Wow.I never visited the comment section after ep 9 or 10 but wow.I never expected it to escalate to this. I'm…
Looks like you've missed tons of comments, since Ep. 9 and 10. Majority of HJP fans are actually happy he did not end up with the needy trainwreck that is SDM, they are just unhappy that the writer not only did not give HJP a satisfactory ending. They did not allow him time to grieve. And to add insult to injury, just days after his heart is broken, he is suppose to babysit the new lovebirds, and is practically forced to be best buds with NDS? Unreal, unrealistic and frankly, just flat out cruel.
I think a lot of HJP got stuck with the solid story of the first 6 episodes, that even though PHR was sabotaging her own script, they held out hope that PHR was setting this all up for some incredible plot twist. HJP fans should be respected for their sheer faith, IMO. All these plot holes, and poor writing by PHR led some HJP fans to construct their own theories on where the story may be headed. And if you were here near the end of the live airing, you would know that most HJP fans just wanted HJP to have a good ending WITHOUT SDM.
What is interesting is SDM falling in love with letters, or the man in the letters is a trope i've seen in many other shows and dramas, both eastern and western. And in almost all of those shows, the girl or guy makes the effort to at least get to know the feelings of that person that they had imparted sentimental value. In Start Up, once SDM finds out HJP was writing the letters, she makes ZERO effort to find out about HJP's feelings, or to find out if those letters meant anything (we found out in Ep. 16 they did). It's frankly very disappointing, considering the source material was suppose to be Cyrano, one of my favorite plays, where Roxanne actually does fall for the man who wrote the letters, even though she never meets that person.
What is also confusing is that in the show Start Up, all the comfort NDS provided SDM is indirectly because of HJP still. So in the overarching arc, it's actually still HJP who is comforting SDM. Go figure.
The thing that also bothered people is that SDM never bothered to understand NDS fully. She doesn't know the real motivation for the lies, she doesn't understand who NDS really is, and she doesn't understand NDS relationship with his family, which is weird since for someone like SDM who is close to family, a BF's relationship with his family is equally important. Then you add to the fact, that she never bothers to learn more about HJP, she never confronts HJP about anything about the letters, it's weird. She doesn't even confront Grandma, or bothers finding out HJP and Grandma's relationship. For someone like SDM who always seem genuinely curious about everything, and always wanting to learn, she was suddenly devoid of any curiosity about her love life.
To be fair, SDM in the first 6 episodes was a flawed, yet compelling character, that looked like a heroine you wanted to root for. The problem is, the audience thought SDM would be the heroine of the show, but it soon became obvious that lazy writer PHR would go the formulaic route, and simply use SDM as a prop to make NDS the true hero, that needs SDM to make him look good. If they had kept SDM's character consistent, I would have pushed more for an HJP and SDM ending, but her weak characterization left a sour taste in my mouth.
The writer spends pretty much the last 8 episodes trying to "Fix" her ML at the expense of pretty much every other character in the show. Actually the character that had the most consistent character development has always been, and will always be HJP. From Ep. 1 to Ep. 16 he became a man that most Kdrama audience would swoon for. His final selfless acts, were a detriment to his love life, but just made us love him more, and dislike NDS more.
Eh, the show is done, leave people be to do what they want. The fact your coming back here after so long, says a lot too you know :))))
I hope KSH does somewhat more mature dramas than this one in the future. I think he's way better in more serious…
In fairness, especially HJP and Grandma scenes, Start Up seemed like a pretty mature drama, until it wasn't. I don't really want to see his 2D1N persona leak into this shows.
I agree, as much as I enjoy Waikiki KSH, seeing his serious side is so much more powerful and interesting. Yeah CLOY and Goblin are also my threshold on the comedy parts.
Rom-coms is ok, if it's a more mature one, with light humor and more mature themes. It's all about the script writer. I think a kdrama should always have some doses of comedy in the show to lighten an otherwise heavy script. I can't stand pure melo dramas, it's too heavy.
