etoks21

Thank you, GG! I will check it out.

Yeah, well, it sounds like a lot of "people," such as the three commenters above my comment, are unaware of your assertion and take these "entertainment" videos as reflections of reality and actual relationships between actors.

Also, could you explain how you "enjoy" watching videos of activities which are entirely manufactured, but obviously designed to be received as real? Seems like a brainless, gullible watch to me.

By all means, "enjoy" all you want, but don't expect others not to comment on how ridiculous the whole thing is. Plus, there is the ongoing problem of fan service videos sparking rumors of actor vs. actor feuds or worse, damaging careers with unintended consequences.

Says video is unavailable.

Do you regard PR-generated marketing/ship videos to be actual, real life? You don't think maybe they're just a tiny bit set up and staged by the marketing department and that the actors are obligated to appear in them as part of their contracts?

Or maybe it's just me...

At this point, I'm 90% watching for Fluke, 10% for Krist. The story is just another typical Thai BL plot with a time-travel element thrown in, but Fluke is charismatic and hot, and Krist is semi-amusing in this part. However, the way he's playing it, the story is easier to buy if I look at Kawi as intellectually disabled.

Pear: "Maybe you should try thinking MORE." Thank you, Pear! I've been waiting for someone to say that in a BL beginning with the first of the 10,457 times I've heard a person say "Don't overthink it" or "Don't think too much" in a Thai BL.

Like the way Fluke shifts his shoulders when he walks. Oh, and that scene where he was walking away from Krist after the scene on the grass and the green-screen background was so obviously fake was very strange. His walking speed was out of sync with the speed of the camera, so it came off as if he were floating or something...lol

I don't get why so many commenters are blaming Souta for everything. How many chances has Mahiro had to speak up and be forthright but didn't do so? Even in ep. 10 he sits across from Souta, says he's come to tell him something, and then lies through his teeth, implying that he is NO LONGER in love with Souta when we all know he very much is so.

You could have written this little monologue for half the characters in the many lame, triple/quadruple-misunderstanding-based BLs out there. :) But I don't get why so many commenters are blaming Souta for everything. How many chances has Mahiro had to speak up and be forthright but didn't do so? Even in ep. 10 he sits across from Souta, says he's come to tell him something, and then lies through his teeth, implying that he is NO LONGER in love with Souta when we all know he very much is so.

This has become utterly ridiculous.

Double-self-sabotage-faux-misunderstanding tropes, repeated endlessly, with a clueless, child-like young woman, an ex-BF, and an amusing store manager thrown into the mix, is the summation of this show's lame plot, a word I use loosely here. So many plot elements to mock but it would take too much time and not be worth it so I won't.

I continue to watch this show for one reason: Kondo Shori. He is cute/handsome/hot, charismatic, and extremely likeable as an actor. I enjoy watching him onscreen, even if the story his character is trapped in is a laughable sham. He looks to have a great body too. :)

That little girl finally saw what's been in front of her face for ten episodes but she can't even deliver a proper face-slap. I wish Souta had slapped her back. She's the one who forced herself on him and into the situation so it's a bit late to play the victim.

I feel zero chemistry/attraction between Souta and Mahiro. Especially, I see nothing at all that would make Mahiro seem attractive to Souta. They're just reading lines from a script.

Thanks for the recs. Double Mints is in my top ten gay films list and The Novelist series is in my top ten dramas. We have similar tastes, it seems.

Regarding Our Dining Table, it's funny to read comments here insisting there is great chemistry between the leads and rationalizing how great and "fluffy" it is that they almost never touch each other. Hell, they never got past being awkward together when they were truly alone. I'm beginning to think the wonderful Tane is the only reason they hang out together. If they move to Tokyo together without Tane their relationship is doomed. :)

I don't think I've even heard of "Sing In Love." I will check it out.

On edit: Turns out I HAVE tried to watch Sing In Love but dropped it about 2/3 of the way through. I just could not stomach any more of the lead actor, Tanaba Yu. He creeps me out.

That's why for me Grey Rainbow ends the moment after they snap the first group photograph after the wedding ceremony. If I didn't consider it done and finished at that point It would move from being in my top ten BLs to dropping off the list entirely. As you said, the last 15 minutes are insane.

The weirdest part was how the script tried to convince us at the end that the surviving lover is just A-OK with his husband being dead because his ghost shows up now and then and they have a good chat. Bonkers!

I loved the setting moving from university to the gritty elephant farm/resort, which was a unique setting for a BL too. Loved the scene where Elephant Mom changed her mind and accepted her son's relationship by moving his BF's clothing/belongings into the same room with him. The son goes ballistic before he finds out, which provides some humor. Loved the scenes where Elephant Son dresses up like a woman to give the kid a "mom." lol

Yes, another good show from before GMMTV monopolized BL in Thailand and started up the TOOT factory.

I'm sorry the comment came across as "vehement." I was not feeling vehement when I wrote it. :D I get what you're trying to say but I don't think the makers were going for Jane Austen here. I think they were going for "let's do anything but show two dudes being physically affectionate (beyond one hand-hold, a hug and a fake kiss) in FIVE HOURS of screen time. As I wrote earlier, these guys didn't even touch when they had the entire house to themselves. That's not normal human behavior.

