jarabaa

Thank you!

Precisely. Obrigado! You've not only paid attention, you have a good memory. It's funny how contemporary culture robs us of our memories, just turns them into a weird mush of images and sounds. But absolutely, we're told clearly that the tragedy was 10 years ago. We can all do the subtraction - that means 2011. And even if we don't have good memories, it is perfectly easy to substantiate what phones looked like in 2011, plus check that laptops were in existence, and identify what version of Windows we were using. We're talking about 2011, not 1011! Anyhow, yes, there were plenty of slim smartphones around in 2011, laptops were in existence - including very slim ones, and the version of Windows we see on the screen in this episode is accurate too. I myself am not a young person of 29 like you, but an old person of about150, but I still possess a very good memory, and I probably still have my (slim) smartphone and (slim) laptop from 2011 lying around in my house somewhere. Just to put things in context, I bought my first laptop at an airport electronics store here in London in 1998. Finally, I think that Kaew, Win and Wit all look their age. Which is around your age - 29. What do you think? The only thing that I'm curious about is the two men ... they look like very handsome men of 29, yes indeed - but not youths of 18 or 19. Yet I thought that ghosts didn't age ... ?

You BET it's true for straight couples. And a pity that probably not one straight couple on earth will ever be in a position to look at these issues in the way you suggest. Whereas for gay men, becoming a parent remains such a challenge that probably not one gay couple on earth will ever be in a position to be deceived by any "mystical romanticism" of reproduction. Finally, it's worth remembering that there are a good many children already in existence on earth (some of them brought into being by all too "deceived" straight couples) who are in need of some loving adult support right now.

Well, I am a really "older" viewer here - I hardly know what "fan service" and "shipping" mean! But I enjoy BL series like Lovely Writer, so I've had to educate myself. And of course I enjoy reading the many well-informed viewpoints, such as yours, about stuff that I know so little about. (I live in England and I am ... ancient!)

As I read about BL, I inevitably reflect on the reality of the wider global media/entertainment industry or industries. Outside of BL, over-the-top "shipping" of actor couples is very widespread and has a long, long history. Plus countless straight film star couples really HAVE fallen in love or otherwise got together on set. Right now, there are numerous male-female real and fictitious couples in the Far East who are the objects of feverish media and fan scrutiny. God knows what pressures they live with. (And some, probably many, of the actors are actually ... gay - yet have to pretend every day to be straight, in order to satisfy the expectations of fans.) As the "Me Too" movement has shown, across the media and the entertainment industry, women managing high-profile "star" careers struggle with self-harm, prescription drug addiction, depression etc - all consequences of the brutal milieu they work in. Alongside rape, sexual coercion and harassment on a huge scale. But there seems to be a general view that these facts, though harsh and brutal, maybe sexist and reprehensible - are ultimately somehow "normal".

A lot of the comment about exploitative fan service and crazy shipping of imaginary couple relationships in the BL world seems to reflect a distaste which feels rather homophobic - it always focuses on the sufferings of straight actors who are mistakenly assumed to be gay, or pairs of male actors who are falsely regarded as couples. I like the way that Lovely Writer did not go down that route. Gene and Nubsib ARE gay - yet end up subjected to harsh pressures - but their own love for each other is shown to be sweet and romantic. A man who DOES want to be in a straight relationship, Tum, is part of the mix (is he straight? or a gay man who falls for a woman...?) and his story is interesting and different. It isn't a storyline about an "innocent" straight actor who feels pressurised into going along with false publicity which suggests that he is gay; it's about obstacles put in the way of a male/female relationship. BL is an incredibly new sector of the media but it is already an exceptionally self-critical sector, full of interesting, funny actors, directors and writers who are prepared to shine a bright light on their milieu.

What a full, detailed, balanced and enlightening comment! I feel you're really EXPLAINING something - and not advancing some other angry agenda. Plus what you write is such a healthy corrective to the portentous mutterings of others who want to see the BL sector of the Thai media (and/or entertainment industry) as a bottomless "dark" abyss of merciless evil-doing. In reality, it's part of a fast-moving, intense, sometimes grubby, sometimes brutal industry - rather like the other parts and rather like other industries. In fact, series like Lovely Writer and Call It What You Want show that BL is in reality an unusually self-critical sector of the industry.

