They struck up a partnership b/c Qin felt used and abused by the Xu family and sought revenge for the death (miscarriage) of her child and unfair treatment at the hands of Madam Xu.
5. No. Amber loves him and confesses her love, but he tells her that he has someone else in his heart. When he is expelled from the city, she decides to follow him, despite his telling her he does not want her to. It's never explained if he grows to accept her love/form a relationship/etc...just ends with her following him and the women/children of the Ou clan who are all sent into exile.
6. In CDramas, it's not uncommon for emotional pain to cause physical illness and even death. Shiyi's stepmother had already taken a blow when Yuanniang (her biological daughter and Marquise's first wife) died. When it was reveal Yuanniang was murdered, she had a stroke and never fully recovered. Erniang's mother actually relayed that info hoping it would further deteriorate the Luo matron's health. Later, when Erniang goes through all her issues, it also affects her mom's health along with punishment she received for trying to sneak money to Erniang. Luo matron basically accused her of stealing and had her locked in a room where the cold and damp made her ill. In a way you could say they "poisoned" each other though b/c each of these women did things to deliberately cause harm to each other.

3. She's more than a bit intimidated by the idea of intimacy. She's a sheltered teen. You saw her nervousness on the wedding night. LY (without knowing about her ulterior motives) senses this which is why he's using the "slowly get to know each other" tactics starting with moving into her room. Apparently the same thing happened in the novel where the ML uses a similar "let's just cuddle" strategy to get the FL to eventually relax, so this seems to be an adaptation of what happens in the source material. Even during their first kiss, she nervously leans away until her back looks like it's about to fold in half and when he brings her up to meet him, she puts a shaky hand between them until finally their lips meet and desire takes over. Great acting/directing for that scene btw.

When Shiyi does finally "give in" and kisses him, it's because she's realized she's in love and made the decision to stay with Lingyi and in the marriage - not something to be decided lightly or quickly. All of this (marriage/fall in love/decision to stay) happens in less than a year btw. I only mention that because so many people seem to think it's been over a year or two years or something. Using Danyang's pregnancy as a time gauge (she married when DY first found out she was pregnant and DY doesn't give birth until episode 36), I'd say from marriage to first kiss in episode 27 was like 3-4 months - not at all an unreasonable amount of time to fall in love. It just seems longer b/c it hit our ML like a thunderbolt - for him more like weeks if not days

A lot of people have been frustrated with Shiyi's lack of reciprocation to Lingyi's advances. I get it, but I also think some are being unfairly harsh to her character. Yes, she's deliberately avoiding him, but there are reasons why:

1. She didn't love him for a long time...not "oh, she doesn't realize she loves him." No, she genuinely fell in love much later than he did. He started to fall for her fast and by the time she prepared him the gift of the shoes, he was a goner. She, on the other hand, took longer and then a wee bit more time to acknowledge that's what she was feeling.

2. Her plan was to marry him, find her mother's killer, and then find a way out of that household/marriage. Go back to episode 1 as she's being beaten by the Luo madam and drilled to respect the hierarchy of concubine/legitimate members. Better yet, listen to her explanation to her mother and Master Jian as to why she would rather run away than marry into the Marquis' household. Because both of them actually told her they thought it was a viable option due to his position and reputation for being a decent sort of person. However, prior to her mom dying, Shiyi is like "nope." That sort of backstabb-y complicated household is a nightmare come true for her. As for her plans to eventually leave, well, she's not the sort that would care about the stigma of divorce once she deals with her mother's killer; she's perfectly happy with the idea of relying on herself for survival and has done so for years during her and her mom's exile. This girl has no problems walking away with her reputation in tatters. There's only one thing that would trap her in the Xu household forever: a baby. No way she'd abandon her child, and there's also no way that the Xu family would allow her to take the baby with her. You've seen how they are about offspring. So getting pregnant is the worst thing that could happen to her. There's also no "lets just make out" in this world. Kissing leads to other things, and she doesn't want them to lead anywhere.hing that could happen to her. ***continued in following reply b/c it wouldn't let me put it on in one.

I agree with much of what you wrote, including the overuse of tropes and the rushed ending. Someone posted that they were forced to condense from 50 episodes to 45 so perhaps things got mashed and jumbled in there - or maybe the directors were pissed and threw up their hands because even the beautifully set up scenes I'd been used to watching throughout the drama seemed to dry up towards the end, except for that final shot at the palace. Not sure why the number of episodes were an issue but China's censorship for their dramas makes little sense to me overall.

