Orangevine

Thanks)))

Haha, yes, the least suspicious character is the first in line. I must admit, though, I fail a lot when trying to guess the murderer, especially if it's a really convoluted story.

BTW Signal and Stranger are two of the most famous K-drama detectives but other dramas mentioned are of varying quality. I have a rated list of detective J-dramas: https://kisskh.at/list/Y4aKvEQL, if you are curious about them.

Unnatural and Ruroken are the best of Japanese entertainment (and my ultimate faves)! It's very nice to see them mentioned.

For those who want to watch superb J-drama detective I'd recommend Dele. And for the fans of Japanese action movies - Kingdom (2019).

It's like if the show spent this much money on the guest star it would be a waste not to give the star the most important role (aka the murderer). Granted, the viewer has to be familiar with trendy actors to spot them.

J-dramas can't usually afford trendy actors to play in the episodes of procedurals. So the culprit would be played by the acclaimed actor but not by the hottest commodity of the hour. I guess American tv has money to afford it.

While everybody is discussing the finale I'm still at episode 19 and I am clutching my pearls because that topless scene under the rain was completely unnecessary. I can't believe the level of shamelessness of this drama! lol

Yeah, we do, though I sound a bit too harsh in the header: It's not that I dislike classic British style, it's just not my favourite. I really love all of the Agatha Christie books and I have a very deep respect for Detective Conan franchise that is still relevant in Japan. But as I'm more of a sucker for charismatic hard-boiled detectives I kind of gravitate towards police procedurals instead.

Thanks))

Border is ridiculous in that aspect: even the random criminal who put a bullet in your brain is in fact your boss! Crazy stuff.

Tunnel's solution is a great one. I can't believe you recognised the first culprit from just one sentence XD That's just too cool. I need to work on my deduction skills))

Save me 2's solution is another great one. Though it is closer to 'the least suspicious character is the villain". It made me think about where actor's typecasting was used to the same great effect. All I can think about is a sweet old man (played by the actor who always plays sweet old men) that turned out to be the villain just to turn out to be framed in at least two different procedural J-dramas. J-dramas need to up their game.

Haha, yeah, everyone is talking about Stranger in the comments.

Thanks for kind words))

Missing Noir M sure fails to make absurd believable. I wonder though if J-dramas relative shortness helps with producing more solid episodic dramas. After all, writing 8-11 episodes is a lot simpler than say 22.

These points are really interesting! It's fascinating that K-dramas have to take typecasting into account to such a degree because there are too many great actors who never play good guys. In a sense, K-dramas already established some "local" tropes and it's getting harder and harder to fool savvy viewers.

The way to battle it by revealing the culprit early on is, indeed, a great solution. Considering that many procedural K-dramas are dark and the viewers know that even survival of the main characters is not guaranteed (which can't be said about J-dramas, for example), mystery reveal does not lower the stakes significantly.

In the classic British detectives the trick behind the puzzle is often the most important element of the story. In some K-dramas, the main intrigue is whether the characters will be able to withstand against the threat. In a sense, this shift of focus to how-dun-it is similar to those very different takes on the genre.

True, true. I feel bad saying it but the clue "the murder and the other events seem to be related to me personally" the main character kept bumping in had the most unsexy resolution in ever.

Thanks!)) Wowow keeps making detective shows that one won't find anywhere else in Japan. I can't wait to watch their new dramas.

You didn't ask but I have a rated list of detective J-dramas https://kisskh.at/list/Y4aKvEQL It got all of my faves! So if you are ever bored check them out. Some J-drama mysteries can easily rival the best shows from other countries.

Ah, that's too bad.

Oh! That's cool! Anaban was very hyped.

Thanks)) Yes, exactly, I totally agree: K-dramas deal with "class issues" while J-dramas deal with completely different issues (what with Japan being one of the most well-off countries in the world).

I am not from the first world country so it's that much easier for me to empathise with K-drama POV. However, J-dramas with their sweet idealism are really nice too.

This difference in values leads to really bizarre remakes. Japanese versions of K-dramas look downright wild XD I've never watched Korean versions of J-dramas but they must contain the most reserved rigid characters ever.

Thanks)) Ahaha old rich man gardening is a staple of "I'm totally evil", it's too true.

I've never watched Thai detectives but you described the culprits very vividly. I can just see those femme fatales with red lipstick or innocent look in their eyes and bitter guys who want all the inheritance. I think, these culprits are quite common in the K-drama romcoms too.

Haha I was thinking about Red John just recently - Mentalist sure focused on the ultimate enemy a lot.

On the other hand, I can't help but compare Japanese, Korean, and Chinese procedurals to the Western ones. I always took shows like Bones for granted but, in fact, it's not at all easy to make them. So maybe it's now wonder that they run in the same issues (and turn their main characters into criminals or marry them off when scriptwriters run out of ideas).

That's a really good point. I recently watched a police procedural where the whole intrigue was "the final enemy is a corrupted higher-up. Oh no, it is the main character's boss instead! Haha we got you right, it actually is the higher up."

I guess with police procedurals there is an expectation that the shows must be somewhat realistic. So they either choose corrupted boss (or serial killer) or destroy their realism (because Moriarties are too rare in the real world).

Ahahah true. It's too bad Moriarty-esque evil masterminds do not exist in realistic stories.

BTW I gave Iari a try thanks to your suggestion! I found it a bit too dark for my taste but it blew me away with its production values.

SPEC is sure different. It's great drama but like Twin Peaks it's in the genre of its own. It's funny to think that back then Kamiki was not that famous yet.

Haha, yeah, Kagi no kagatta is an ultimate locked room mystery about private detectives who manage to avoid being betrayed by their boss due to not being a part of the law enforcement. This kind of dramas (especially Kizoku tantei) always make me suspect a butler or a gardener in the true British style. I remember watching that drama with Sakurai where he plays a butler and suspecting the hell out of him.

I must admit, I would expect Kindaichi to have a father figure villain (Narimiya in the more recent version always stroke me as suspicious) but, I suppose, this franchise is really different.

I heard a lot about Anaban! Another mystery drama of a special genre. I wonder how many people guessed the ultimate villain right. The ratings of the last episode were insane in Japan.

Japan is so obsessed with Agatha Christie, right? They call their favourite hero Detective Conan but he takes after Poirot not Sherlock Holmes, in my opinion.

Woah, what kind of detective J-dramas have you watched? Tell me cause I must give them a chance. I must admit though that the ultimate enemy prediction is true only for the case-of-the-week police procedurals with overarching plot-line. So, for example, Unnatural, Dele, Odoru Daisousasen, etc would not fit this list.