Ryn

They're both middle aged though. No exploitation of youth here. Idk if that was clear to you.

Right? Agreed. GMMTV did actually make 'Three Will Be Free' which I haven't watched yet, but as far as I understand is about a poly throuple between two cis guys and one trans woman (also played by Jennie). I think that counts, technically.

Both 'City of Stars' and 'The Sign' have cis man x trans woman side couples. The Sign is a better show in general, but the side couple in City of Stars gets more of a storyline. 'Secret Crush on You' has a cis guy x kathoey side couple, where the kathoey character struggles with their gender. That show is incredibly silly and cringe, but if you look beneath the surface, the message it's trying to send about weirdos being acceptable and worthy of love is really solid. The trans actress Paper Peerada also got some pretty good roles in 'Gelboys' and 'War of Y' (though that last plot did her dirty in the end). And there's 'The Iron Ladies' from the year 2000 of course, also really fun, highly recommend. Oh and also obviously there's '23,5', which has a side couple that consists of two trans women. But yeah so no main roles in full length series, especially no romantic roles. Oh wait lol I forgot about 'I'm the Most Beautiful Count'. The lead in that is kathoey (but does not fully identify as a woman from what I gather). Such a good show.

'Saneha Kap Cheewit' has a trans guy as a main role, and I absolutely loved that show, but it seems to be on its way to becoming lost media. I'm not sure there's anywhere left to watch it with English subtitles. It has a solid ace storyline too, really cool.

I've seen quite a few butches/toms, mainly in GL. My favorite one is the movie 'Yes or No' from 2010, but I think once 'Be My Angel' starts airing, that one will probably be my new favorite. The trailer is impossibly adorable.

So yeah there's not nothing, but my dream is one of those 'Boys in Love' style inane ensemble romcoms, except every character in every couple is some shade of trans or gender-nonconforming. If they can make 500 romcoms where every character is a gay man, why not 1 where every character is trans? One can dream haha.

The GL and BL genres are not about realism haha :)

I like that kathoey get to be the main characters for once, but I don't like that they're all still given the same old comedic relief loud flamboyant caricature role that Thai transfemmes almost always get. There's nothing wrong with being like that, it's just monotonous if every character is like that. I want to see transfemmes playing something else too. Where are my shy and anxious trans girls? Having four of them in lead roles should be the perfect recipe for showing four very different characters, but based on the trailer, it doesn't look to be heading that way.

I'm pretty sure the main four are kathoey, which is a very broad word that could mean drag queen, trans woman, nonbinary transfemme, or feminine gay man. The lines between those identities are often kind of blurry in Thai culture. It's more of a continuum.

Thai pronouns work very differently from English ones. Most Thai pronouns are not exclusive to any gender. Thai pronoun usage depends more on relative age to your interlocutor, formality, close-ness, status, profession, etc, than on gender. Most linguistic gendering that happens in Thai happens in its various ways of saying 'I' and in politeness particles 'ka' and 'krub'. But all kathoey (including the ones who still identify as men) lean strongly towards using the feminine politeness particle 'ka', so that doesn't actually tell you what you want to know. I guess linguistic gendering in Thai is more related to gender expression than to gender identity.

Thai gender-nonconforming characters tend to mix and match and change language usage depending on the social situation they're in, and some will call themselves a woman in one scene and emphatically not a woman in the next, so on the one hand that makes it next to impossible to figure out what they'd use in English and on the other hand kinda makes it feel like they'd be pretty blasé about it anyways. I don't even think it's really necessary for them to have a pronoun preference for English pronouns, in the same way that it's not necessary for you to have a preference for Thai pronouns because you don't speak Thai, if that makes sense.

So long story short, idk what their pronouns are. Probably going to default to they/them. Unless the show indicates otherwise once it starts.

The actress Golf Kittipat is clear about being a transgender woman though, so at least the pronouns are clear for her. I'd assume the same for the character she plays.

