But its how it has to be...not just how the creators wanted it. It is the crux of a time travel story and decides if it is actually well written or rubbish.
If the time didnt work in a loop as it does and thus all things in the past were already decided and set in stone...then the future or present setting of the story would be altered.
It is the whole multiverse issue.
If someone leaves the present and alters the past then that present is destoryed or no longer exists for that person to go back to. As they left a place in time in which the events that happened to make that future did not happen.
Thus u would get a story like Lovely Runner...(which has some gaping time travel holes in its plot) but overal is a decent stab at mutliverses. Everytime the female lead travels and changes the past, she arrives back in an altered future...or not the same that she left....thus she creates multiverses...and her and the male lead only end up together in a specific mutliverse...where she alters the past in the right way to build that future.
This story has a set present of which is never altered...and the way for the characters to be together in this present is becuase the past was already changed in a way to create this present. Thus, the story can only tell how the loop of time created this present...and it was the characters coming to understand how they themselves did this.
Any story that uses time travel to only give the characters what they want, as in they change the past but areive back in a future thats the same with only the thing they changed different...is bad writing and has a built in fallacy...and does not work...and b4 we say its a fake story and time travel isnt real...theoretically it is possible in the real world...but bound by these laws. We will never live in a world where world war 2 didnt happen...we cant change that even if we discover tomorrow how to time travel....because that past is already past and cant be changed...if it changed then our world and us will no longer exist. But a diverent reality where no one has ever known world war 2 at all. Also it creates the problem that if world war 2 didnt happen then also possibly time travel would never have been invented because the techonoly the world gained during that dark time and those discoveries are what lead to the invention of time travel in the first place.
But I hate all the characters except the best friend being framed and weirdly the Mom of the suicide kid...Im finishing episode 25...
Our main female lead is a good person...but to make the story they have her constantly make irrational decisions and approach every situation in the most round-about convoluted way to ensure misunderstanding, drama, longer run-time, and make her out to seem victimized as all the bad stuff keeps happening around her...but its not her fault she wants to do the right thing...showing how to write a spineless wet nooddle of a character with absloutely no Agency.
The male lead treats everyone cold and distant and like they are all annoyances...but seems like a decent guy. But given there are 100 episodes...and im only on 25...Im waiting for him to either thaw and become an actual good and loving guy...or side with his family and be a monster...im sure ill get both b4 its over.
The 2nd female lead is a waste of screenspace and I cant stand her on my screen. That goes for the whole female leads family...they are all awful people.
The chairwoman over acts and chews on every scene she is in to gurantee she is the loudest and most seen....
Uhg...the story is circular so it can keep going...spinning wheelsnof the same melo drama and calapsing wailing theatrics.
Solid review. I will observe that applying western notions of how timely the subject matter feels out of place…
Hey there, thank you for the ernest and well thought out feed back to my review. I do see your points, and how issues could be had with my take on the subject matter at hand. They are valid counterpoints with great support.
At the same time, I'm only half in agreement. When talking about any culutre that is not ones own, leniency and consideration for differences in time, place, and overall mindset must always be weighed. However, I am not one to fully buy into the us vs them construct that is in play a lot when critiquing or reviewing art. While I admitted that I could understand the improtance of an honest gay story being told given the modern day landscape that is Koreas political and social environment, that environment is also simultaneously not bottled. Western media and art as well as influence have been a part of Korean culture for quite some time. American works consistently perform well in Korean box offices, western stories are easily obtained online and in bookstores, let alone media and online presence that is available via the internet. This was just as true in the 2010s of Korea as it is now. Just as I am here in the west speaking of a show made and aired in Korea so too is the opposite true. Our world, unless in a country that is cut-off by its rulers from the outside, functions more wholesticaly than ever before and shared experiences and storys are abound. Just as I also mentioned that currently Angels in America is being performed by big name Korean artists in Seoul concurrently, art, media, and stories are openly shared between cultures.
As for the stance that HIV is less of an issue today and that Korean culture may not require such information be divulged, the show itself, shows this not to be true. From the reactions of his friends at the nightclub when talking about a passerby being positive and covering their glasses, to the military ejecting him because of his status, to jobs requiring bloodtests, (hell even foreigners such as English teachers must prove their negative status before being allowed into the country) to the fact that the main character gives the disease his own pet name and when facing a true relationship says you must know this about me and says Ill give you the night to decide if you want to continue with me...shows the world the character exists in makes HIV a paramount issue. Let alone the betrayal our lead feels by his boyfriend cheating on him and infecting him. This also shows that socially there is still ignorance and fear of it, and for the character to choose to hide it from sexual partners, and also full blown relationships, hell his last one was a married man with a child, think of how it can affect that family, is still very selfish, irresponsible, and does paint him in not a good light.
I do also stand by the story, as in not real life, but the story being told does not use HIV in a way that requires it to be part of the tale. If this was a story of a headstrong out and proud HIV person showing us his best life...then yes HIV being only a passing statement is grounded. But that is not what this show is about and it brings HIV in as a surprise and, again I hold true to emotionally stunted, as something that haunts the main character always and gives a handful of scenes on how it affects his life, but then does nothing beyond this...a plot point..some drama...that has no true lasting effects on the story as a whole. Thus it could be fully removed and nothing changes. Also, given the importance of the social landscape does the first broadcast show featuring a real gay experience have to include HIV, as if it is a given problem for gay people...when the straight stories of Korea hardly if ever do the same, though again it having higher prevelence in straight couples vs gay couples?
He said why, though. He kept in contact because it’s DH’s father. It made sense to him.
What if.....
HHH was game for a relationship from the start. That he actually recongized his feelings and was willing to go full on into something with DH...and DH refused.
The show has made a point with DH worried someone would see them. You take it, as the viewer, this is just because small town Korea and homophobia, but what if DH father new this about his son and there had been altercations...thus...
DH told HHH that he couldnt be with him until after Highschool. That he wouldnt do anything with him or be with him until he got out of his fathers house...
