PoetryInMotion

Oooh, where you the person blessed by Apollo last week that predicted Sohee would out someone? Kudos to you if so xD

What's worse, how in the hell is Da On gonna get a fair shot at sorting out his own feelings now, with this on his back? Like, shit, I love Shin Woo, but how am I supposed to be happy if things work out between him and Tae Kyung if THIS is what came before for Tae Kyung's other relationship?

Right...I had some amount of compassion for her, especially in the beginning, but now? Girl bye.

Didn't someone, sort of jokingly, comment a couple of episodes ago that they felt like Sohee was the type to out people out of spite? That person received Apollo's gift of prophecy for real.

Two things about EP10.

1) "The first desire is to feel that one is desired, not just wanted but preferred. " J.D. McClatchy
2) "You have to meet people where they are, and sometimes you have to leave them there." Iyanla Vanzant

Namgoong remains the MVP. Tae Kyung and Shin Woo are both incredibly brave. So Hee can go die in a fire. Da On is....Da On, but no one deserves this. I'm tired.

Oh, honey. You're so transparent.

Anyway, this was fun, but it's past my bedtime now. Have a nice day!

Oh, the pain. This from the person who claimed he did a comparative study and asked for sources, neglecting to provide his own, which he will now not check because he's not actually interested in facts? How will I recover.

You can go and shell out the 40 dollars for the 1993 Janus report or the 1979 Kinsey data collection book yourself. You're not gonna like the results though.

"Bisexual people exist too" was the completely innocuous statement in the original post, which you took as your opportunity to assert that bisexual people are such rare unicorns that the mere suggestion that the character in question MIGHT be bisexual is a ludicrous statistical improbability.

I also find it funny that you want me to submit a research paper while your numbers are supposed to be taken at face value, but if it makes you feel better.

France, 2011:
https://www.ifop.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/1546-1-study_file.pdf
3,6% homosexual, 3% bisexual (both numbers rounded up)

France, 2014:
https://www.ifop.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/2669-1-study_file.pdf
4% homosexual, 3% bisexual

Germany, 2015:
http://www.bine.net/sites/default/files/bijou31de_doppelseiten.pdf
YouGov study using the Kinsey model of sexuality as a sliding scale;
21% mixed attraction overall, 4% bisexual, 3% homosexual

New Zealand, 2013/2014:
if you wanna buy the pdf: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-016-0857-5
Newspaper summary:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/what-kiwis-really-think-about-race-sex-euthanasia-commuting-and-changing-the-flag/FCL6FLABXC6M3R37M6F3AHXZ5I/
2,6% homosexual, 1,8% bisexual

UK, 2008:
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2008/oct/26/observer-sex-poll-2008
4% homosexual, 2% bisexual

UK, 2009:
https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/sites/default/files/research_report_35_sexual_orientation_explored.pdf
3,3% homosexual, 2,4% bisexual

UK, 2014: https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/sep/28/british-sex-survey-2014-nation-lost-sexual-swagger
4% homosexual, 4% bisexual

UK, 2015: https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/7zv13z8mfn/YG-Archive-150813-%20Sexuality.pdf
6% homosexual, 2% bisexual

US, 2000-2010:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3780743/
1,5% homosexual, 2,3% bisexual

US, 2013:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/health-survey-gives-government-its-first-large-scale-data-on-gay-bisexual-population/2014/07/14/2db9f4b0-092f-11e4-bbf1-cc51275e7f8f_story.html
1,6% homosexual, 0,7% bisexual -> lowest number out of samples provided, researchers themselves express need to investigate the dip

US, 2021:
https://news.gallup.com/poll/329708/lgbt-identification-rises-latest-estimate.aspx
1,4% gay, 0,7% lesbian, 3,1% bisexual; 54,6% bisexual among LGBT adults

Sure you did. So you averaged them, of course taking great care that they match in methodology etc. so that they are actually comparable, and still managed to land at the absolute lowest end of the numbers that are out there? Fascinating math.

Reality is that bisexual people exist, and not in insignificant numbers. Just because that's a reality you don't seem to like, doesn't make it less so.

I see! That's interesting. So would I be correct in assuming that you experienced that scene mostly from Da On's perspective? Because I feel like at the base level, our interpretation of Da On's personality is actually quite similar, namely that he has difficulty accessing and communicating his emotions in a straightforward manner. And depending on the narrative perspective you occupy in that scene, your reaction to see that personality trait play out would be different. If you put yourself in Da On's shoes, you sympathise with his reticence and if you're in Tae Kyung's, you feel the effects of it which could be hurtful to experience in an emotionally vulnerable situation even if there's a reason behind the behaviour. Because that would actually go a long way in explaining why the audience's response might feel divided; it's one of the hardest things narratively to put you equally in the heads of both characters in a confronting situation.