My favourite guys. The sweetest men on earth. The most gorgeous male couple in existence. Welcome back into our lives, Sun Bo Xiang and Lu Zhi Gang. Yes, like you, how fondly we remember ... THAT shower scene. Don't forget to invite us to your wedding - we can't wait! Sincerely, Your Adoring Admirers Around the Globe. PS. Still getting used to the hair, Bo Xiang. But ... yeah, liking it more & more.

Loved it. I became very involved ... and absolutely, there was plenty of gripping character development. And they were both very full, interesting, distinctive characters. A wonderful series.

You are absolutely right, I have in the meantime found some heart shaped items in the Bali Left Hand Park. And you have correctly identified the hilltop park. The view is of Taoyuan, not Taipei. I should have figured that out, as there is no Taipei 101 visible. Therefore it's another city! Indeed, Taoyuan. As seen from that Environmental Park you discovered. I had no idea Taoyuan was so big!

Ditto!

Taipei residents, please help! I love Taipei. Spent some time there in 2019 - when MODC was airing. Kept hoping I might spot the beautiful actors on the street one day (esp. Thomas Chang = Lu Zhi Gang). Happy memories ... except for the final ep. of that series. Anyhow, can anyone help with the settings of some of the lovely scenes here in ep 15-16 of Close to You? Where is the heart-shaped swing? Where is the hilltop park with the great views where Xing Si and Yong Jie meet in ep 15? (It's not Elephant Mountain, not Maokong ... where is it?) And the riverside location where we see Xing Si and Yong Jie at the end of 16? It looks like somewhere on the Keelung River near the Rainbow Bridge where love-crazed schoolboy Sun Bo Xiang declared his undying devotion to the one and only spectacularly gorgeous Lu Zhi Gang (as we see here, a fictional 8 years later, just as spec.gorge. as ever. Swoon...)

Excellent analysis - I love it! As they say, it really adds to my viewing pleasure. Meanwhile, and I hope this point is made in the storyline, being 0 or 1 is not all that clear-cut for those of us who are men who love men. (=The way I like to describe myself, though I have NO problem with the word gay.) It is perfectly possible to ... switch sides, to be one thing for years and years, and then to be the other, or to be both, or to opt out and choose not to have that particular form of intercourse. I feel this series is trying to give us a picture of real men's lives, not an impossible fantasy, so I think it's worth supplying this perspective from the real world which we understand these guys to inhabit. And men who come across as VERY 'masculine' may well be (enthusiastic) bottoms in the bedroom.

Wow, I'm crying too ... oy yoy yoy ... Lu Zhi Gang is just the most gorgeous man on planet Earth. And now he'll belong to our lovely Sun Bo Xiang day and night for the rest of time! Honestly, I watched MODC when I was still in Taipei in late 2019, and I became totally infatuated with the character Lu Zhi Gang. I dreamed I might run into the actor some day - Thomas Chang. No such luck. I know - ridiculous! But I loved the series (other than the last episode) and I loved the main characters, all four, and I especially ... "admired" Lu Zhi Gang. Ah well, Sun Bo Xiang has loved him ardently since he first saw him in the gym when he (SBX) was still a (passionate, impetuous) schoolboy - so he couldn't end up with a more loving and devoted husband. We need more happy endings that lead to yet further happy endings in other series.

Absolutely! I agree 100%. Especially as I have really enjoyed most (not all) of the Korean m/m love stories I've followed so far ... We must give them all the support and enthusiasm we can, around the world.

Liliana (if that's your real name) ... I am so glad you had the courage to come out to your family, but of course I was very alarmed to read about how your father reacted. I am sorry that the horrible things he said made you feel like a freak for a while - what a ghastly situation to be in, how painful - but I am so pleased you are now at peace with yourself - and even with your dad! That sounds like a bit of a miracle. I never came out to my parents - and they are now both dead. So I am impressed by what you report about your own decision, your bravery, what happened, and the more hopeful developments since then.

I did not find this drama very positive. I felt the whole message was that being a gay man is a hideous, sad, lonely existence dominated by fear and shame - and that a heterosexual relationship with a girl is what a gay boy should strive to "achieve" in life. I was sad that Jun's schoolmates hated him when they thought he was gay, and loved and applauded him when they thought he was straight (= kissing a girl). But I guess it does at least show, as you say, the "struggles the LGBTQ+ community faces". It certainly does that. But I would add: life for gay men and lesbians isn't endless struggle. This series was 8 episodes of misery, all focusing on the idea that being gay is a terrible fate, an endless ordeal, and heterosexuality was consistently portrayed as the wholesome, beautiful, trouble-free, conventional norm. In fact, in my own life, I have known plenty of happiness. I have been able to be who I am. In no way have I endured an existence of endless shame and suffering. Not at all. Nevertheless, I grew up in a much more hostile, anti-gay society and era than Jun! So - I definitely like your message. But I am not sure I like the message of this drama ...