Thus HHH felt rejected and angry and broke the friendship group and became a bully putting distance between himself and DH and kinda hating himself for wanting what the world told him was wrong and what DH wouldnt allow to happen...the distance may have been DH request.
But then he watches DH fall for JY in the meantime...something DH told him wasnt allowed...and so the last day of school, the time over of them not allowed to be together, he immediately asks DH if he has something to say to him...and then has the hall fight cause DH is playing it like there is nothing to be said. DH does say they will talk after the exam tomorrow...so DH didnt consider schooling finished until he had a definite way out...and also had fallen for someone else.
But then what happens happens...and by chance or maybe original pact between the two, they end up at the same college...and now free from his father and also with distanc between JY and himself...DH follows through on having a relationship with HHH as promised and thus keeps himself cut-off from JY....
Even at the funeral when the two friends ask HHH why hes arriving with DH...HHH response was you have to ask DH that...as in he knows DH is secretive about this part of himself, especially in the small town...and thus gives that power to DH.
HHH is rude to JY because he knows hes a threat to him and DH...and has that right.
It turns HHH into a decent guy, shows DH keeps his word while explaining why he cut JY out of his life as well as why hed be so cold to JY as to protect himself from reingiting his feelings or hurting JY more, and makes it all make sense in my head...
Although its a lot of mental gymnastics and a very convoluted plot....its what I can come up with to make it all make sense as for what has happened so far and been shown...also keeps me from truly disliking any characters story arcs.
He said why, though. He kept in contact because it’s DH’s father. It made sense to him.
Im in agreement here. Im trying to understand motivations and character moves. Im guessing or hoping it will be explained further, the director, as everyone says, has a strong body of work so Im being patient. But so far I'm not really enjoying this series...
The translations are rough and some small dialogues are left untranslated. So, I'm not sure if my confusion comes from this or the actual plot...but Im guessing both.
The relationship between coach and JY seems very weird, out-of-character and with no true sense. He had the same issue with his prior coach, and doesn't have any relationship at all with that one. He has a horrible relationship with his own parents so it isnt a sense of family duty...let alone the man isnt his actual family. He says it was to try and connect with DH, but 12 years...12...with DH comepletely absent from his fathers life...at some point maybe year 3 or 5 or whatever...you must realize that DH isnt coming back and this is a ridiculous way to try and reconnect....Hell wasting that much time is already really really weird.
DH and HHH relationship is also weird. HHH is honeslty DH first "love" or crush not JY...and so far they had one fleeting moment of an intense look and that ruined everything between them. I mean it was a good look...but HHH becoming a violent bully towards DH over it is a bit extreme...latent homophobia or not. Also, I do not understand the whole scene at the last day of school. Why did HHH feel DH should have anything to say to him...their relationship as shown makes that whole blow up seem out-of-left-field. Then this is where I don't know if the translation is the problem...but the whole immediate conversation in the hallway afeter the classroom...I didn't even understand the argument or what was so upsetting to HHH...I mean the dialogue honeslty didnt make a lot of sense.
Then HHH somehow knows what went down at the gym on test day and going jnto the test tells DH...knowing what it would do to DH...and ruining the test...say its vindictive or whatever..........
But then DH becomes friends (or possibly a lover..not confirmed) to HHH after all of this...so he holds no ill will or issue with HHH but for some reason does with JY that he completely cuts contact and 12 years later is being nothing short of a dick to him....
Again...make it make sense.
The way the program showed the events...it seemed DH blamed JY for messing up his exam and leaving him for another year to live with his father. Yet, he immediately left his home...that very night to no one currently knows where cause HHH didnt see him again until a year later at college where their relationship was rekindled. Does he have shame that his father did this and cut ties? Ok kinda can see that, but its a very weak reason. Does he resent JY for having a relationship with his father regaurdless of the abuse when he his true son couldn't...maybe as well....is it all things together...possibly...something else...maybe...its all just a mess..
Only thing I do know...is right now...I dont want DH and JY together...that ship has sunk for me...and I think, considering DH actions and now cold demeaner, as well as his own red flag psychological issues....He and HHH are better suited for one another. The two have similar patterns in how they treat people and handle situations and also were attracted to each other first. That is if HHH is actually also bi/gay or has delt with that part of himself over the last decade.
Since Taekwando is a curse to be free from...which DH claiming now he is free...maybe that is where the show will head....with JY finally giving up on it too...finding a different path in life...something that brings him happiness...and it end with him freeing himself as well...and last frame meeting someone new that brings him happiness....
Yong's in his early 20's when he meets 1st boyfriend ep1&2. Hes in his mid 20's in 2nd bf. 4th bf hes 27. 3rd…
I think he was positive from the first frame of the show. That is why he gets so upset about the guy cheating on his army boyfriend with him because it was what was done to him. He apparently did his service while young or when most do, after his first year of college.
His mother died roughly 1 year after the realtionship with the closet guy ended. They were in a relationship for only 22 days though flirted b4 this. His mother was sick for roughly 3 years as said by the estate planner as she did it once diagnosed. But that 1 year is part of the 3 years so we have only covered 3 whole years with this story. There is roughly 1 year between his first relationship and the closeted guy.
This totals roughly 4 years...but when he confesses hes positive he says hes had it for 5 years, and this is immediatley after his mothers passing.
The show then shows the flashback to the guy and moment which happened b4 anything in the show itself....
So from the 1st frame of the series he was positive...but told no one including his relationships, friends, or random sexual partners he was positive until Ho Min...
That relationship lasts for 1 to 2 years...then they break up and there is a 1 year spans of time until thenlast episodes pick up that finish the story.
So on screen you see about 8 years of his life. But are privy to what happened over 9...his infection a year before our story starts...and in the last frame there is the 10 year celebration of him and his 3 male friends which means they friended up apparently his freshman year in college...so the story moves through his 20s and ends when he is begining his 30s.
At least this is how the maths and timetables are understood by me when watching. Maybe my maths arent mathing...but thats what i got.
