Eleison

I just wrote that "synopsis" to be helpful, so maybe I failed miserably (and I marked this as a "spoiler" so I don't ruffle more feathers), but I'll admit I'm confused by your comment. How did I spoil "the whole story"? I told viewers they can prepare to encounter:

1) A strong queen
2) She will try to protect her sons from evil/ambitious people at court
3) She will inspire people around her
4) She will experience tragedy (is this the point you thought was too obvious?)

I think an effective synopsis piques interest without giving specific details but still provides good context for what people are getting into so they don't feel cheated or misled. How do you think I went overboard?

Questions (I'm just two episodes in):

1) Is Seon Woo Eun Ho still Yoo Ri, or is she a previous incarnation? It makes no sense that she would be, though, because Yoo Ri is a gumiho, and aren't they immortal?

2) If Cheon Mu Yeong is also a mountain god, how was he able to heal Eun Ho? Lee Yeon can't do that? Aren't they of similar status/power (aka former mountain gods)?

Agree completely!

Haha, this is so similar to True Beauty, though? And Sweet Mobster was similar level of cringe to this. Both have the dorky rom-com humor found in this genre of Kdramas. 🤔

Yes, I started losing interest whenever the high school flashbacks happened. I didn't mind the first few in the first episodes, but in 3 and 4 they got too long.

But it was called My Sweet MOBSTER. It's a part of his character and arc. I like how much there was so it didn't feel like he was this fake philanthropist. He clawed his way out and fought dearly to have independence from his past, and they needed to show the stakes involved so we could appreciate how far he'd come, and how much he had done for all his fellow reformed ex-cons. I thought it added a richness to the story that otherwise would have felt flat and shallow.

He talked like this in an interview I saw him in...

I concur!

Haha, thanks!

Sorry, I read that wrong. Glad you ended up liking it!

His boys know him so well. They're all attentive wingmen. 😅

Haha, oh dear. I did ask for that, didn't I? 😂
Well, you won't get an simple definition (I think that would take years to write 😂), but, first off (and get ready, this is long), I'd say it depends on the genre. Some genres I'm less familiar with, and sometimes it's more of an intuition that I struggle to define (like how I could know how to use proper grammar in a sentence, but not be able to break it down if you asked me to, which I know sounds like an excuse 😂), but here I go! A first draft shot.

Kdramas are not episodic. They have long character and/or thematic arcs which do not get realized until the final episodes, and even if there are side characters and little vignettes that come and go into the story, they will not be wrapped up, episode by episode. Nothing important is ever revealed immediately, and there is always mystery that is slowly revealed that fleshes out the characters and their stories as the drama progresses no matter the genre. The storytelling is NEVER completely linear. They are usually fairly clean as far as sexual innuendoes and crass jokes go (there's a bit of a spectrum, though), and explicit scenes are just not done. Strong language DOES feature, though. The ML is always a good person or becomes one by the end of the drama.

With more time I could try to do better to refine the main elements of the formula that ALL Kdramas share, but I'd need more time to think about it and map stuff out. 😂 Kdramas are a kind of format (think Hallmark, but more sophisticated, and a longer format) with a grab bag of formulaic non-negotioables, tropes, and cliches that get creatively mix-and-matched to form: the Kdrama.

Most dramas I can think of from these genres that don't adhere consistently to the elements I'll list below (and which "experiment" more) will always be from Netflix or Disney.

Now, as for the traditional Kdrama thriller/crime/mystery, it wouldn't have a sex scene, sexual innuendos or anything elicit or lewd beyond the implied (D.P., for instance, and My Name, diverged from the formula wildly here), and it would show the ML (since FLs are not usually focal points in thrillers, they will team up with the ML or support him, but they won't be THE person the drama is about, and there is also rarely romance at all of any kind, but there is often bromance or buddy cop dynamics (i.e. The Good Detective, Stranger, Signal, Tunnel, Beyond Evil, etc. though Flower of Evil is a tweak on these)) growing in some way by the end of the drama as the ML fights for justice against all odds (he's also either wicked smart and a prosecutor/attorney, a detective/policeman with mad fighting skills) or to find the person responsible for the crimes being committed. There will also be EITHER intense business fraud/corruption, prosecution fraud/corruption and/or police fraud/corruption, or all three showcased at some point as integral to the plot's climax. These are a few elements off the top of my head for this genre, but this is my weakest genre in terms of familiarity... so maybe I shouldn't have made claims about how they portray gangsters and what makes a Kdrama of this genre a Kdrama. Oh well.