I am interested in what you say about a "very Japanese way about making dramas". Plus what you say about always respecting a person's circumstances and how he or she engages with those circumstances - an engagement which may often be characterised as struggle.

The key turning point for me here is Jun's conviction, as you put it: "thinking everyone hates him and won't ever accept him + if he does not have a wife and a kid he's bound to be all alone and die alone". But what does this series tell us? What is its message? Is it saying that being gay is something Jun should embrace and affirm in his life, ultimately? Are we being invited to sympathise with his struggle and hope for a future for him as an out, self-respecting gay man - maybe even ... focusing ... for a change! ... on a relationship with a ... man? I am not so sure! I feel the series DOES in fact tell us that gay men are lonely, tortured misfits who are hated by the society around them. That is really all we see in the whole of this series - all 8 episodes. A totally negative universe for gay men. And the whole series is about Jun's relationship with a girl, We're being told that that is what's important in life. The kiss is presented as a glorious affirmation of the superiority of heterosexuality. It cannot be understood otherwise. The school DOES hate Jun the (possibly) gay boy - but it loves Jun the (seemingly) heterosexual guy who kisses his girlfriend in front of them.

The series does not challenge this homophobic worldview - it endorses it. At the end of the series, my guess is that he is about to announce to everyone that he is a "redeemed ex-gay", or a Christian, or the fiancé of a wonderful girl. Something like that. This series tells us repetitiously through 8 episodes that being a gay man is a miserable, hideous existence (= struggle, yes, plus grief, fear, self-reproach, shame, anxiety, melancholy, isolation, frustration etc etc) - and that being a straight man is a beautiful, trouble-free sunlit paradise of kisses, social endorsement all round, tenderness, harmony - plus immediately available, totally loving, committed girlfriends.

I wish. But ... as you can see from other replies, that's not very likely. Hating gays is BIG business in Korea. The Christian churches are very powerful there and they set the tone, having latched upon gross, virulent homophobia as their favourite central doctrine of faith.

Hmmm. I am being drawn into an argument about how I am supposed to, or allowed to, understand a relationship between a man who is clearly identified as male and wears conventionally male clothes etc and a person who is in reality male but wears women's clothing and seemingly is regarded as a woman by others around him. It ... isn't simple - and there are at least three viewpoints here which are of significance. First, the viewpoint of the "man" in the marriage. Does he regard his "wife" as --- male in female disguise --- a convincing woman --- a man like himself who is forced to wear apparel of no significance to him? Is he in love with his "wife"? Does he find this other person attractive and desirable? I realise that it is not accurate to label this relationship immediately as "heterosexual" or "straight". Likewise, the orientation of the husband, depending on how the story goes, cannot be simply defined as routinely "straight" - no. Depending on how the story goes. If he is totally turned off by the real maleness of his bride and yearns day and night to be united with a real woman - well, I'd say he's straight. But maybe the story doesn't go that way!

One thing which Tsuliwaensis touches on which would take the story into unknown territory: Suppose the husband is happy (= content, sexually turned on, in love etc) being with a person he knows to be male but who in everyday life "presents" as female? That could be interesting.

Then there's the viewpoint of the "bride"? Does he yearn to be a woman - in a relationship with a man? Is he disgusted by wearing women's clothing and being in a "marriage" with a man? Is he eager to be in a relationship (dressed as a man? dressed as a woman?) with a woman? Again, interesting possibilities.

And there's our viewpoint. Yours. Mine. Everyone else's. I won't repeat all the options (see above) available to us as ways of liking the relationship we see - or seeing the relationship we like. All I say is: think about it.

My preference - and I am allowed to have a preference, you know - is to follow the story of a relationship between two male persons who see themselves and male, see one another as male, and are seen by others as male. That is the sort of relationship which still seems to drive a lot of other people into a rage of hostility and disgust. A tiny example. A couple of days ago, a taxi driver suddenly told me very vehemently, apropos nothing at all, that he had just been horrified by the sight of two men walking down the street holding hands. Entirely spontaneously, he simply had to tell me how much he hated the sight of these two guys hand in hand. And so, I am rather interested in clearly male/male love stories - because something as sedate and unthreatening as two men holding hands literally drives a lot of people crazy with fear and antipathy. I am not very interested in story about a man and a person who, though male, appears to be female and is understood to be female by society in general - that's already moving a long way in the direction of what most people very warmly approve of and what I've seen a lot of in my lifetime: heterosexuality.