So yeah he only tells 1 person in that 10 years but has 4 relationshipsnand mutliple more sexual partners.
I gave this an8.0 = B+, 4-Stars. A solid all around entry that will likely not disappoint.Watched entirely in…
So the flaws:
1) Usage of time.
There are a lot of missteps in how the 8 episodes covers almost 10 years of the main characters life. This is aggrivated by how they break the story into 2 episode mini stories, thus the 8 episodes tell 4 different love/encounters. Making large swaths of time defaulted and inserted inbetween the blackout of 1 story and the fade in of the next.
Since they only have 8 episodes many of the significant relations come and go very quickly and are delt with too clean and neatly. Our main character's relationship with Mi Ae seems little more than a blip on the radar with no lasting significance. Same goes with the loss of his complicated relationship with his mother, who if you add up the time jumps had a very slow march towards death over at least 3 years. The main characters childhood is told in blink or your miss it clips that bring up some serious trauma and issues that are mostly left unexplored or dealt with but seem just to be reasons for his bahavior, sadness, and state-of-mind.
Also, the clothing, accessories, look of the world and characters doesnt change from begining to end...which for a decade of time...especially for hip 20something city boys, is not realistic.
The final 2 episodes are dreamlike in their delivery and feel like a very different show compared to the previous 6 which make it a pain point that this is where we end our journey with these characters. In a weird sexual depression fever dream while having an affair with a married man who takes our lead to various hotels around the world while he recalls the love of a relationship he had ended, as far as i could tell less than a year ago. It is supposed to symbolize the end of this era in our leads life, but is so whimsical and non-concrete, more like a mental exercise than true substantial growth. The relationship that plays in our Go Yeoung's mind didnt yet seem to hold the gravity and importance it should as it was still very fresh. Youd expect this type of story after many years have expired and with age you look back and realize that was love and you lost it. The wisdom of old age making you see your regrets. It was further exacerbated by the relationship being mere minutes ago in the viewers mind as we had just spent 2 episodes moving through it begjning to end and seeing many of the scenes already...again a failure of how they use time
2) Stunted emotions and growth.
Possibly it was just the time limit but a lot of the emotions came and went with the wind. Like mentioned above in the time problem, it bleeds over here into a stunted growth and emotional problem. Our main lead has many revelations but changes very little of himself due to them. He deals with major life altering hurtles, death of a lover, death of his mother, suicide, and of course contracting HIV, but all of it comes in a scene and leaves in the next. This could be a societal issue, yet other Korean shows do not operate as such. This could be a character issue, but then the whole point of the show is about the emotional and mental growth of our lead andnwhat he wants and expects out of life which makes this here then gone approach to the story feel misplaced. It may be the fault of the writer of the original work or the writer of this adaption, as in they all have Peter Pan complexes, much like our lead, and thus do not know how to write true explorations of healing, moving through trauma, overcomming, and changing ones life. Instead its shed some tears then run to the bar and get trashed and then never talk about or deal with it again. Its solved, the emotions were let out...
It makes a lot of the issues, which are devstating and hefty, feel skin deep and easily managable. When he is driven to suicide by a toxic closeted self hating lover while trying to mend the broken relationship of his mother dying from cancer who has the same Christian damnation outlook on him...it grows until he tries to check out...but then wakes up saved, gives a thumb heart to his friends, and then moves on never talking about it again. Like well he didnt die...lets go get drunk....and party. And this his how the show handles every truly emotional milestone. As if acknowledging it happened is the same as healing through it.
3) The HIV card....
It is the gay plague after all...even though world wide, it is more prevelant in heterosexuals than homosexuals since the late 90s...but still this is a gay story, we must have HIV.
For Korea, and where they currently are on LGBTQ+ representation and stories, as well as real laws and overall societal view of homosexuals, I can see how having a realistic story that represents the trails of a realistic homesexual and what he faces including the taboo HIV seems bold and groundbreaking....
As a westerner this is 30 to 40 years too late...this whole series was reminiscent of a 90s gay story. From the film Jeffrey to the show Queer as Folk to even the 80s independent film (which too has a splattering of famous male leads) Longtime Companion. Let alone award winning Angels in America...which is currently being performed by famous Korean actors in Seoul as I type this.
At least they didnt make him die in the end.
But Korea has had films, that have dealt with these themes already, and are much older, let alone the western stories that can be watched. It made the story seem archaic and out of place. Made too late.
This is exacerbated by the fact the story would not have changed at all, if the character DIDN'T have HIV. It affects nothing. It is even brought in only half way through as an almost suprise twist. His contracting it is a brief monologue. He tells only 1 person that he even has it, he has no health issues because of it. It does not cause him to loose any relationship or sexual encounter. And it is little more than a plot point. Thus, simply having him NOT have it was an option as its only point is for him to say its with me till i die. Again it feels superficial and a stunted and an unneeded poor use. Thus, just as point 1 bleed into point 2, now point 2 bleeds into this point 3.
Last note on this, the way they introduce the HIV was confusing..as in did he contract it between his mothers dying and meeting this new boy. But then he meets the boy on the night of his mothers funeral. And it has only been 1 year since his last relationship...and then he says hes had it for 5 years...and then your like...did i miss a time jump...there are alot of them...and then you relaize wait...this happened b4 the show started. Hes been HIV positive since the first frame. And it slowly sinks in that you watched him have sex with mutliple partners and carryon two meaningful relationships without telling anyone involved that he is HIV positive. He then has more partners and doesnt tell them...this weirdly, at least for me, makes the HIV have a detrimental effect on the character. This is a serious sexually transmuted disease and he selfishly and irresponsibly goes around and does whatever he wants while hiding it so he wont be stigmatized or ostricized. He pretends....and it kinda makes him a really bad person.
8.0 = B+, 4-Stars. A solid all around entry that will likely not disappoint.
Watched entirely in 1 sitting.
