I can't with the chairman. Not everything is a business. As a father even if you had to fire your step son you should be a tiny bit comforting. Like say " I'm sorry but this is the policy. I know you will excel wherever this might take you and I will always support you"
But, oh no! all he does is whining " how am I wrong?" You might not be wrong but you have to remember the impression you give. Empathy doesn't cost anything. Especially if it's someone you saw growing up.
At this point because he only cares about money/business it's all he is going to receive. He will unwillingly surround himself only with people who are by his side because of money
it's really unfortunate that because of some questionable evaluation methods this show is poorly received.
I would argue that this show is better than Project 7.
The first two episodes (basically everything with the Guides judging) are the biggest hurdle that this show has to overcome. I don't say look past those episodes because audience and production has to learn from these things. Unfortunately it is what it is and it is already done. Hopefully something like this will not be repeated. But apart from that this show is really enjoyable.
For future viewers: Don't be discouraged by the first couple of episodes. Choices were made and things were said and we all agree this should never happen again. However we should move forward and don't let this impact the contestants and their dream of debuting.
Also watch it for yourself and don't let public outrage influence you. Personally I read about the controversy before watching it and assumed the worst. It was not good but mostly because of a flawed concept (too few people to evaluate too many people at the same time // impossible). Yet there was so much misinformation that I found myself defending the situation.
Think it's like you have to eat your vegetables that you don't like before you get to the good stuff.
All in all I am at least appreciative that this show is more daring than Project 7 which is just a run down the mill survival show by numbers without ambition.
I just wanna put this out there for whoever might want to read it.
As for the synopsis and the tags this doesn't seem to be a traditional BL but mor of a gay-drama. What is the difference you may ask. Well BL in general is a fantasy genre with its roots in japanese media. Traditionally BL has severeal characteristica like a Seme and Uke roles and somewhat heteronormatie acceptance of homosexual relationships. Of course there can also be the generational conflict of acceptance but that is normally used as a plot device. What is important to remember is the target audience. BL is aimed at heterosexual females. And we don't need to get into fetizishiation. So basically the main demographic would be fans of OK anyways (as I assume that the majority of his fans are heterosexual females). The thing is when it comes to "gay media" from Asia people automatically associate BL and the widely produced shows that are available. So do I think this is pandering to a small audience? No, I don't. This is aimed at a market that overlaps with the traditional Asian Drama market any ways. Is it a little bit more niche? Probably. Is it a risk for the well known actors? I would say not and here is why. This will be a netflix show. Sure, this means that it is globally available but it also means that unless it makes an huge impact (like Squid Game for example) It will be drowned by all the other shows that will be released at the same time. There is no wekk to week talk about the current episode and the main discourse will be confined to a relatively short period. Netflix binge model has its pros and cons. One of the big cons is that shows might just disappear in the sea of new releases.
What I am trying to say is that for whoever is excited for this show be excited as this is aimed at you. And for the people who thinks this will change the dramaworld forever, don't be discouraged, unless you pay attention, this will likely just pass you by without noticing.
I gotta give it to the writer for having both the chairman and his biological son have similar traits. They are both running and mope around with this victim mentality.... it's quite astonishing.
Yes I totally agree. That's what i-Land did once at least. They got to either choose members first or choose the…
I agree. Also I am not a fan of dare I say random audience members decide who will get benefits after one performance. As you said I would love to have this judging panel or another judging panel actually evaluate the performances. I remember in "Peak Time" during the group challenges they had the on site regular judges give out votes or points or whatever but also a different larger judging panel of industry professionals to vote for the MVP. I don't say they would do a better job than regular people because everyone has likes and dislikes and their opinion who does better or not. However I am always afraid with these survival shows that it comes down to literally face value.
To play my own devil's advocate I am also afraid when there is only the judges who decide that there's a lot of production interference (I am looking at you Kim Sung Min getting S-Rank for no reason whatsoever because it was definitely not your talent which I am still waiting to discover)
I honestly think it is so unfair to give the higher ranking ones benefits to get more benefits. Like they choosetheir teammates and the song and the leftovers just got the leftover song. I would have preferred if the non chosen team was able to call dibs on the song just to even it out a little bit.