As for the rom-com (though a few items below can overlap eith melodrama), there's a wide variety here of mix and match tropes and cliches that you will find scattered throughout Kdramas, and some slight variations in pacing for when things will happen in which episodes. The pacing differences usually have a lot to do with slow burn (which usually climax somewhere in Episodes 10-16) vs. traditional romantic build (which has the confession and/or first real kiss happening in Episodes 7 or 8). Here are a few of the non-negotiables for the rom-com formula:

1. ML is sexually pure and innocent, even if he's the biggest jerk on the planet and a spoiled brat
2. If the leads date before Episode 7, they will not have a happy ending/stay together
3. The 2ML never gets the girl (and there's ALWAYS a 2nd lead, and he's almost always in love with the FL; the love triangle comes in if he tries to fight the ML for her, which is also VERY common); if there is a drama without a second lead like this, then it's because there's an 2FL who takes this role instead towards the ML)
4. The ML is either: royalty, rich, adorably devoted to the FL no matter what she does, an expert at fighting/martial arts, extremely smart or an expert at ___________ (insert anything random here) that plays an important role in the story, or some combination of all these traits and qualities.
5. The FL is clumsy and/or trips frequently, and ends up in the ML's arms AT LEAST once in the drama, but most likely three or four times (and said fall must have a "swoosh" sound effect to accompany it)
6. Nine times out of ten, there must be a trip to the beach OR a camping trip (or both)
7. There are parents of one of the main leads featured pretty heavily in the drama, and they either fawn all over their child's love interest (so, for comedic relief), OR are the biggest stumbling block to the main couple being happy
8. If the ML is royalty or a chaebol heir (or an heir of any kind), wait for their fiance-from-childhood (or an old girlfriend) to show up and create angst
9. Someone (either ML or FL) has an Episode or more of noble idiocy that they have to work past (this usually results in a temporary breakup)
10. The FL or the ML is a better person by the end of the drama (or overcomes some momentous obstacle) and in large part due to their love interest's presence in their life
11. The main leads fail to communicate about something majorly important at some point in the drama (and most likely more than one time)
12. The FL (or ML, but less common) is saved in some way by the other and/or one of them suffer an accident or injury that usually leads to the noble idiocy or ends it.😆
13. The FL and ML (almost always) have some previous connection to each other that they discover later in the drama at some point (often a childhood connection); if it's not with the ML, the FL probably has this connection with the 2ML.
14. No explicit sex scenes, though they may be started/implied, but the lovers are always clothed or covered

If a rom-com does not have 75% of some combination of this list of items, it's not a rom-com Kdrama. It's either an imposter or a wannabe.

Romance action dramas are usually a mix of the rom-com and thriller/crime dramas (i.e. Descendents of the Sun, I Can Hear Your Voice, Crash Landing, etc.), but that's a whole new list...

Anyway, how'd I do? Are you still scratching your head and thinking, "Yeah, I think she's making this stuff up" 😂?

I've never seen My Name, but I can imagine. But sometimes I feel like Netflix fails to really do the Kdrama well, haha (I wonder if Disney will also be a bit of the same, but I can't access their dramas in the U.S. so, I wouldn't know 😐).

