Avis2022

Unfortunately, I think Joe will let Tong mistreat him again and again... maybe there will be a moment where he rebels, but he will never seek revenge, it's not in his nature. He will prefer to ignore it, live his life...

However, Ming will never accept being mocked, especially when he discovers that it's "his" Joe who's being mocked.

For now, he seems close to Tong. Is he staying close to potentially land roles in films and potentially meet Joe on set? It's possible. Or is it to please his sister? Does he have an ulterior motive, or has he simply forgotten Tong's horrible personality? For now, Tong isn't really in danger.

He will be when things are revealed. And I hope he loses everything.

The problem with Joe is that his character is portrayed as adorable, sweet, kind... if he became more manipulative, mean... it would be inconsistent with his character.

When Ming learns that Joe is dead and discovers that the new Joe is his Joe, I think everything will change at that moment. Ming is a manipulator just like Tong. I think you have to be manipulative at that level to avenge Joe. I fear that Joe isn't strong enough to truly seek revenge on his own.

For now, Ming doesn't know how much Tong has mocked him. Moreover, Tong hasn't directly targeted Joe in front of him yet. That's what I think is likely to happen in the future. Tong will have to be very careful if he wants to keep Ming. And something tells me he's going to fail miserably.

If Ming manages to open his sister's eyes, Tong loses his money, and if Ming manages to get him fired from the sets, he loses his job too. It would just take manipulating Tong properly, and I don't see Joe doing that. He's way too nice.

I agree with you. Joe doesn't seem like the type of person to seek revenge, at least not alone. With the support of Sol, Wut, and eventually Ming, he might find the courage to seek revenge in his own way. But I agree that Ming's revenge would be the most interesting to see, and I think Tong will ultimately lose all his power and maybe even his wife. I can't imagine a character like Ming doing nothing to seek revenge, either for himself or to support Joe.

I've examined Joe's character, and I don't see him seeking revenge on anyone or anything. He seems like someone who will just live his life, work, mind his own business, and take care of his fake mother to pay off debts and hospital bills.

I don't think Ming is in a revenge mindset at the moment. I think he will be later when he understands all of Tong's schemes and Tong starts targeting the new Joe. When Ming realizes it's his Joe and sees Tong going after him, I doubt, given his character, that he'll just stand there and do nothing. Unlike Joe, who seems willing to be manipulated.

I personally think it's just a stupid accident, but we'll know very soon. I don't think Tong needed to have Joe killed or create an accident for him; he wasn't such a big threat at that time. Now he's going to become one for Tong, and he won't be able to do anything about it.

I'm really trying to analyze every detail, every element, every event, every sentence without getting too personally invested to try to understand all the characters.

Joe is too gentle, too kind to destroy someone's life, and that's what the audience loves about him! If he becomes worse than Tong or Ming... what's the point? The moral? Change your personality and become a jerk to get revenge?

No, Joe is the kind of person who will just keep quiet and do his job. He doesn't have the personality for revenge; he's a good person. That's not the case with Ming. If Ming ruins Tong's life for Joe, it would be very satisfying.

Can you imagine Joe avenging Tong? Honestly? With his personality? His social status?

Impossible. Unfortunately. Even though I would have liked it. Objectively speaking, Joe has no chance against Tong.

Whereas Ming does ;)

To be clear, Joe is not responsible for Ming's behavior. Of course, Ming is a red flag. Certainly, he behaved badly. But that doesn't mean everything is his fault.

1) Tong lied.
2) Joe pretended not to understand.

Yet from the first episode, anyone could tell that Ming wasn't very sincere in his approach.

Joe is still a thirty-year-old man who made bad choices for which he is solely responsible.

However, he is not responsible for Ming's behavior!

But he is responsible for his choices. I know many people who had to change careers overnight... to something less desirable... and that's what Joe should have done. He should have listened to Wut and changed careers... but he decided to do the filming. It's sad, but it was his choice, and he knew the risks. It's a foolish death... but it's a death that is no one's fault except Joe's and the people in charge of the filming.