I don't want to share a bathroom with anyone at all thank you very much. Sinks though, not much of a problem. I really don't care what the gender of the person washing their hands next to me is.

You seem to be under the impression that I'm a man. That's silly. It tells me you didn't read my comments very well.

As for my personal motivations, I'm boob-less since two years ago, and I'd really appreciate if you genital-obsessed gender critical weirdos didn't start transvestigating me over my recently flat chest. Also, strange concept, I care about the safety of queer people and their ability to participate in public life without getting hatecrimed by the likes of you. Third, stalls are stalls, and it's kind of ridiculous to me that we've gendered them. That's an artifact of the past, if you ask me.

It's really amazing how you guys are the ones trying to verify everyone's genitals at the door and you still manage to call the people who are just trying to pee in peace 'perverts'. Gender criticals creep me out. If I could choose any group of people to kick out of public restrooms for being a safety hazard to everyone else, it'd be gender criticals. Like, mind your own business and move along. Wtf are you eyeing strangers in other stalls for?

"Won't someone PLEASE think of the children!?!". You sound like a mix between Anita Bryant and that one Simpsons parody. Taking away people's rights and safeties always goes down a little easier when you can make it about a hypothetical child, doesn't it? But are we going to ask child-protection organizations how best to prevent child abuse? No, course not, don't be silly. Those organizations wouldn't name 'single-sex bathrooms' as part of their top 50 priorities, obviously.

Queer kids exist. Bathroom bans means that they're being sent into bathrooms where they are in danger, often in their own schools, every day. I'm sure you can imagine how that kind of bullying plays out. Won't someone please think of THOSE children.

Tell me where these stall-less large public bathrooms for women exist. Are they all supposed to piss into a communal gutter? No doors, no walls, nothing? Come on. You know that's BS. If those do exist, then sure, make the communal gutter a single-sex space I guess, has nothing to do with the stalls that exist in 99% of women's restrooms.

And changing rooms I feel I've been pretty clear about. Those should be single stall.

So, there are bathroom bans in place right now, right? You know who's in actuality being challenged about being in women's bathrooms? Queer cis women. Tall cis women. Women who got mastectomies due to breast cancer. And transfemmes. You know who's not being challenged? *Male janitors.*

You know what happens when a cis woman gets 'challenged' about being in a women's restroom? In several high profile cases a male security guard got called into the restroom to physically drag her out. And then how is she supposed to prove she's a cis woman, when trans women can get their ID changed to say 'F' too? This 'female only' shit is happening in middle school sports now too, and conservatives are literally advocating for *genital inspections* on minors who don't look girly enough before they're allowed to play baseball with their classmates. Won't someone think of THOSE children. Is that where we want to be headed? Genital inspections before you're allowed into a female-only space? Is that your idea of privacy?

Literally why would a predator put on a wig and makeup when bringing a plunger is ten times more likely to get people to leave him alone about being in the women's restroom, and wearing female attire is likely to get him kicked out and beaten up?

Male janitors have always been in women's restrooms. Or what, you expect establishments to hire double janitors, one for the men's and one for the women's? Restrooms have never actually been a 100% single-sex space. You're only just now getting upset about that because trans women are new to you, and new things are scary I guess. It conjures up all sorts of 'OMG but what if's' in your head. And like, that's a you problem. Trans women have always gone to women's restrooms and it's never caused problems. It's not actually new. You're just only now aware of it.

I've been going to women's restrooms my whole life and I've never seen anyone change in there. Sounds weird, please do that in a stall.

Where I live mothers usually take their young sons to the women's restroom. Is it fine for them to see you changing then? Or is everyone supposed to send their kid into the men's restroom by themselves while they can't yet be trusted to wipe their own butts?

They're not going into the stall with you. What privacy do you need while washing your hands?

I don't think a single man ever has been stopped by a bathroom sign. If they want to go in, they will. All they need to do is hold a roll of toilet paper and people will assume they're the janitor. Bathroom bans sure hurt queer people trying to pee, but they do nothing to stop predators.