Great acting, good intimacy, some strong chemistry, appropriate realistic skinship, 3 dimensional characters, some real-world struggles, heartbreaking moments, and adorably cute moments. Directing was strong, cinematography solid, texture and feel to the series was complete and both realistic yet simutaneously dreamlike. Hour long episodes in a Netflix-like 8 episode dosing with a decent budget and a cast with some recognizable faces and not just no-name-this-is-their-start actors.
HOWEVER, it has some flaws and shortcomings which hold it back from being an exceptional experince. Which I'll list in a spoiler tab below. Thus, it's held back from being great to instead being a solid good show. It is worth your time but its real world approach and overall sad and depressing ambiance and general story will keep it from being most peoples favorite or go to series.
question.. if u are h.i.v positive are u not supposed to tell all your partners or is that not the law now ?
I don't know if this is an actual law. Maybe in Korea. It is more the responsible and socially expected protocol, at least in the West. However, its everyones choice to do what they do, which is why mutliple partners is always a risk.
It did, again from my perspective, make me not like the main character as much. It really made him seem like a selfish and irresponsible person. But, that seemed to be a running theme of the show. Everyones selfishness and self centeredness and making realistically poor decisions in both life and love...so I guess it fits.
The show, though built on a false premise, was going along pretty well in episodes 2-4. I became invested and…
Um, this was an extremely rude comment and void of any discussion or counterpoints. Also it was a blatantly low brow attack that not only has no merit but simultaneously does nothing.
Was this a BL? I do not recall any male to male romance, but again as you stated it was far too complex for me. Possibly I do not understand love or was too deft-less to realize homesexual subtext. Otherwise there must be a point to bringing up the fact that you took the time to go through my profile and discover that yes at times I do watch BLs, you know other than your homophobia.
I suppose you missed that Ive rate 354 shows and 16 movies, the bulk of them heterosexual...
And by complex storytelling here, I suppose you are referring to the wow factor of secret labratories and abandoned hosptials where believed dead drs lie to psychopaths to control their killing tendincies as to do their bidding. Or ya know splice together brains to be the first dr to master brain transplants while littering their floors with the skulls of their unwitting victims as they sacrifice people for their experiments...
Or maybe its when the characters look off at the skyline and speak aloud to no one the plot points of the show or summerize the information that the last 10 minutes had shown...or even better when they fully explain their intentions and emotions as to make sure the viewer is fully aware that they are angry and going to exact revenge.
Yes, this complex narrative is mind boggling to me.
The show, though built on a false premise, was going along pretty well in episodes 2-4. I became invested and…
P.s. why would the elected president, who is the father to one of our now dead cops, releases the woman who ordered his child killed...and only after 3 years? Was it solely to have a revenge killing, but why couldnt he just orchestrate that in prison which would be much easier than getting her released.....
The show, though built on a false premise, was going along pretty well in episodes 2-4. I became invested and…
Finally got this finished...
Um....This was entertaining trash....I mean it takes itself very seriously, with all color bled out, everything gray, gritty feel. Decent amount of gore....etc so on...like this really wants to be a serious psychological crime drama...
But then there is the story....which...I mean...COME ON!!!! I dont know what words to use. It is the essence of a soap opera in every way. Like NOT drama....but melodrama. And melodrama that reaches so deep into the abyss of senselessness that it all but spits in the eye of cognitive thought.
Switched at birth positively tested psychopaths grow up to be caught in the path of a renegade deep state government plot to annihilate said (non existant) psychopath gene from society and uses a psychopathic mass murdering brain surgeon (who is one of the kids own father) to secretly perform brain transplants to reach its dark goal.
THIS IS THE PLOT....AND IT HAS AN 8.8 RATING HERE!!!
I mean characters come back from the dead. Half the episdes have a ta-da twist. One of our female leads has no point in being in the story at all, and because of this is left out of a large splattering of episodes. Our main detective is so unhinged that every other episode he does something that should have him fired and out in a nut house. He also goes around screaming on how he wants to kill a person and everyone laughs it off.
I mean, I can go on and on here....but this show is so incredibly ridiculous that I dont think the word ridiculous covers it.
All of the science is so fake or just blatantly false that this show feels like a 1980s scifi story instead of one written in 2021. Most of it was disproved years upon years ago.
And then at the end there is a pro God and pro religious message. That is halirous. I mean God works in mysterious ways...which in this show means to possibly give an answer to 1 characters prayer he causes lots of chaos and pain to a whole lot of people and most def ignores their prayers.
Also very pro death penalty and abortion while simultaneously condeming murder and preaching forgiveness with religious soap boxing. Its all a super weird mixed murky message.
And ultimately society votes for the deep state...
The show, though built on a false premise, was going along pretty well in episodes 2-4. I became invested and…
Made it to episode 10. The last 3 episodes have been so outlandish and ridiculous it has literally bounded head first into the absurd. This has become a soap opera. Complete with multiple psychos, brain transplants, and bodyswaps with 3 layers of killers and a government cover-up/ conspiracy. Everyone goes to the same hospital which has every renowned Korean surgeon and doctor working there, including all the psycho doctors. The 2nd female lead is aparently a killer magnet as she has her 3rd going for her and by the looks of it will be facing down a 4th b4 the shows end. Apparently a press badge can get our female lead into everywhere including morgues, police storage, and being a sidekick to cases. And I haven't been subjected to so much pseudoscience to try and make a story seem remotley plausable since watching The Day After Tomorrow.
How in the hell this came so highly recommended and caries an almost 9 on here is honeslty just blowing my mind.
Episode 1 is a mess. It has around 5 different starts instead of 1 cohesive narrative. Its choppy and sewn together…
The show, though built on a false premise, was going along pretty well in episodes 2-4. I became invested and was having fun. Episode 5 though became so very over-the-top and utterly unrealistic. And the main detective over acted to the point of cringe. Again not entirely his fault because the story here was cringe and just so ridiculous.