Sometimes Netflix's original content just doesn't cut it for me, like someone trying to write the next season in a TV show a previous screenwriter helmed and just not getting there cause they're really trying to do their own thing while claiming it's "doing the same thing as the previous writer," but not. Just because you make something with 16 episodes and Korean actors, that doesn't make it a Kdrama. What I'm trying to say is that I don't trust all their content to really get the spirit of the thing. Non-Netflix Korean crime dramas, whodunits and thrillers can really be gory, terrifying and suspenseful when they write about murderers, serial killers and kidnappers (and would certainly NEVER EVER do a sex scene), but usually they seem to make gangsters a little more gimmicky, with the telltale paunch, patterned shirts, black pants and the swagger. They're all brawns (but even then, just brute force, not sophisticated fighting skills present) and no brains (in the stereotype I'm used to). The other point I'm trying to make is that if you can point to a drama with truly terrifying gangsters, it's most likely from Netflix or Disney (and your example checks out), not one of the cable network dramas.

But Netflix gripes aside, I do see what you mean about them being a little too not-scary, but it didn't bother me that much. I mean, they're called Kitty and Bulldog gang--how scary can they be? 😆 And it just feels SO Kdrama of the writers to portray them this way. (To me!)

I just always leave Kdramas with gangsters in them with the impression that Koreans secretly feel bad for their gangsters, and find them a pitiable lot. 😢 If that portrayal is completely false to real Koreans who live in Korea, then the only conclusion I can come to is it's a consistent Kdrama gangster cliche. 🤷‍♀️

But minus the serial killer/kidnapper plot (which is a plus, in my book!). :)

I have yet to see a Kdrama with gangsters who are genuinely intimidating in any way. 😂 I didn't see that recent drama with Ji Chang Wook, and maybe it would be the first, but all the other dramas portray them as kind of clownish and more often than not, kind of endearing and pitiable. 🤷‍♀️

In fact, this drama did a good job showing that most of the thugs didn't have a way out. They're not malicious guys at heart, but they've messed up their chances and their only way forward is the gangs cause no one else will give them any more opportunities. Even the fact that none really had spouses or children made sense, since they could just be used by their opponents to manipulate them into more shady stuff. Having loved ones is a liability.

I DO think it was completely unrealistic that the ex-cons would be executives at a huge company without training or education, but they made it work. But Ji Hwan was so lovable and earnest that everyone felt so grateful to him. It would make sense that all his employees are those who genuinely want to live better lives after messing up in the past, and who wanted to be worthy of Ji Hwan's approval and respect since he allowed them to have new lives with dignity and purpose. While it probably wouldn't work in real life, it worked in the story they told.

😂😂😂 Good luck! I procrastinate here, too. I get it. 😆

I agree they did a great job. I loved all kiddos' together and I think they all brought something unique to the ensemble.

I'm not super familiar with Cdrama or Chinese novel tropes but I totally see what you're saying. And while I do feel the similarities between the two dramas, I wouldn't venture to say either is a copy of the other.

I think tropes are impossible to escape and people get WAY too snobby about writers and creators needing to be "original." You mean those indie movies no one watches or those books no one wants to read but are super "original"? Give me a break!

Good, compelling stories don't have to be "original" to be good or even unique in their own way. We all have our favorite go-to stories or genres which always do the same thing over and over, technically, but who still manage to bring pleasure and enjoyment because of the creativity of the execution and they way choose to freshen up the formula, cliches, and tropes. I'm with you on this. 👍

Haha, nope. I always enjoy engaging the writers (or avid readers) on MDL and hearing their ideas cause they're always fun to talk to even if we don't agree on everything. They can usually see the nuance of a thing and are perceptive and insightful about characters, dialogue, pacing and plot, and I love talking nuance, subtlety, subtext and all this stuff. (And their writing is always fun to read! :)) I've encountered a few writers on MDL who don't even speak English as their first language, and even with the language barrier their writing voice and insights still come through. So cool!

Anyway, all the best with your writing endeavors! 😊

Haha, I never said the other two did badly (I loved them), I just said I thought Hyun Wook shines in this, in particular. And I saw him in this before Weak Hero and Twinkling Watermelon were a thing; it was before he was popular.