I think Seven Tan held her own with him in Sword and the Brocade though. She's a good actress and can play roles without reverting to childlike or petulant behavior to evoke emotions. Watching him with Angelababy in General and I was painful though. She was like a beautiful mannequin that he was reciting his lines to.

I love Wallace in period pieces, but unfortunately he has only done a handful of them. First fell in love with his acting in General and I - it's a period piece starring Angelababy. She's absolutely gorgeous but acting skills are "meh." Basically, think Angelina Jolie but with Kristen Stewart's talents. If you overlook that part of it, this drama is the one I would recommend watching. Lots of Wallace looking heroic and a smoldering romance. Since you liked Sword and the Brocade, I'd also throw out Under the Power which features Seven Tan (Shiyi). She has great chemistry with her costar in that one and is adorable and capable as ever.

Well, there's a "happy" ending - which, to me, means the characters are written in a way that they are supposed to be satisfied with how the story's conflict is resolved. No deaths of main characters (though a supporting character death for emotional impact is okay).

Then there's the bittersweet ending where the conflict is resolved but there's a touch of sadness - such as when a main character sacrifices themselves to evoke change or save someone they love.

I guess it all depends on how it's written and how much satisfaction I receive as a viewer in terms of how they wrap up the storyline and how many plot holes I have to trip over to get to the conclusion the writers are working towards. A perfect example of this would be the recent drama, Mr. Queen/Queen Cheorin. I couldn't be satisfied with it, even though they had all the characters "happy" because the happiness didn't make sense/seemed forced due to the overall narrative buildup, unresolved character arcs, and unanswered questions. Very similar to how the series Game of Thrones ended, not in actual plot itself but the framing of it in preceding seasons and then the abrupt narrative switch which had many scratching their heads in confusion. Not because they weren't smart enough to "get it," but because it was jarring and not at all in line with the well-written seasons which preceded it. Well, 1-6 and some of 7, that is.

It's interesting that your reaction is not a rare one. I've seen on Twitter and other social media that others have gone through the same range of emotions and feelings of betrayal. I mourned as if a family member passed...like you, nothing hit so hard as this show and that ending. Even analyzing the heck out of it and knowing why, in the context of the parameters they set up from the beginning, they went the route they did, it still hurt. I can't put my finger on why this show got to so many people like it did...some maybe were drawn to the gender fluidity and what they thought would be acceptance of it, but while I support LGBT rights, I don't personally identify with it, so I don't think that's the reason. Regardless, this show dug itself deep into the hearts of many and then the writers just blew everything up at the last minute. (sigh)

Hey there again. I've sat here for two weeks and analyzed the heck out of this show. Many of my original thoughts have changed, and I posted an updated analysis of what I think the writers' intent was at the top of this comments section. Might do a complete review change - I did update the ratings I originally gave - but didn't yet for reasons I mention in the review. Would love to hear your thoughts on my new theory if you ever feel like reading. Sorry for the length of it, but there was a lot to process.

I respect your opinion on the show, though it differs from my own. Not going to argue the points of the characters level or awareness or if the show ended the "right" way or not b/c with so many unanswered questions and narrative pieces left unfulfilled, it's pure conjecture at this point and evidence can be interpreted either way. The only thing I did want to throw a comment out there on was the observation about a 21st century person making a go at it in the past. It's funny how different perspectives can look at the same work and feel so pulled in opposite directions. One reason why I wanted BH to stay in the past (other than my hard fall for the SoBong and Cheoljong relationship) was that I wanted the Swiss cheese, in a manner of speaking. I loved the idea of his existence causing a multiverse branch-off which would change the course of history without having to affect our present. This could be done by having BH die from the start. Without revisiting his body and giving the audience an anchor point to tie us to our own reality and being forced to confront the fact that changes in the past did affect his future - the writers set up a tied parallel time theory instead in episode 5 - BH's death in the present and life in the past would have opened up a world of endless possibilities: CJ not dying early, Japanese occupation averted, unification of Korea, etc...that I found intriguing. I'm a scifi geek at heart though, so this sort of thing just excites me.

Yep. There were actually a couple of things I preferred about the novel. The ending for one - obviously. Plus the fact that in the novel, though they don't have a direct confrontation about it, the king knows that his empress is not who she was and that she was a man in her previous body, but he still falls in love with her and she loves him. It's hilarious that he spends as much time being jealous of the women she lusts after and tries to surround herself with (while simultaneously fending them off because she insists that he not ignore them as women have needs too) as he does being jealous of the men who lust after her. It's so much more complex than what's been televised in either version.