But of note on this character, yeah I dont really like him that much...and i feel there is no way he should be a detective. He comes off so unhinged all the time...he should be on meds and having regular sessions with a psychiatrist. A police force that allows him to be an active member is already a failure and losing....but its a drama i suppose.
Episode 1 is a mess. It has around 5 different starts instead of 1 cohesive narrative. Its choppy and sewn together in chaos. By its end, it has created a prequel to the actual series in an almost slipshod bandaided novice approach. It is a horrible starting point. Poor writing bundled with average directing. At least the actors performances are strong, or it would be absolute trash.
Episode 2 so far is the actual start of the series. And it also has better pacing and storytelling.
he likes the roles to be a simp lol so he accept it 😅🤣😅🤣😅🤣
I mean, I get what you're saying....
But hes 24. 6-7 years past Highschool. We have enough of mid twemty to early 30 year olds playing highschoolers...I kinda hate that...it socially makes highschoolers look older and seem more mature than they actually are...as an adult when I see highschoolers in real life they look like children to me. Then you watch a highschool show and its like why are they so hot? Oh becuase the actors are 24, 27, 29, 31...
Maybe being a director is a stretch for his age and look, but remember he was an intern...the only reason hes a director is nepotism...his family owns the company...which to be fair happens all the time in real life...even wedding impossible it was nepotism. Hes at this level not cause he earned or deserves it, but becuase his families rich and runs the place...so they put him wherever they want.
At 24 he could believably be an office worker, or even a low level.manager or team leader depending on how amazing he is, the school he graduated from, the type of business it is..etc...if it comes to a drama not deali g with him being the rich kid. Or, ya know, a college student or someone looking for work or a civil servant etc.
And I dont think he wants to get pigeon holed into the whole highschool drama scene...sometimes thats hard to get out of...not saying he wont go there in the future...but he is likely trying to be a star and get the whole ladies swooming under his belt that makes him big so he can pick projects he wants...
1 
2 
If the time didnt work in a loop as it does and thus all things in the past were already decided and set in stone...then the future or present setting of the story would be altered.
It is the whole multiverse issue.
If someone leaves the present and alters the past then that present is destoryed or no longer exists for that person to go back to.
As they left a place in time in which the events that happened to make that future did not happen.
Thus u would get a story like Lovely Runner...(which has some gaping time travel holes in its plot) but overal is a decent stab at mutliverses. Everytime the female lead travels and changes the past, she arrives back in an altered future...or not the same that she left....thus she creates multiverses...and her and the male lead only end up together in a specific mutliverse...where she alters the past in the right way to build that future.
This story has a set present of which is never altered...and the way for the characters to be together in this present is becuase the past was already changed in a way to create this present. Thus, the story can only tell how the loop of time created this present...and it was the characters coming to understand how they themselves did this.
Any story that uses time travel to only give the characters what they want, as in they change the past but areive back in a future thats the same with only the thing they changed different...is bad writing and has a built in fallacy...and does not work...and b4 we say its a fake story and time travel isnt real...theoretically it is possible in the real world...but bound by these laws. We will never live in a world where world war 2 didnt happen...we cant change that even if we discover tomorrow how to time travel....because that past is already past and cant be changed...if it changed then our world and us will no longer exist. But a diverent reality where no one has ever known world war 2 at all. Also it creates the problem that if world war 2 didnt happen then also possibly time travel would never have been invented because the techonoly the world gained during that dark time and those discoveries are what lead to the invention of time travel in the first place.
But I hate all the characters except the best friend being framed and weirdly the Mom of the suicide kid...Im finishing episode 25...
Our main female lead is a good person...but to make the story they have her constantly make irrational decisions and approach every situation in the most round-about convoluted way to ensure misunderstanding, drama, longer run-time, and make her out to seem victimized as all the bad stuff keeps happening around her...but its not her fault she wants to do the right thing...showing how to write a spineless wet nooddle of a character with absloutely no Agency.
The male lead treats everyone cold and distant and like they are all annoyances...but seems like a decent guy. But given there are 100 episodes...and im only on 25...Im waiting for him to either thaw and become an actual good and loving guy...or side with his family and be a monster...im sure ill get both b4 its over.
The 2nd female lead is a waste of screenspace and I cant stand her on my screen. That goes for the whole female leads family...they are all awful people.
The chairwoman over acts and chews on every scene she is in to gurantee she is the loudest and most seen....
Uhg...the story is circular so it can keep going...spinning wheelsnof the same melo drama and calapsing wailing theatrics.
So much more to get through....can I do it?
At the same time, I'm only half in agreement. When talking about any culutre that is not ones own, leniency and consideration for differences in time, place, and overall mindset must always be weighed. However, I am not one to fully buy into the us vs them construct that is in play a lot when critiquing or reviewing art. While I admitted that I could understand the improtance of an honest gay story being told given the modern day landscape that is Koreas political and social environment, that environment is also simultaneously not bottled. Western media and art as well as influence have been a part of Korean culture for quite some time. American works consistently perform well in Korean box offices, western stories are easily obtained online and in bookstores, let alone media and online presence that is available via the internet. This was just as true in the 2010s of Korea as it is now. Just as I am here in the west speaking of a show made and aired in Korea so too is the opposite true. Our world, unless in a country that is cut-off by its rulers from the outside, functions more wholesticaly than ever before and shared experiences and storys are abound. Just as I also mentioned that currently Angels in America is being performed by big name Korean artists in Seoul concurrently, art, media, and stories are openly shared between cultures.
As for the stance that HIV is less of an issue today and that Korean culture may not require such information be divulged, the show itself, shows this not to be true. From the reactions of his friends at the nightclub when talking about a passerby being positive and covering their glasses, to the military ejecting him because of his status, to jobs requiring bloodtests, (hell even foreigners such as English teachers must prove their negative status before being allowed into the country) to the fact that the main character gives the disease his own pet name and when facing a true relationship says you must know this about me and says Ill give you the night to decide if you want to continue with me...shows the world the character exists in makes HIV a paramount issue. Let alone the betrayal our lead feels by his boyfriend cheating on him and infecting him. This also shows that socially there is still ignorance and fear of it, and for the character to choose to hide it from sexual partners, and also full blown relationships, hell his last one was a married man with a child, think of how it can affect that family, is still very selfish, irresponsible, and does paint him in not a good light.