It used to be common sense that black and white people had to go to separate bathrooms. We can now all see that that was discriminatory nonsense. How do you think you'll look back on this moment in 50 years?

Did you know there was also a 'we shouldn't allow gay people into public bathrooms'-scare in the 1950s-80s? They were also supposedly scary predators.

This whole trans bathroom scare is just a new variation on the same old bigotry. Which social group gets targeted by a bathroom scare says a lot more about the anxieties of a society than it does about the social group in question.

Sex-separated bathrooms haven't even been a thing for all that long. Because duh, why would a small establishment install two bathroom stalls when that's expensive and one perfectly suffices? Sure, it makes sense to keep the urinals in a separate place, but other than that, a private stall is a private stall and we all use em the same way.

Where I live tons of small establishments just have one toilet and one sink. I never thought of them as 'unisex', they're just 'the bathroom'. I bet you've been to tons of those as well and never even noticed.

Changing rooms should be private stalls as well imo. I don't want to undress in front of a bunch of strangers in a big room, regardless of what their genders are.

It has private stalls. Are you scared a man will see you wash your hands?

Do you have separate bathrooms for men and women in your home?

:( The people who wrote this have never met a trans or intersex person because that's simply not how any of this works. If they wanted to tell a story like this, I wish they'd just framed it as a magic transformation, rather than pretending it's actually based in reality.

This hasn't managed to spotlight the actual issues intersex people face, or advocated for them in any way. A ton of unnecessary misery plus a miserable ending to really hammer home that people who exist outside the gender binary (like me <3) will never be happy or find a place to belong in this world. Thanks, I hate it.

Real life isn't as endlessly miserable, I promise!

For actually good and accurate trans & intersex representation, watch 'Marahuyo Project'. It's not as much of a downer.

Or if you want to learn more about intersex struggles look up pidgepagonis on YouTube, they're an intersex activist.

Thank you that's very helpful :)

My new theory as to what Hua Yong was doing is that he may have tried to mark Sheng, since the purple energy he sent went to the back of Sheng's neck, and I just read in an article someone linked that that's where marking happens. But we'll see!

Thanks that's helpful :). And yeah my plot prediction could very much be wrong.

One thing though, I may not be familiar with omegaverse, but I am familiar with Mandarin, and it wasn't an incorrect translation. Hua Yong said: 你是被Omega標記了嗎. It means 'did you get marked by an Omega'. It wasn't about getting stained with a smell.

Thanks :)

I assume Hua Yong is attempting to swindle his direct business competitor out of his assets by getting close to him, and accidentally falling in love in the process. That's my prediction for the plot anyways.

Further questions:

Is being an alpha/omega/whatever inherited - how come all alphas are rich and no omegas are? How do you keep that class separation consistent over time if it's not inherited? But even if it is inherited, some omegas should still logically be born rich, right? Rich alphas are having kids with omegas after all.

Is it usually connected to blood type? Or is that new? More common in asian omegaverse than western?

So what was the magic energy thing that Hua Yong tried to do at 47:30 ish in the third episode, or will we find out later?

At the end of ep 3 Hua Yong asked if an Omega marked Sheng, so is it possible for an Omega to mark an alpha, or only the other way around? Or is that a new concept in this series too?

Is there still regular sexism? Like is there stigma against women being alphas? Are women supposed to be omegas or betas, and men supposed to be alphas or betas?

Do omegas get any special pheromone powers? E.g. seducing an alpha?

Hua Yong attempted to do something to Sheng Shaoyou with his pheromone magic while Sheng was weakened, but Sheng seemed to block it with his own magic. What was that?

Yep, the 2024 Thai drama :)

thx for the list :)
'Pearl Next Door' does an FFF V-dynamic, where Pearl is supposed to choose at the end.
'Pluto' does an FFF love triangle (not main) where they're all into each other, but it doesn't end in polyamory, though they are all still close.

Is this related to https://kisskh.at/722423-zhang-gong-zhu-zhai-shang?