I think this show is a case of the sum is greater than it's parts. If you start to dissect the show, you see there are flaws everywhere. But because of its ambition and all the good aspects combined you feel like it's a great show.
I would argue it is a good show in general. But that's it. It's just good, Which might be a problem because that is not reflected in the rating. Do I feel like the rating should be lower? Not necessarily. People rate whatever they want to rate and it should never dictate your enjoyment or lack there of of a show.
I think for most people the issue is with expectations. When a show is close to or crosses the 9.0 mark, most people assume that it has to be a great show.
This is why I prefer the rotten tomatoe model. Their rating is a percentage of how many people give it a good rating. Let's say a show has a 99% on rotten tomatoe. This means that 99% liked it but it also means that 1% didn't like it. It also works the other way around. let's say there is a show with a 1% rating. Everyone thinks this is garbage and you don't need to bother watching. However, you can also say that 1% thinks this is a good show.
At the end of the day ratings mean nothing. You might like a show that nobody likes or you hate a show that everybody enjoys.
I personally think J&J has more good parts than bad ones. But it also suffers from it's own ambition. If they had cut down some storylines and made this a tighter experience it would have been even better.
All in all enjoy what ever you enjoy and if you don't thats fine too. If you think there's room for improvement share it. If someone doesn't agree with you that's fine. You can explain yourself and your point of view. But don't feel the need to convince someone of your opinion. And you know "Opinions are like assholes. Everybody has one"
Is it one of those drama with "FL going to be human doormat for 117 episodes and get happy ending at last minutes…
I wouldn't say for 117 episodes. She does some really idiotic things throughout but once she is done and turns into mamabear it's on and I would say it's for a good portion as far as I remember. However you have to go through a lot of bullshit as always
me looking at some comments that say the show is boring and Kong looks AI generated and Thomas is stiff like a…
So you basically saying they are right in their opinion how some character appears and attributing this to the actor's ability... but they are unaware that this is intentional Regardless of their knowledge of the source material they are just pointing out what they are seeing. Don't you think it's the show's obligation to make this clear whether they are having someone with limited acting ability/experience or that the character is supposed to be that way regardless of the actor? I believe the problem lies with the industry in general. At some point BL were mass produced by small and big companies which attracted rookie actors especially. The audience was exposed to mediocre (and that's being generous) acting a lot. Which is why I believe that most viewers assume the worst when it comes to acting.
I understand your point that the character is supposed to be that way and maybe one should reserve judgment for a couple episodes in.
I believe production (including writers and director) were following the rule of cinema "show don't tell". However in this case, because of the perception of BL acting, it would have been wiser to "show and tell" if it's of significance to the story.
1 
But, oh no! all he does is whining " how am I wrong?" You might not be wrong but you have to remember the impression you give. Empathy doesn't cost anything. Especially if it's someone you saw growing up.
At this point because he only cares about money/business it's all he is going to receive. He will unwillingly surround himself only with people who are by his side because of money
I would argue that this show is better than Project 7.
The first two episodes (basically everything with the Guides judging) are the biggest hurdle that this show has to overcome. I don't say look past those episodes because audience and production has to learn from these things. Unfortunately it is what it is and it is already done. Hopefully something like this will not be repeated. But apart from that this show is really enjoyable.
For future viewers: Don't be discouraged by the first couple of episodes. Choices were made and things were said and we all agree this should never happen again. However we should move forward and don't let this impact the contestants and their dream of debuting.
Also watch it for yourself and don't let public outrage influence you. Personally I read about the controversy before watching it and assumed the worst. It was not good but mostly because of a flawed concept (too few people to evaluate too many people at the same time // impossible). Yet there was so much misinformation that I found myself defending the situation.
Think it's like you have to eat your vegetables that you don't like before you get to the good stuff.
All in all I am at least appreciative that this show is more daring than Project 7 which is just a run down the mill survival show by numbers without ambition.