I do also stand by the story, as in not real life, but the story being told does not use HIV in a way that requires it to be part of the tale. If this was a story of a headstrong out and proud HIV person showing us his best life...then yes HIV being only a passing statement is grounded. But that is not what this show is about and it brings HIV in as a surprise and, again I hold true to emotionally stunted, as something that haunts the main character always and gives a handful of scenes on how it affects his life, but then does nothing beyond this...a plot point..some drama...that has no true lasting effects on the story as a whole. Thus it could be fully removed and nothing changes. Also, given the importance of the social landscape does the first broadcast show featuring a real gay experience have to include HIV, as if it is a given problem for gay people...when the straight stories of Korea hardly if ever do the same, though again it having higher prevelence in straight couples vs gay couples?
HHH was game for a relationship from the start. That he actually recongized his feelings and was willing to go full on into something with DH...and DH refused.
The show has made a point with DH worried someone would see them. You take it, as the viewer, this is just because small town Korea and homophobia, but what if DH father new this about his son and there had been altercations...thus...
DH told HHH that he couldnt be with him until after Highschool. That he wouldnt do anything with him or be with him until he got out of his fathers house...
Thus HHH felt rejected and angry and broke the friendship group and became a bully putting distance between himself and DH and kinda hating himself for wanting what the world told him was wrong and what DH wouldnt allow to happen...the distance may have been DH request.
But then he watches DH fall for JY in the meantime...something
DH told him wasnt allowed...and so the last day of school, the time over of them not allowed to be together, he immediately asks DH if he has something to say to him...and then has the hall fight cause DH is playing it like there is nothing to be said. DH does say they will talk after the exam tomorrow...so DH didnt consider schooling finished until he had a definite way out...and also had fallen for someone else.
But then what happens happens...and by chance or maybe original pact between the two, they end up at the same college...and now free from his father and also with distanc between JY and himself...DH follows through on having a relationship with HHH as promised and thus keeps himself cut-off from JY....
Even at the funeral when the two friends ask HHH why hes arriving with DH...HHH response was you have to ask DH that...as in he knows DH is secretive about this part of himself, especially in the small town...and thus gives that power to DH.
HHH is rude to JY because he knows hes a threat to him and DH...and has that right.
It turns HHH into a decent guy, shows DH keeps his word while explaining why he cut JY out of his life as well as why hed be so cold to JY as to protect himself from reingiting his feelings or hurting JY more, and makes it all make sense in my head...
Although its a lot of mental gymnastics and a very convoluted plot....its what I can come up with to make it all make sense as for what has happened so far and been shown...also keeps me from truly disliking any characters story arcs.
The translations are rough and some small dialogues are left untranslated. So, I'm not sure if my confusion comes from this or the actual plot...but Im guessing both.
The relationship between coach and JY seems very weird, out-of-character and with no true sense. He had the same issue with his prior coach, and doesn't have any relationship at all with that one. He has a horrible relationship with his own parents so it isnt a sense of family duty...let alone the man isnt his actual family. He says it was to try and connect with DH, but 12 years...12...with DH comepletely absent from his fathers life...at some point maybe year 3 or 5 or whatever...you must realize that DH isnt coming back and this is a ridiculous way to try and reconnect....Hell wasting that much time is already really really weird.
DH and HHH relationship is also weird. HHH is honeslty DH first "love" or crush not JY...and so far they had one fleeting moment of an intense look and that ruined everything between them. I mean it was a good look...but HHH becoming a violent bully towards DH over it is a bit extreme...latent homophobia or not. Also, I do not understand the whole scene at the last day of school. Why did HHH feel DH should have anything to say to him...their relationship as shown makes that whole blow up seem out-of-left-field. Then this is where I don't know if the translation is the problem...but the whole immediate conversation in the hallway afeter the classroom...I didn't even understand the argument or what was so upsetting to HHH...I mean the dialogue honeslty didnt make a lot of sense.
Then HHH somehow knows what went down at the gym on test day and going jnto the test tells DH...knowing what it would do to DH...and ruining the test...say its vindictive or whatever..........
But then DH becomes friends (or possibly a lover..not confirmed) to HHH after all of this...so he holds no ill will or issue with HHH but for some reason does with JY that he completely cuts contact and 12 years later is being nothing short of a dick to him....
Again...make it make sense.
The way the program showed the events...it seemed DH blamed JY for messing up his exam and leaving him for another year to live with his father. Yet, he immediately left his home...that very night to no one currently knows where cause HHH didnt see him again until a year later at college where their relationship was rekindled. Does he have shame that his father did this and cut ties? Ok kinda can see that, but its a very weak reason. Does he resent JY for having a relationship with his father regaurdless of the abuse when he his true son couldn't...maybe as well....is it all things together...possibly...something else...maybe...its all just a mess..
Only thing I do know...is right now...I dont want DH and JY together...that ship has sunk for me...and I think, considering DH actions and now cold demeaner, as well as his own red flag psychological issues....He and HHH are better suited for one another. The two have similar patterns in how they treat people and handle situations and also were attracted to each other first. That is if HHH is actually also bi/gay or has delt with that part of himself over the last decade.
Since Taekwando is a curse to be free from...which DH claiming now he is free...maybe that is where the show will head....with JY finally giving up on it too...finding a different path in life...something that brings him happiness...and it end with him freeing himself as well...and last frame meeting someone new that brings him happiness....
Id be good with that.
His mother died roughly 1 year after the realtionship with the closet guy ended. They were in a relationship for only 22 days though flirted b4 this. His mother was sick for roughly 3 years as said by the estate planner as she did it once diagnosed. But that 1 year is part of the 3 years so we have only covered 3 whole years with this story. There is roughly 1 year between his first relationship and the closeted guy.