I'm glad-and unsurprised-you have an open mind to rewatching and considering ITSAY and IPYTM to see if you can catch some glimpses of what I see in them. However, please know that I totally respect your opinion of the two shows and don't expect you to like everything I do. That would be boring. :)

Also, totally agree about sometimes having a gut negative feeling about a character that isn't completely reasonable, logical or explainable. I'm trying to think of a show or two in which I dislike a lead character to the point it ruins the entire thing for me, but I can't, off the top of my head. I will put some thought to that.

For me, ITSAY/IPYTM didn't say "Teh is a great guy all-round, we don't know what you're complaining about?" though. There are multiple, mostly Thai BLs which feature leads I can't stand but the fangirls love, and who are obviously meant for us to hold in high regard. I don't think that's where ITSAY/IPYTM were coming from at all. They said to me "here's this dude, Teh, who struggles mightily against himself and actually becomes MORE troublesome (I'm struggling not to use the word "problematic" here, lol) as we go forward, but please take time to consider the totality of who he is and why." For whatever reasons I found that a really engaging point of view to consider.

It's also OK if you just can't really deal with Teh's looks and his "big face" puts you off to a visceral degree. hahaha He is not the most conventionally handsome actor, that is for sure. The shape of his face also makes his smile unusual/interesting but I still find him overall attractive and I just like something I feel FROM him. I'm sure you might remember the scene in ITSAY during which he comes to realize he is passionately in love with Oh-aew but he is still agonizingly uneasy with his emerging sexuality and internalized homophobia. He feels torn in several directions with no idea what to do and this results in the ugly-cry to end all ugly-cries in BL history. I one hundred percent understood what his pain was all about and I admired the actor's willingness to go that far in expressing it.

I don't know about you, Maggie, but I have definitely been through a few epic ugly-cries in my life, one of them specifically engendered by a situation almost identical to Teh's in that scene, and I'm sure I looked just as ugly. :D Problem was, even I who love the show thought it went on too long. We saw Teh sobbing hysterically for like two minutes, which was fine, that's the actor's job, but the DIRECTOR needed to pull him back and reshoot or do a better job in the editing room and cut half of it.

OK, I think you know I love those shows. It's time for me to do a rewatch. But know I will not be annoyed if you don't, nor do I expect you to ever change your mind.

Don't forget the wonderful "The Man Who Defied the World of BL."

Bravo! Even through the special ep, however, they barely touch.

THIS. Must have been off-the-shelf box dye from Walmart. They also over-threaded/thinned his eyebrows.

There is a UNIVERSE of options between one hand-holding incident and a mannequin kiss, and "big, gregarious skin ship" as you call it. It has been scientifically proven over and over, that human beings NEED touch, hugging, holding. It's not a thirst for hot, heavy "skin ship" some of us are after, it's an acknowledgement of the MC's basic humanity we seek.

Constantly rationalizing this homophobic tendency in J and K-BLs to hold back on even the smallest of intimacies is unhelpful in encouraging them to grow and mature. It's more than possible to enjoy a BL for the most part, as I did this one, and still voice significant criticisms.

LOL

This special episode was like a parody of typical BL over-reaction, false assumptions, suspicions, insecurity, miscommunication, etc. but it was so over the top that I couldn't help but laugh. These two are a mess. If this level of jealousy and jumping to conclusions continues, they won't last six months. hahaha

Also, the awkward discomfort they always feel in each other's presence, even when things are going great, along with the unrealistic, cold, physical distance they maintain wrecks the portrayal of what could be a charming and very romantic relationship. Yes, yes, yes, I know..."it's a JBL and JBLs rarely do touching or hugging, let alone kissing and god forbid, actual SEX/LOVEMAKING, blah blah blah..." I don't care that so many JBLs do this, that fact doesn't eliminate the degree to which the cold/distant/sexless trope undermines the connections these shows purport to portray.

It's really too bad and I wish the JBL factory would grow up and get over their homophobic discomfort with two men showing physical affection. I get that Japanese are not ones to show affection in public, but these two dudes keep their distance when they have an entire HOUSE to themselves. It's not "fluffy," it's not "cute," it's not "adorable." It's anti-gay. I'm not asking for explicit sex scenes, though that would be fun too, I'm asking for normal, realistic physical interactions between human beings who love each other. These two have barely touched hands.

Thank god for Tane. This show should be called "TANE, HIS DAD, AND A COUPLE OF LAME GAY DUDES." That little actor is downright remarkable in his natural affect in front of the camera. He is always IN the scene. He does lots of little natural things a kid would do, even when others in a scene are the focus. I catch myself watching him instead of Yukata and Minoru exchanging neurotic expressions of insecurity and fear. Dad looked damn hot in his towel at the bath house too. I wish those kinds of public bath houses/hot springs were common in the U.S.