Thank me later
Could you imagine waiting two weeks for a new episode? The terror
As for the synopsis and the tags this doesn't seem to be a traditional BL but mor of a gay-drama. What is the difference you may ask. Well BL in general is a fantasy genre with its roots in japanese media. Traditionally BL has severeal characteristica like a Seme and Uke roles and somewhat heteronormatie acceptance of homosexual relationships. Of course there can also be the generational conflict of acceptance but that is normally used as a plot device. What is important to remember is the target audience. BL is aimed at heterosexual females. And we don't need to get into fetizishiation. So basically the main demographic would be fans of OK anyways (as I assume that the majority of his fans are heterosexual females). The thing is when it comes to "gay media" from Asia people automatically associate BL and the widely produced shows that are available. So do I think this is pandering to a small audience? No, I don't. This is aimed at a market that overlaps with the traditional Asian Drama market any ways. Is it a little bit more niche? Probably. Is it a risk for the well known actors? I would say not and here is why. This will be a netflix show. Sure, this means that it is globally available but it also means that unless it makes an huge impact (like Squid Game for example) It will be drowned by all the other shows that will be released at the same time. There is no wekk to week talk about the current episode and the main discourse will be confined to a relatively short period. Netflix binge model has its pros and cons. One of the big cons is that shows might just disappear in the sea of new releases.
What I am trying to say is that for whoever is excited for this show be excited as this is aimed at you. And for the people who thinks this will change the dramaworld forever, don't be discouraged, unless you pay attention, this will likely just pass you by without noticing.
I remember in "Peak Time" during the group challenges they had the on site regular judges give out votes or points or whatever but also a different larger judging panel of industry professionals to vote for the MVP. I don't say they would do a better job than regular people because everyone has likes and dislikes and their opinion who does better or not. However I am always afraid with these survival shows that it comes down to literally face value.
To play my own devil's advocate I am also afraid when there is only the judges who decide that there's a lot of production interference (I am looking at you Kim Sung Min getting S-Rank for no reason whatsoever because it was definitely not your talent which I am still waiting to discover)
I would argue it is a good show in general. But that's it. It's just good, Which might be a problem because that is not reflected in the rating. Do I feel like the rating should be lower? Not necessarily. People rate whatever they want to rate and it should never dictate your enjoyment or lack there of of a show.
I think for most people the issue is with expectations. When a show is close to or crosses the 9.0 mark, most people assume that it has to be a great show.
This is why I prefer the rotten tomatoe model. Their rating is a percentage of how many people give it a good rating. Let's say a show has a 99% on rotten tomatoe. This means that 99% liked it but it also means that 1% didn't like it. It also works the other way around. let's say there is a show with a 1% rating. Everyone thinks this is garbage and you don't need to bother watching. However, you can also say that 1% thinks this is a good show.
At the end of the day ratings mean nothing. You might like a show that nobody likes or you hate a show that everybody enjoys.
I personally think J&J has more good parts than bad ones. But it also suffers from it's own ambition. If they had cut down some storylines and made this a tighter experience it would have been even better.
All in all enjoy what ever you enjoy and if you don't thats fine too. If you think there's room for improvement share it. If someone doesn't agree with you that's fine. You can explain yourself and your point of view. But don't feel the need to convince someone of your opinion. And you know "Opinions are like assholes. Everybody has one"
Regardless of their knowledge of the source material they are just pointing out what they are seeing. Don't you think it's the show's obligation to make this clear whether they are having someone with limited acting ability/experience or that the character is supposed to be that way regardless of the actor?
I believe the problem lies with the industry in general. At some point BL were mass produced by small and big companies which attracted rookie actors especially. The audience was exposed to mediocre (and that's being generous) acting a lot. Which is why I believe that most viewers assume the worst when it comes to acting.
I understand your point that the character is supposed to be that way and maybe one should reserve judgment for a couple episodes in.
I believe production (including writers and director) were following the rule of cinema "show don't tell". However in this case, because of the perception of BL acting, it would have been wiser to "show and tell" if it's of significance to the story.