This totals roughly 4 years...but when he confesses hes positive he says hes had it for 5 years, and this is immediatley after his mothers passing.
The show then shows the flashback to the guy and moment which happened b4 anything in the show itself....
So from the 1st frame of the series he was positive...but told no one including his relationships, friends, or random sexual partners he was positive until Ho Min...
That relationship lasts for 1 to 2 years...then they break up and there is a 1 year spans of time until thenlast episodes pick up that finish the story.
So on screen you see about 8 years of his life. But are privy to what happened over 9...his infection a year before our story starts...and in the last frame there is the 10 year celebration of him and his 3 male friends which means they friended up apparently his freshman year in college...so the story moves through his 20s and ends when he is begining his 30s.
At least this is how the maths and timetables are understood by me when watching. Maybe my maths arent mathing...but thats what i got.
So yeah he only tells 1 person in that 10 years but has 4 relationshipsnand mutliple more sexual partners.
1) Usage of time.
There are a lot of missteps in how the 8 episodes covers almost 10 years of the main characters life. This is aggrivated by how they break the story into 2 episode mini stories, thus the 8 episodes tell 4 different love/encounters. Making large swaths of time defaulted and inserted inbetween the blackout of 1 story and the fade in of the next.
Since they only have 8 episodes many of the significant relations come and go very quickly and are delt with too clean and neatly. Our main character's relationship with Mi Ae seems little more than a blip on the radar with no lasting significance. Same goes with the loss of his complicated relationship with his mother, who if you add up the time jumps had a very slow march towards death over at least 3 years. The main characters childhood is told in blink or your miss it clips that bring up some serious trauma and issues that are mostly left unexplored or dealt with but seem just to be reasons for his bahavior, sadness, and state-of-mind.
Also, the clothing, accessories, look of the world and characters doesnt change from begining to end...which for a decade of time...especially for hip 20something city boys, is not realistic.
The final 2 episodes are dreamlike in their delivery and feel like a very different show compared to the previous 6 which make it a pain point that this is where we end our journey with these characters. In a weird sexual depression fever dream while having an affair with a married man who takes our lead to various hotels around the world while he recalls the love of a relationship he had ended, as far as i could tell less than a year ago. It is supposed to symbolize the end of this era in our leads life, but is so whimsical and non-concrete, more like a mental exercise than true substantial growth. The relationship that plays in our Go Yeoung's mind didnt yet seem to hold the gravity and importance it should as it was still very fresh. Youd expect this type of story after many years have expired and with age you look back and realize that was love and you lost it. The wisdom of old age making you see your regrets. It was further exacerbated by the relationship being mere minutes ago in the viewers mind as we had just spent 2 episodes moving through it begjning to end and seeing many of the scenes already...again a failure of how they use time
2) Stunted emotions and growth.
Possibly it was just the time limit but a lot of the emotions came and went with the wind. Like mentioned above in the time problem, it bleeds over here into a stunted growth and emotional problem. Our main lead has many revelations but changes very little of himself due to them. He deals with major life altering hurtles, death of a lover, death of his mother, suicide, and of course contracting HIV, but all of it comes in a scene and leaves in the next. This could be a societal issue, yet other Korean shows do not operate as such. This could be a character issue, but then the whole point of the show is about the emotional and mental growth of our lead andnwhat he wants and expects out of life which makes this here then gone approach to the story feel misplaced. It may be the fault of the writer of the original work or the writer of this adaption, as in they all have Peter Pan complexes, much like our lead, and thus do not know how to write true explorations of healing, moving through trauma, overcomming, and changing ones life. Instead its shed some tears then run to the bar and get trashed and then never talk about or deal with it again. Its solved, the emotions were let out...
It makes a lot of the issues, which are devstating and hefty, feel skin deep and easily managable. When he is driven to suicide by a toxic closeted self hating lover while trying to mend the broken relationship of his mother dying from cancer who has the same Christian damnation outlook on him...it grows until he tries to check out...but then wakes up saved, gives a thumb heart to his friends, and then moves on never talking about it again. Like well he didnt die...lets go get drunk....and party. And this his how the show handles every truly emotional milestone. As if acknowledging it happened is the same as healing through it.
3) The HIV card....
It is the gay plague after all...even though world wide, it is more prevelant in heterosexuals than homosexuals since the late 90s...but still this is a gay story, we must have HIV.
For Korea, and where they currently are on LGBTQ+ representation and stories, as well as real laws and overall societal view of homosexuals, I can see how having a realistic story that represents the trails of a realistic homesexual and what he faces including the taboo HIV seems bold and groundbreaking....
As a westerner this is 30 to 40 years too late...this whole series was reminiscent of a 90s gay story. From the film Jeffrey to the show Queer as Folk to even the 80s independent film (which too has a splattering of famous male leads) Longtime Companion. Let alone award winning Angels in America...which is currently being performed by famous Korean actors in Seoul as I type this.
At least they didnt make him die in the end.
But Korea has had films, that have dealt with these themes already, and are much older, let alone the western stories that can be watched. It made the story seem archaic and out of place. Made too late.
This is exacerbated by the fact the story would not have changed at all, if the character DIDN'T have HIV. It affects nothing. It is even brought in only half way through as an almost suprise twist. His contracting it is a brief monologue. He tells only 1 person that he even has it, he has no health issues because of it. It does not cause him to loose any relationship or sexual encounter. And it is little more than a plot point. Thus, simply having him NOT have it was an option as its only point is for him to say its with me till i die. Again it feels superficial and a stunted and an unneeded poor use. Thus, just as point 1 bleed into point 2, now point 2 bleeds into this point 3.
