Eleison

I watched the first two episodes (that was all Viki had available as of yesterday) and the pacing is lightning speed with funky editing that feels like they're skipping stuff. Does the pacing slow down and take its time in later episodes? It just feels kind of slipshod and slapped together so far...

Also, are we supposed to think the FL and ML have a strong friendship from the past/when they were younger? The opening sequence where the ML maintains she betrayed him and his father, seems to indicate the leads have this deep bond (from the academy?), but then when "He Ru Fei" shows up in court and denounces the ML, the ML doesn't even seem to notice the difference in build and voice of the man who is now posing as He Ru Fei. I just found these parts the hardest to swallow (there were other, smaller parts that were also fairly unconvincing, though). I can stomach a few of these moments where suspension of disbelief is required, but more than a couple of them is cringey.

(And I agree the FL... looks like a woman even dressed "as a man".)

I'm just coming off of just finishing Flourished Peony and In The Name of Blossom and they feel superior in every way to this as far as quality, which makes the faults scream at me in this one. 😅

So, if anyone resonates with what I'm noticing, I'd just like to know if the quality improves or not so I can decide if I want to keep watching.

*sigh*

True, though there's plenty of emperors becoming emperors because they overthrow brother or uncles, etc., so why not in this case? He just needs "justification" and supporters, which I feel like could have been easy for him to come up with. In the Cdramas it seems the emperors get to pick amongst their sons who gets to be crown prince, and it isn't always just the son of the empress.

I think the irony of a harem/multi-wife setup is still so interesting. Isn't one of the purposes of these kings/emperors having multiple partners is to allow for the opportunity to have many children/sons so that the king/emperor will for sure have someone to succeed him if many die in childbirth or through disease? But then, due to all these many, many children, they now have all these ambitious boys fighting for the throne which makes the job extremely perilous for anyone who lands it.

It just seems like a massive blindspot of the past; I guess I can think that, though, since the modern world puts almost no emphasis on the concept of preserving a bloodline anymore. Can't think of any other reason leaders of the past would think a harem was in any way a good idea. 😅 Too many people with a case to be made for why they should rule over their brothers...

Of course! That's what a page like this is all about. 😉

Though it seems the last thing a person with suicidal thoughts would need to hear is that they are being selfish by having no hope? I think that's why this drama triggers a lot of people.

I kind of have a hunch that the least helpful things for a hopeless person to hear are things like, "be grateful," "try harder," and "do better." And that's what this message of "suicide is selfish" will sound like to someone who's so miserable living they'd rather contemplate dying.

Maybe this drama would help certain types of hopelessness and certain types of hopeless people, but to some it probably sounds like another thing they have to do/know they should see/realize that they feel absolutely powerless to accomplish. No one wants to welcome death.

I actually think it's insane that a sageuk with 50 episodes from as far back as 2015 still has an 8.7 on MDL. That means it must be exceptional compared to other sageuks because they tend to be rated lower than other kdramas, especially older ones. It also says a lot about SFD that Nirvana In Fire (a fabulous drama with a 9 on MDL and also from 2015) is listed on this as a recommendation. I would just llove for it to come to Viki in the U.S. so I can finally see what all the fuss is about!

Yep, still waiting for it. Scarlet Heart with IU finally made it to Viki here, so maybe? Someday? *sigh*

And what is he supposedly cancelled for doing?

Whoa, trippy seeing Lee Min Ho so far down on the cast list and listed as a "Support" role. 😅

I agree! They made it sound way too difficult. And even if their parents were manipulative and controlling, if it was clear it was just a TRIP, I can't imagine them being super opposed to it. Ling Xiao's mom was a complete basket case, though. And her arc at the end was resolved way too quickly and easily.

I also love BOFs. I showed it to my sister and we both decided that we shouldn't like it, in theory, but we do. 😅 There's something so addictingly cozy about it. The wonderful old Kdrama OST, the tacky fashion and hair, the tropes and cliches galore--I don't know, but it's up there with some of my favorites of all time, too! Gu Jun Pyo just has one of the best, classic, jerk to sweet boyfriend chaebol arcs. (I also really liked the Thai version).

Princess Hours is a toxic mess, and I always skip all the boring adults talking, but I also absolutely love parts of it that I never get tired of rewatching. I have the same kind of relationship with BOFs. 😅 Those toxic oldies but goodies. 🥰 I can only watch and enjoy if I accept that the way these relationships work is fantasy, because they'd be a train wreck in real life.

Legal apps to watch dramas would be Rakuten Viki, Netflix, Prime, and Disney +. They mostly all require subscriptions, though.

I've wondered the same, but the way I reconcile it is that if they did that, I suppose that would mean they've stooped to his level, and started playing his game. Murdering opponents is what Prince Ning would do, not what someone who values justice and integrity would do. It's a slippery slope once you allow yourself to pop someone off (even in the name of "justice"), but then the line may get blurred. How bad does someone have to be before assassinating them becomes acceptable? Tricky to determine.

I also wondered why Ning didn't just BECOME the emperor. Why use his younger brother as a puppet when he could have ruled? It might have taken some maneuvering, but he could have pulled it off, I think. (I'm glad he didn't, of course, but most guys like him want absolute power, and he didn't go for it when the opportunity presented itself. 🤷‍♀️)

But Joy Of Life has transmigration, doesn't it? And wasn't that to evade the time-travel element from the novel?

And so the government doesn't ban this stuff in novels, just in media released on public networks?

So strange. Do they really think people can't separate reality from fiction? 🤔 I suppose if these beliefs are not fantasy, though, for some, it might be harder to do? What about all the xianxia thay have SO MUCH rebirth in them?

It also makes me wonder how dramas like Flourished Peony made it through censorship? It has very anti-patriarchal themes, and even makes filial piety look bad. But on second thought, maybe it's because the Chinese put a lot of emphasis on work, and they actually like having depictions of women working since it aligns with their values of everyone working hard and making money? All the costume dramas I'm thinking of that have very modern relationship dynamics all have plots with women working and making money in them (always the most boring part of those dramas, too; I liked the FLs' independence and autonomy and that they showed women capable of doing those things, but the business part is always kind of meh). Honestly, that's a little unsettling to consider. 😬

That's the happy part, but one of them passes before the other at the end, I believe.

From what I've heard it's bittersweet. It follows the leads through their lives as they grow old together. You can probably guess where that leads for at least one of the main characters. 😉

Ah, I found him confusing from Episode 1 of Flourished Peony, so I didn't mind that his character was all-over-the-place and they just randomly popped him off at the end. He was pitiable at points, but also a creepy scoundrel with no sexual morals as far as the FL was concerned. He actually reminded me a lot of the FL's husband in The Double. Kind of a similar narcissistic, "the-world-is-against-me" kind of character who always makes excuses for his choices. Never learned how to listen to anyone, or stand up for himself.

I liked both, but Season 2 has lots of drama tropes that make for some frustrating episodes that drag out the growth of our characters longer than many liked. I thought the tropes were used effectively in context of the themes, as Season 2 is more about a couple working out how to be individuals/autonomous in their own dreams and aspirations as they grow closer and more vulnerable, but also trying to build a life together. That process is necessarily a messy one. If you go into it knowing there will also be a decent amount of that, I think it can be enjoyed for what it is in context of the larger story being told.