With the number of people who probably have a hundred email accounts by now, MDL has shown that it's rating systems are not infallible and can be manipulated by hardcore fans.
I wouldn't take the ratings on MDL as fact anymore, but rather as a guide.
Okay so like I just read some comment where they expressed how they felt NDS is interesting and I'm intrigued…
If NDS is a new type of ML, then HJP is a new type of SL then, because most SL's don't get a better backstory than the ML, have half of the series (Ep. 1-8) revolve around them, and have better dialogue and characterization than the ML.
Actually HJP does have quite a bit of flaws that he tries to hide behind his harsh persona. These flaws, when they manifest, get a lot of sympathy due to how realistic and relatable they are to the audience.
Like I've said before:
NDS represents the flaws in ourselves we don't want to admit we have, when we are backed into the corner.
While
HJP represents the hidden strength in us that we do not know we have when faced with adversity.
So in a lot of ways, the way HJP is portrayed in Start Up, is a lot more inspiring to us folks who don't always have a lucky four leaf clover in our pockets. HJP teaches us that in the end, as satisfying it is to be selfish, manipulative, and reckless in life, our good conscience will often win out, and we will end up doing the right thing, even sometimes, at the cost of our success. That is HJP in a nutshell for me, and why I think he is by far the most relatable of the leads in Start Up.
NDS just simply represents the Mary Sue/Gary Stu in literary works, and there are already so so so many of those in Kdrama and Western Shows, where the main characters always wins, always get out of any jam. It's very reminiscent of 90's cartoons, where the bad guys always lost, while the good guys always win.
It's 2021 now, and the audience are more mature, even the teenagers are so mature now, I am finding out. So these tired clichés and over familiar tropes feel boring, especially to a TV watching audience that has for the past 4-5 years been bombarded by many excellently written Western shows. Asian drama watchers have their horizon's broadened, their expectations raised, and their social values modified.
You see, in these well written western shows, the Mary Sue doesn't exist as much, there are enough occasions where the "Orphan" actually get's his happy ending. There is that movement that is growing in western shows, where grey characters are front and center. Cobra Kai and Game of Thrones are two shows that do this really well off the top of my head.
Unfortunately, Kdrama are not huge risk takers, and some of these supposedly popular writers, keep going back to the same old toolbox, merely changing the names on the script, and the setting, but continuing to rehash old formulas that have long been proven outdated and ineffective to a maturing Kdrama watching audience.
K-Drama 
I think a lot of HJP got stuck with the solid story of the first 6 episodes, that even though PHR was sabotaging her own script, they held out hope that PHR was setting this all up for some incredible plot twist. HJP fans should be respected for their sheer faith, IMO. All these plot holes, and poor writing by PHR led some HJP fans to construct their own theories on where the story may be headed. And if you were here near the end of the live airing, you would know that most HJP fans just wanted HJP to have a good ending WITHOUT SDM.
What is interesting is SDM falling in love with letters, or the man in the letters is a trope i've seen in many other shows and dramas, both eastern and western. And in almost all of those shows, the girl or guy makes the effort to at least get to know the feelings of that person that they had imparted sentimental value. In Start Up, once SDM finds out HJP was writing the letters, she makes ZERO effort to find out about HJP's feelings, or to find out if those letters meant anything (we found out in Ep. 16 they did). It's frankly very disappointing, considering the source material was suppose to be Cyrano, one of my favorite plays, where Roxanne actually does fall for the man who wrote the letters, even though she never meets that person.
What is also confusing is that in the show Start Up, all the comfort NDS provided SDM is indirectly because of HJP still. So in the overarching arc, it's actually still HJP who is comforting SDM. Go figure.