Ming neither pushed him to suicide nor killed him... he is in no way responsible for his death. Joe is an adult; he made choices that weren't necessarily wise. Here he is, returning to the industry where Tong works... he saw Ming was there, but he stayed. He accepted the shooting with Ming... those are Joe's choices. He could have worked in a café... at a market... but no, he went back exactly where he WANTED TO BE. Soon people will say it's Ming's fault if Joe accepts doing shootings with him and asks to be Tong's stand-in again. No, those are Joe's choices, not Ming's.

Ming made the following choices: taking a man who resembled the image he had of Tong from behind, dating him, and warning him several times: once before the sex scenes, a second time by telling him he couldn't be jealous of a stand-in, a third time when he told him that if he lived with him, he wouldn't want him as his boyfriend anymore... Ming never promised Joe anything. Never. Joe is very romantic, so he turned a blind eye, is that Ming's fault? No...
Joe is an adult. Joe must have found some well-being in his relationship. He was happy with Ming; he loved (loves) Ming.

Not everything is Ming's fault...

Ming's fault is that he locked Joe up.

I am capable of recognizing everyone's faults.

If I were to get into a relationship with a man like Ming, and if I lost my job because of his friend Tong, I would never take a dangerous job risking my life, especially if everyone around me told me not to do it. That's called common sense, and Joe doesn't have any. He's a good, kind person, but he has no common sense, and it's not Ming's fault that he doesn't have it.

Regarding the Joe/Ming relationship, I think Ming should keep his personality. Do you really want Ming to become a smiling, always cheerful, friendly guy with everyone? That wouldn't be Ming anymore! It has to stay consistent! Ming should just show Joe and no one else that he loves him and no one else in terms of feelings, and show Joe, not others (Ming doesn’t have to be friendly like Joe, it’s not in his personality!) that he will do anything for him, that he loves him, and that he regrets.

Ming doesn’t have to completely change his personality... otherwise, he wouldn't be Ming anymore.

When Ming understands everything, do you honestly believe he will let Tong get away so easily? If Tong needed to get on Ming's good side, it's because he knows Ming is powerful enough to bring him down. Tong is smart. Otherwise, he would have confessed to Ming that he wasn't the one who shot that famous scene, but he said nothing. He knew he had to keep Ming around as a friend. If he turns Ming against him, Tong will fall so low that Joe will be able to walk all over him. I can't wait for that moment!

I watched the first five episodes of the series. I haven't read the books, and I don't feel like it considering the explicit content visibly included in them.

I prefer to see the series as a unique work.

Regarding Ming, we all agree that Ming is a warning signal. But Ming is not responsible for Joe's death.

Joe is a thirty-year-old man responsible for his own choices. He deliberately chose to take part in the filming. He could have done many other things. Not working as a stand-in doesn't mean not being able to do anything at all. He knew the risks and chose to take them. Ming is not responsible for his choice. Yes, Ming is partly responsible for his dismissal but not at all for his choice or his death. Joe is responsible for his choice, and the foreign production is responsible for his death.

Ming can be detestable at times, but it's important to put things in perspective.

Then there's Tong. Tong is a scumbag. We will learn more, but I wouldn't be surprised if he made Ming believe certain things before he left. Otherwise, why would Ming ask why he wasn't chosen if he had never been in the running?

Regarding Ming's redemption, I understand it’s hard to imagine, hard to envision. But Ming has changed, and ignoring that won't help you appreciate the series. I've seen people react by saying that Ming is still the same.

And I felt like laughing. Yes, Ming has his personality. He is a cold, distant man when he doesn’t know someone, but he has a good heart, as his secretary says, and as he showed when he wanted to help the old man. Wanting Ming to completely change his personality is completely foolish. Do you honestly think Joe will avenge Tong? Joe? We're talking about someone who can't defend himself unless he's on a set.

No! We need Ming because only he can avenge Tong. Ming is cold, rich, and powerful enough to take revenge on Tong! Of course, it’s Ming who will bring down Tong and not Joe...

Do you see Joe bringing down Tong? Really? No.

And it’s also Ming who will end up paying the expenses for Joe’s "mother."

So Joe is kind, endearing, but extremely naive and way too nice. He needs someone like Ming to help him get revenge, to help him in his life. Sol is kind and could potentially advance the money, but Sol could never avenge Tong.

Only Ming has the power to bring down Tong, don't forget that. Ming has a cold, distant character, but that’s exactly what we need to bring down Tong.