Last note on this, the way they introduce the HIV was confusing..as in did he contract it between his mothers dying and meeting this new boy. But then he meets the boy on the night of his mothers funeral. And it has only been 1 year since his last relationship...and then he says hes had it for 5 years...and then your like...did i miss a time jump...there are alot of them...and then you relaize wait...this happened b4 the show started. Hes been HIV positive since the first frame. And it slowly sinks in that you watched him have sex with mutliple partners and carryon two meaningful relationships without telling anyone involved that he is HIV positive. He then has more partners and doesnt tell them...this weirdly, at least for me, makes the HIV have a detrimental effect on the character. This is a serious sexually transmuted disease and he selfishly and irresponsibly goes around and does whatever he wants while hiding it so he wont be stigmatized or ostricized. He pretends....and it kinda makes him a really bad person.
8.0 = B+, 4-Stars. A solid all around entry that will likely not disappoint.
Watched entirely in 1 sitting.
Great acting, good intimacy, some strong chemistry, appropriate realistic skinship, 3 dimensional characters, some real-world struggles, heartbreaking moments, and adorably cute moments. Directing was strong, cinematography solid, texture and feel to the series was complete and both realistic yet simutaneously dreamlike. Hour long episodes in a Netflix-like 8 episode dosing with a decent budget and a cast with some recognizable faces and not just no-name-this-is-their-start actors.
HOWEVER, it has some flaws and shortcomings which hold it back from being an exceptional experince. Which I'll list in a spoiler tab below. Thus, it's held back from being great to instead being a solid good show. It is worth your time but its real world approach and overall sad and depressing ambiance and general story will keep it from being most peoples favorite or go to series.
It did, again from my perspective, make me not like the main character as much. It really made him seem like a selfish and irresponsible person. But, that seemed to be a running theme of the show. Everyones selfishness and self centeredness and making realistically poor decisions in both life and love...so I guess it fits.
Was this a BL? I do not recall any male to male romance, but again as you stated it was far too complex for me. Possibly I do not understand love or was too deft-less to realize homesexual subtext. Otherwise there must be a point to bringing up the fact that you took the time to go through my profile and discover that yes at times I do watch BLs, you know other than your homophobia.
I suppose you missed that Ive rate 354 shows and 16 movies, the bulk of them heterosexual...
And by complex storytelling here, I suppose you are referring to the wow factor of secret labratories and abandoned hosptials where believed dead drs lie to psychopaths to control their killing tendincies as to do their bidding. Or ya know splice together brains to be the first dr to master brain transplants while littering their floors with the skulls of their unwitting victims as they sacrifice people for their experiments...
Or maybe its when the characters look off at the skyline and speak aloud to no one the plot points of the show or summerize the information that the last 10 minutes had shown...or even better when they fully explain their intentions and emotions as to make sure the viewer is fully aware that they are angry and going to exact revenge.
Yes, this complex narrative is mind boggling to me.
Um....This was entertaining trash....I mean it takes itself very seriously, with all color bled out, everything gray, gritty feel. Decent amount of gore....etc so on...like this really wants to be a serious psychological crime drama...
But then there is the story....which...I mean...COME ON!!!! I dont know what words to use. It is the essence of a soap opera in every way. Like NOT drama....but melodrama. And melodrama that reaches so deep into the abyss of senselessness that it all but spits in the eye of cognitive thought.
Switched at birth positively tested psychopaths grow up to be caught in the path of a renegade deep state government plot to annihilate said (non existant) psychopath gene from society and uses a psychopathic mass murdering brain surgeon (who is one of the kids own father) to secretly perform brain transplants to reach its dark goal.
THIS IS THE PLOT....AND IT HAS AN 8.8 RATING HERE!!!
I mean characters come back from the dead. Half the episdes have a ta-da twist. One of our female leads has no point in being in the story at all, and because of this is left out of a large splattering of episodes. Our main detective is so unhinged that every other episode he does something that should have him fired and out in a nut house. He also goes around screaming on how he wants to kill a person and everyone laughs it off.
I mean, I can go on and on here....but this show is so incredibly ridiculous that I dont think the word ridiculous covers it.
All of the science is so fake or just blatantly false that this show feels like a 1980s scifi story instead of one written in 2021. Most of it was disproved years upon years ago.
And then at the end there is a pro God and pro religious message. That is halirous. I mean God works in mysterious ways...which in this show means to possibly give an answer to 1 characters prayer he causes lots of chaos and pain to a whole lot of people and most def ignores their prayers.
Also very pro death penalty and abortion while simultaneously condeming murder and preaching forgiveness with religious soap boxing. Its all a super weird mixed murky message.
And ultimately society votes for the deep state...
Entertaining..sure...good...hell no....
5.5 from me
How in the hell this came so highly recommended and caries an almost 9 on here is honeslty just blowing my mind.
But of note on this character, yeah I dont really like him that much...and i feel there is no way he should be a detective. He comes off so unhinged all the time...he should be on meds and having regular sessions with a psychiatrist. A police force that allows him to be an active member is already a failure and losing....but its a drama i suppose.
Episode 2 so far is the actual start of the series. And it also has better pacing and storytelling.
But hes 24. 6-7 years past Highschool. We have enough of mid twemty to early 30 year olds playing highschoolers...I kinda hate that...it socially makes highschoolers look older and seem more mature than they actually are...as an adult when I see highschoolers in real life they look like children to me. Then you watch a highschool show and its like why are they so hot? Oh becuase the actors are 24, 27, 29, 31...
Maybe being a director is a stretch for his age and look, but remember he was an intern...the only reason hes a director is nepotism...his family owns the company...which to be fair happens all the time in real life...even wedding impossible it was nepotism. Hes at this level not cause he earned or deserves it, but becuase his families rich and runs the place...so they put him wherever they want.
At 24 he could believably be an office worker, or even a low level.manager or team leader depending on how amazing he is, the school he graduated from, the type of business it is..etc...if it comes to a drama not deali g with him being the rich kid. Or, ya know, a college student or someone looking for work or a civil servant etc.
And I dont think he wants to get pigeon holed into the whole highschool drama scene...sometimes thats hard to get out of...not saying he wont go there in the future...but he is likely trying to be a star and get the whole ladies swooming under his belt that makes him big so he can pick projects he wants...