The thing that also bothered people is that SDM never bothered to understand NDS fully. She doesn't know the real motivation for the lies, she doesn't understand who NDS really is, and she doesn't understand NDS relationship with his family, which is weird since for someone like SDM who is close to family, a BF's relationship with his family is equally important. Then you add to the fact, that she never bothers to learn more about HJP, she never confronts HJP about anything about the letters, it's weird. She doesn't even confront Grandma, or bothers finding out HJP and Grandma's relationship. For someone like SDM who always seem genuinely curious about everything, and always wanting to learn, she was suddenly devoid of any curiosity about her love life.
To be fair, SDM in the first 6 episodes was a flawed, yet compelling character, that looked like a heroine you wanted to root for. The problem is, the audience thought SDM would be the heroine of the show, but it soon became obvious that lazy writer PHR would go the formulaic route, and simply use SDM as a prop to make NDS the true hero, that needs SDM to make him look good. If they had kept SDM's character consistent, I would have pushed more for an HJP and SDM ending, but her weak characterization left a sour taste in my mouth.
The writer spends pretty much the last 8 episodes trying to "Fix" her ML at the expense of pretty much every other character in the show. Actually the character that had the most consistent character development has always been, and will always be HJP. From Ep. 1 to Ep. 16 he became a man that most Kdrama audience would swoon for. His final selfless acts, were a detriment to his love life, but just made us love him more, and dislike NDS more.
Eh, the show is done, leave people be to do what they want. The fact your coming back here after so long, says a lot too you know :))))
I agree, as much as I enjoy Waikiki KSH, seeing his serious side is so much more powerful and interesting. Yeah CLOY and Goblin are also my threshold on the comedy parts.
Rom-coms is ok, if it's a more mature one, with light humor and more mature themes. It's all about the script writer. I think a kdrama should always have some doses of comedy in the show to lighten an otherwise heavy script. I can't stand pure melo dramas, it's too heavy.
Start Up civil war when? LOL :))))
I wouldn't take the ratings on MDL as fact anymore, but rather as a guide.
Until now, I can't look at a NJH clip without seeing NDS.
What is istg?
Explain please.
I think 8.1 is also a pretty respectable, albeit high rating, for Start Up.
Actually HJP does have quite a bit of flaws that he tries to hide behind his harsh persona. These flaws, when they manifest, get a lot of sympathy due to how realistic and relatable they are to the audience.
Like I've said before:
NDS represents the flaws in ourselves we don't want to admit we have, when we are backed into the corner.
While
HJP represents the hidden strength in us that we do not know we have when faced with adversity.
So in a lot of ways, the way HJP is portrayed in Start Up, is a lot more inspiring to us folks who don't always have a lucky four leaf clover in our pockets. HJP teaches us that in the end, as satisfying it is to be selfish, manipulative, and reckless in life, our good conscience will often win out, and we will end up doing the right thing, even sometimes, at the cost of our success. That is HJP in a nutshell for me, and why I think he is by far the most relatable of the leads in Start Up.
NDS just simply represents the Mary Sue/Gary Stu in literary works, and there are already so so so many of those in Kdrama and Western Shows, where the main characters always wins, always get out of any jam. It's very reminiscent of 90's cartoons, where the bad guys always lost, while the good guys always win.
It's 2021 now, and the audience are more mature, even the teenagers are so mature now, I am finding out. So these tired clichés and over familiar tropes feel boring, especially to a TV watching audience that has for the past 4-5 years been bombarded by many excellently written Western shows. Asian drama watchers have their horizon's broadened, their expectations raised, and their social values modified.
You see, in these well written western shows, the Mary Sue doesn't exist as much, there are enough occasions where the "Orphan" actually get's his happy ending. There is that movement that is growing in western shows, where grey characters are front and center. Cobra Kai and Game of Thrones are two shows that do this really well off the top of my head.
Unfortunately, Kdrama are not huge risk takers, and some of these supposedly popular writers, keep going back to the same old toolbox, merely changing the names on the script, and the setting, but continuing to rehash old formulas that have long been proven outdated and ineffective to a maturing Kdrama watching audience.
It's a meaningless accomplishment, but its a little fun, like Kickstarter where your trying to reach a goal! :)))