Cdrama did not have a happy ending, but it was so low-budget and campy that I didn't care. The original source novel did have a happy ending though.

The man has a near-photographic memory int he story for crying out loud! He remembers every single anachronistic thing the queen utters and then compiled it in a dictionary of terms...but is completely clueless at the end. Worse, the audience then gets no acknowledgement of his sense of loss other than the same sort of sentiment I feel when I accidentally leave my phone at the house.

Ditto. Like what was the point of Jon's resurrection and Dany becoming the badass conqueror that she was when you're going to turn him into a mumbling dummy and her a crazed witch all in the span of 2-3 episodes. Same. Exact. Feeling. Here. I've come to terms with it by analyzing the finale to the littlest detail and hanging my hat on an unconfirmed but hinted at reincarnation/parallel time theory, but that's all on me and my desire to make sense of chaos. The show didn't give me a damn thing in terms of closure.

That episode was beautifully shot but felt like cinematic masking tape. I like how another reviewer pointed out that at no point in his confession of love by the lake did CJ mention any of SY’s qualities prior to becoming Mr Queen, feelings for SY before he knew her name, nor her scintillating zither skills. That last bit had me spewing my drink I was laughing so hard.

Yes. It was a true and permanent swap in the novel. But the writers said they based Mr. Queen on the Cdrama based on the novel and not the novel itself. In the Cdrama, they never address at length and the audience basically is led to believe she died and then the playboy’s soul got into her empty body.

The Kingdom spinoff is the only one that really piques my interest. Wish they would get the license for Mr. Queen which, despite some flaws, was a great drama - odd they didn't license it since they did the other recent tvn hits. I like the diversity listed here, but I admit to enjoying Kdrama rom-coms and wish there were more of that type available.

I know, right? Hulu and Amazon have a few good ones (Handmaiden's Tale, Bosch, and Jack Ryan), but they haven't been able to match Netflix in terms of quantity of quality works...not to mention how Netflix has embraced international content.

Bong-Hwan and So Yong are both versions of the same soul. What got me thinking about this was that scene in episode 5 where SoBong talks about original and past lives but then mentions parallel time-streams. To illustrate, she draws two lines running side by side and explains how a past life can be in one and the original/current being in the other. This had me stumped a bit, and I thought it a bit random that they put that in there, but then I looked up “reincarnation and parallel lives” and there’s a surprising number of articles on it - though obviously not conclusive or scientific as it involves spirituality.

Episode 5 also explains why time in the present is flowing at the same rate as the past, which we discovered when BH’s consciousness briefly reentered his body and explain why they chose to reveal that fact. Time isn’t linear here but more fluid with both versions existing simultaneously - harkening back to the two lines Mr. Queen drew to illustrate.

The reincarnation theory would explain many of the elements of the story that I found hard to accept. For example:

If So Yong’s separate soul was in there with Bong Hwan’s soul then why did he never feel her? In fact, the show repeatedly makes reference to the idea that Bong Hwan does not feel another soul and attributes characteristics of SY to the body (telling her after the kiss that the soul is in control of the body so she ought to behave and in another scene he tries to get her soul to return by addressing the lake - where he believes she is hiding). The only time he accuses her of being a separate entity inside of him is when he wants an excuse for his feelings and reactions to CJ. The “it must have been her that took control. If I knew it was CJ I would have….still enjoyed it?!? What’s wrong with me?” moments. LOL What if the reason he couldn’t feel another presence was because there wasn’t another? He merely had his consciousness wake up in the body of his past life but didn’t realize it.

It would explain the gradual integration of both personalities. For example, when CJ returns the book to Mr. Queen, she never thinks of herself as not being the girl from the well as she did when he first confesses his love for her at the lake. As BH spends more time in her previous body, the lines become more blurred not just in memory but also in identity because he IS her. If they were two separate souls, I don’t think she would have that same reaction nor do I see anything to indicate that So Yong “took over” in that moment or any other. Memories were accessed, personality traits were mingling, but we saw SY come out in episode 20…that personality was immediately recognizable. Fantastic acting by SHS - especially as she had me loving the one and hating the other, despite being both.

It would explain why Mr. Queen falls for CJ so hard, despite his initial protests. I never liked the idea of his feelings being manipulated, but I can get on board with the idea that he accepts his feelings for CJ because this is a man that some part of him has always loved - and falls in love with “again” through their shared experiences and journey.