Finally, "abusive" comments. I respectfully and cordially invite you to re-read my reference to the existence of abusive and vituperative comments on this page. That's what I said - and I stand by it. I do not need to scroll down the page and collect lots of examples. They are here. Yes, indeed. Abusive AND vituperative. Where did I - as you complain - "throw" this word around "for things which it shouldn't be applied for"? Sorry, I didn't give any examples. But please accept: they exist. All over this page, and all over this site. I am endlessly amazed by the nastiness (= abuse and vituperation) which people pour out in responding to others. More than amazed. Bewildered, shocked.

Hmmmm, you introduced the issue of "young gay Japanese people" and what sort of representations of gay life they should be seeing. And you focused on the importance of being able to observe "struggles".

I don't think I ever said "I only wish to see wholesome and light stuff". No, I certainly did not say that.

But ... having lived decades of real gay life in various countries right here in this world, I would like to report that it isn't all "struggle". And therefore I do not want young gay people in Japan or anywhere else to get the message that being gay means a lifetime of misery. Because that ultimately is what a lifetime of struggle is. Why should we be giving this message to young gay people about their lives? As I say, I do not believe it is a very accurate message. Gay life is NOT all struggle. Plus it's a girl/boy relationship which is the focus throughout the series. And why would it be a good thing to tell young people that gay life is all about suffering? Why would it be such a good thing to lead them to believe that a boy-girl relationship has to be the natural focus of their lives?

I agree - at the VERY END of the series - in episode 8! - there is a hint that our hero Jun is ... maybe ... about to come out as gay. But - we don't even get to see that happen. Therefore, who knows what he is going to say? Maybe he is going to announce that he is an "ex-gay". Maybe he is going to announce that he is looking for the right girl to marry. Who knows? For whatever reason, after 8 episodes of misery, suffering, ambivalence and - yes, struggle struggle struggle - we are not allowed to see any sort of affirmation of being gay. We're just left guessing.

The series only amounts to 8 episodes. That's 8 episodes of suffering, internalised homophobia. shame, self-loathing, hiding, confusion, doubt, fear, etc.

Yes, indeed, I'm gay. And I have experienced quite a number of years living as a gay man in different societies. My conclusion is that [my] gay life has the same sort of mixture of agony and ecstasy as .... countless heterosexual people's lives. And that's despite the fact that I grew up in a world where there were NO positive representations in any form of gay men, a world in which an almost unquestioned homophobic status quo (reign of terror, more like it) held sway in every sector of existence. Nevertheless, I still say that I had enough ecstasy (plus contentment, serenity, enlightenment, passion, adventure and other good things) along the way to arrive at my - I think - balanced yet affirmative assessment of gay life.

But look at this series! Good grief. It's 8 episodes - and only at the very end of episode 8 do we get a glimpse of a possibility that Jun may feel good about being gay and may even be able to affirm this fact about himself in front of others. However, we do not even get to hear him do it. Instead, we have 8 episodes of self-denial, shame, agonized suffering, hiding, pretense, sadness, alienation, fear, revulsion, rejection, isolation, exclusion - etc. Not only that, but the focus of the whole series throughout all 8 episodes is ... a boy/girl relationship. It's only when he behaves in a heterosexual way that Jun receives any sort of affirmation.

In fact, I'm really rather disturbed by the claims by other viewers that this series is laudable because it deals with "hard truths" (@manicmondays above) and that it "leans towards reality". Says who? Whose reality? Whose hard truths? I grew up in much, much more difficult circumstances, a much more hostile world, than Jun. Yet I'm completely taken aback by the entirely negative, harsh, dark picture this series paints of gay life - and the miserable existence awaiting poor Jun if he turns away from his chance of knowing the infinite perfection of straight life. Is this really Japan today? Do people truly believe that this dark tale of self-hatred is reality?

Wow. Was that real? What did I just witness? As for what makes people get nasty, I've been wondering about that too. I have no idea. Maybe it's objecting to the "gay for you" trope. But ... I have seen plenty of people voice eloquent objections to that indeed very, very tired line in numerous contexts here on MDL and ... no abuse, no invective, no projectiles. Not sure why it ignited this particular fire-storm here. Was it all a joke, and some of us are just too lacking in subtlety to pick up on the clues?