Ah ok, that makes sense! Yeah, it's one of the quirks of depression that the colloquial understanding is actually quite different to the experience of the actual disorder in many ways. But yeah, he definitely has that trauma, and the corresponding coping mechanism.

*sigh* According to which survey? Depending on the survey questions used and the demographic that is sampled, these percentages vary wildly, even more so when you take into account that there's a cultural component to this as well. You can even find some reports where the numbers of people who identify as bi are higher than those who identify as gay.
Like, I think I understand where the sentiment is coming from. I'm sure it can be annoying to go to a piece of media with the specific wish to see a homosexual relationship and then having someone suggest that the character might not be ''''purely'''' homosexual or whatever. But straight people already do this shit to us enough. Does the call HAVE to come from inside the house?

Yeah...one of the things that sucks about BL as a whole. Then again, even some parts of the community still think that us bisexuals are just indecisive sluts, soooo¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Dude, there’s definitely a charm on that one, but I can’t read what it says 😩 what the hell. My brain is fried, FRIED I tell you

The way this show turns us all into detectives :D thanks for the time stamp lovely, I'll go take a look!

Thanks for that in-depth response! :) Gonna answer by paragraph for ease and clarity.

1) I guess I'm just wondering where the line is between "I'm criticising this character because I am unable and/or unwilling to empathise with where they're coming from" and "I'm criticising them because while I understand, I don't agree or wish it were different for one reason or another". Maybe I've just been lucky in the selection of people who were willing to talk to me about this series and the bulk of the audience is different, but I feel like everyone I've talked to has been very willing to see Da On's good sides and to call out Shin Woo, so it's felt very balanced, and not like baby Shin Woo and demon spawn Da On.

2) I can see that! To add to that, the effect is probably heightened by the fact that Da On tends to hide negative or troubling emotions with a smile, leaving the audience to wonder if the emotion is just not that deep or if his control is just that good, and usually when we meet him the narrative perspective is mostly from another character, like Tae Kyung or Shin Woo.

3) Sort of connected to part 2), it's really fascinating to me how differently you experienced Da On's emotional state in this episode. I think for me, I was mentally once again mostly in Tae Kyung's position (though not in his head, because his emotional response to what happened was quite different to mine) especially in the confession scene, and Da On walking away like that left me feeling so so empty, because it felt like there was almost this big emotional "balloon" built up by all the sentiments poured into the confession that then deflated without proper reaction or acknowledgment. And I did not necessarily feel the overwhelm in Da On, to me it felt like that might come into play in the next episode, and what we had here was just an inability to connect to the magnitude of Tae Kyung's emotions and desires, because Da On's are buried so deep, so that he could compartmentalise them quickly to put away for later because he just absolutely cannot prioritise anything over what he perceives as his duty to be of service. I will rewatch that part with your thoughts in mind and see how I react on second viewing.

4) I'm curious why you landed on depression here. For reference, I have depression (as in clinically diagnosed and medicated); and that particular interpretation of Da On doesn't quite click with me. To be very clear, I'm not putting myself out as any kind of authority or saying that my personal experience is the only way to have depression. I'd just like to know more about your thought process here because I have somewhat of a personal reference point with that particular topic.

Wow, really? The exact same kind with the charm? But where did Tae Kyung get that bracelet from then, if they only visit that shop much later in the story? Because the one in the first scene is definitely the kind that was specifically sold in that one souvenir shop, with the little charm that says Light On Me. Did he pick the bracelet for Da On because it matched one he had previously? Or is it just a continuity error? Questions, questions....:D

I don't know if I'd summarise the audience's reaction to Shin Woo and Da On respectively quite in the way you have, but I do get the impression that empathy for Shin Woo seems to come from a very visceral, unexamined place whereas sympathy for Da On needs some reflection. I don't believe it's the audience being callous, but I can't put my finger on if there's something in the technical execution of the series, the writing or the acting or the sequence of events, that produces that effect? Or is it that Shin Woo's issue (unrequited love, difficulty communicating) is just something that more people experience as opposed to Da On's issue (neglect, desperately seeking acceptance and harmony)? Maybe Da On's family issues were not shown directly enough? I'm honestly not sure. Do you have thoughts?

Da On really is his own quiet tragedy. It's not that I don't understand where it's coming from, or that I wish him ill, I just can't take watching it. It's too *big* for me. The boy needs counselling. It seems that the people and the experiences he encounters in his daily life aren't enough to shift some of the deeply ingrained ways of thinking he has.

Yes, well. If that's how you feel, then that's how you feel.

Ooooooh, possibly! More surprises on the horizon :D