It would also explain the question of why Bong Hwan. What was the connection between this man and So Yong? They are reincarnations of each other. When So Yong was feeling hopeless and needed strength, she pulled upon her stronger version of herself to help her - made possible in that moment when she desperately wanted to give up on life and he desperately wanted to live. She came to him in that pool and appeared to the queen again when she was looking for answers in the lake. This does not give the impression of a soul cruelly imprisoned in her own body against her will.

It would also explain why, when Bong Hwan briefly went back to his body, So Yong did not reappear. She wasn’t being suppressed. She purposefully had her reincarnated self come to give her strength and was not ready at that time to assume her life again. It’s also why I believe BI didn’t realize Mr. Queen wasn’t SY - for the same reason CJ doesn’t at the end of the drama. These two men, both of whom deeply love her, could sense it was her, just in reverse order. CJ-SB-SY and BI-SY-SB.

It would also solve the pesky issue of why BH is an overall better person - not just at the moment of his return but before. Someone on Reddit mentioned the implausibility of CJ’s political accomplishments causing a ripple effect to change BH, and I agree. However, if we look at BH as SY’s reincarnation, then the positive attributes he now displays in the altered timeline can be accounted for because he prevented his previous incarnation from killing herself out of resentment/disappointment/rejection/powerlessness, therefore in his next lifetime his soul didn’t carry those grudges. This fits with the idea of reincarnation as a person’s life experiences and emotions/grudges/regrets/mindset at death will determine the psychological and even physical manifestation of their next life. SY was told by evil Kim that she had no power b/c she was a woman - next life is a man. SY had her love cruelly rejected - next life is a playboy who doesn’t seem to believe in love. SY felt that she was living a lie - next life is a man who doesn’t care who he offends with his opinion and does what he wants when he wants to…to the point of selfishness - though this changes when he prevents many of these grudges by his actions in the past.

Finally, it would explain why CJ doesn’t know that it’s a different woman at the end of the show. While her personality has changed, it’s intrinsically also the same person - though this is the area I felt the writers dropped the ball in execution, but I get that they were pressed for time. The implications of this aspect also seem to be what KJH meant in his comment to a fan’s question of whether the king knew that BH had left.That it didn’t matter: SY or BH didn’t matter, only how CJ saw her.

So why send BH back? I believe they did it because it wouldn’t make sense for him to live a life he essentially already lived as SY. Reincarnation is mean to be a means for a soul to grow and spiritually evolve, which it could not do by simply repeating what it had already done. Also, for some reason (I suspect so as not to offend Koreans by skipping over one of the most prominent historical figures in their culture - Queen Min), they still have CJ dying at age 32. This can be seen in the book BH is looking at when he’s seeing his portrait, and is mentioned as early as episode 1 in SB's description of who CJ is, where she states he dies of illness 14 years after becoming king. This was never going to be a happy ending for CJ/BH in the sense that many viewers wanted. Rather, he was going to facilitate the relationship of SY/CJ so that his previous life could run its course…ugh, I feel sick typing that out…though with the hope that they meet again. CJ dies without any heirs; his baby with the queen dies at just six months. If the BH decided to stay for love and then lost the baby and CJ, that would be just as heartbreaking for me as the ending I received. Wiki and other sources speculate the CJ was poisoned by the Andong Kims, but many historians (including Bong Hwan’s history professor mother, it seems) dispute that fact as it would serve no purpose since he was a puppet king and since his death then allowed the Jo family to briefly take control until King Gojong’s father pretty much crushed both the Kims and the Jos. In reality, he probably died of unhealthy habits and a life of excess. In the show’s world, who knows…cancer or any number of possible illnesses that could not be treated at that time.

However, they did give us the hope for another reunion - perhaps in BH’s lifetime or perhaps another one. It’s why I think they tried to imply a SY/CJ connection in the Bamboo Forest prequel (the only prequel in the spinoff) as well as end Bamboo Forest with a reincarnation wish. The setup seemed quite intentional and in specific order. The prequel created a sense of destiny. The next segment was about Mr. Queen confirming if it was just his body or his soul that was attracted to CJ…literally the words out of the character’s mouth…and they gave an answer to that with the last shot. The final segment introduced the wish for CJ to meet his queen again, and he is clearly thinking of Mr. Queen - so why the prequel, which would seem to introduce a separate love interest, unless it’s actually not because they’re one and the same with the middle segment emphasizing the genuine attraction and love for each other - they're soulmates and have been in every lifetime.