I found Minoru appealing and love his deep, resonant voice, something so many Asian men are blessed with. Yukata not so much, which is interesting as I found the actor charismatic and hilarious in A Man Who Defies the World of BL and its sequel. I get that this is supposed to be his character here, but it's also his job to make that character, as half of a BL couple, be engaging despite his flaws. I found Yukata mostly boring.

I'll still give this show a 7/10, which is a "C" on my ABCDF grading scale. Without Tane and his dad I would likely give it a D. All that said, there was enough here to keep me coming back and I don't regret the watch. I'm frustrated at how much better it could have been though.

For me, somehow I continued to perceive Teh as a deeply flawed character with a good heart at his core who does multiple fucked-up things. I don't dislike shows as a whole just because they feature characters who do multiple dislikeable things. In fact, a big part of why I LIKE those shows so much is that they are willing to show one of two lead characters acting out in multiple, negative ways. If I was looking for only sweet, kind characters who did sweet, kind things I would have a lot more Thai BLs on my list.

Don't get me wrong...Teh is the definition of a challenging character. However, part of this is also that I have wrestled with similar demons myself. Long ago, I came to understand there is a part of me that ALWAYS thinks the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, especially when I find a relationship that feels good and fulfilling. Something in me almost automatically begins to wonder "well, couldn't I do just a LITTLE bit better?" I have no defense for this component of my personality; it is just there and I basically understand why it's there and how to deal with it, thanks to a lot of therapy work.

ESPECIALLY in the sequel, when Teh repeatedly acts out with that hot professor, I totally got it. But also, the professor was manipulating him to make his acting in that play better, which was the height of inappropriate and shitty behavior. But WOW, when the script was willing to have Teh STILL obsessing and pining after the prof AFTER he knew what had gone down, I was just so impressed with the willingness of the show to confront us with this kind of behavior and yet still ask us to try to have SOME understanding of Teh as someone who desires to be good and yet repeatedly fails.

On top of all this, even though I felt I got what was going on with Teh, I did NOT want Oh-aew to take him back until Teh had taken steps to deal with these clear personality flaws that were bound to fuck up any future relationship, be it Oh-aew or someone else. But as we know, the last thing almost all BLs want to show is someone in therapy, responsibly dealing with their shit. The only one I've seen attempt that was "The Eighth Sense," but that was shown in such a messed-up, inaccurate, stupid way that they'd have been better off not to include the therapy in the script.

So, with ITSAY and IPYTM, especially the sequel, I enjoyed being pulled apart emotionally in several directions all at once. My sadness for Oh-aew, my empathy and understanding of Teh and his behavior, my wanting them to get back together but knowing it was not for the best until Teh dealt with his shit, all this messed-up human-ness moved me deeply. Let us not forget also Oh-aew's unshakeable, deep love for Teh through all of the above. That actor did a fabulous job of portraying his loneliness and ongoing depression/sadness during the period of time Teh was more and more avoiding him and he had no friends. That scene where the new group of friends joins Oh-aew at an outdoor campus table and begins to kindly question him about who he is and what's going on in his life, etc. and Oh-aew suddenly breaks into tears was written and performed so well it broke my heart. I've been that lonely.

I even had very mixed feelings at the end of the sequel when Teh and Oh-aew more or less reconcile on the beach. I was happy for both of them because each loves the other at a core level, but Teh is not ready for love in his current condition, so I was screaming "no! yes! therapy! no! yes! therapy!" at the screen.

Also, there are multiple, powerful, unusual scenes of love, flirtation, coming together, especially in ITSAY, then coming apart, as Teh wrestled with his powerful feelings for Oh-aew right alongside his internalized homophobia and fear of such a relationship. Do you remember when Teh goes to see O-a at the latter's parents' beach resort and there's that silent kind of slow-motion, come-hither, dance/chase that begins in the hotel and ends up on the beach. O-a keeps letting Teh catch up to him, but then he moves away to entice him. That scene was beautifully done and SO exceptional for a BL.

Then there was the scene where O-a was alone in his room and tried on one of his mom's bras and considered himself in the mirror. What a beautiful/sad/happy/lonely portrayal of a kid wrestling with who he is and what he wants. NOTHING like that anywhere else in BL World. And stuff like that was repeated over and over.

The scene in ITSAY where the two of them talk and flirt and there's this air of sexual heat and they come together sitting on the floor, Teh wrapped around O-a from behind and you think they're going to finally do it but then Teh chickens out...beautifully acted, directed and performed. Over and over ITSAY and IPYTM present us complicated, layered scenes unseen anywhere else in BL.

Then there's the feature film-worthy cinematography, music, and set design throughout both shows. Again, ten steps above most BLs. To me, these two are in a class of their own and are unlikely to be topped, though I would love to see that. Also again, beyond amazing these shows came out of Thailand, mostly knows for TOOTs. So naturally the production company that made them dissolves itself while GMMTV and other crap-factories keep chugging along.

I need to check out your lists. Pretty amazing we're in 70% agreement on our top10 without consulting as we put them together. It is interesting that my top 2 don't make your list at all.

Yup, back to the lists. I haven't put these guys in order of preference yet. I've just been gradually compiling names again. Kengo is always hot.

I will let you know when I watch your recs below.