pearlescent

Yeah, it's really bad. They started with a solid pilot but it's now drowning under juvenile and now racist comedy, screaming, and annoying side characters, instead of focusing on the Mork-Pi romance.

After seeing the response to the racism in the last episode and how hard people are working to defend this show while much better shows from the 2020-2021 season are criticized harshly for dumb things (ATOTS and Lovely Writer being the most notable) I think people are more lenient when a show is bad, and more critical when a show is good.

I also think people are biased towards this show because it’s a GMMTV project. If this was not under GMMTV I don’t think the comment section would be full of the same amount of warriors.

I'm not angry, I'm just exasperated because I feel like we're going in circles because you're not reading what I'm writing.

Japanese BL tropes, Thai BL tropes, Japanese cultural gender norms, Thai cultural gender norms, Gay Thai culture, and Gay Japanese culture, are all totally different things. Gay Thai culture is not a "BL trope" because gay Thai people are real and Thai BL is going to be reflective of them and their culture to an extent. Stating that these cultural practices are toxic and problematic because you can't differentiate between BL tropes and gay culture in a country that you don't live in or understand, is more problematic and Western-centric than Thai BL reflecting realities that exist.

I'm just going to leave it at that because I don't think you're getting what I'm saying. Have a good day.

ALL cultures have gender roles but Japan and Thailand's are not the same just because they're both Asian countries, which is why it feels like you're conflating the two cultures just to make a weird manga comparison (when this has nothing to do with manga).

Thailand is in Southeast Asia and has a way more developed traditional gay culture since Japan is 100 times more homophobic, and parents and cultural institutions don' t even consider how they can apply to gay couples, because they just don't accept them to begin with.

I specifically pointed out one thing in the show that's entirely unique to Thailand and that's bride dowry or sin sod. It's Thai specific and realistic that it would come up between a gay couple. Japan doesn't have that because they don't value women or passive partners in the same way, and the norms that they do have for women wouldn't be applied to a gay man the way that it occurs in Thailand, or even Taiwan, since they're the two most gay friendly countries Asia.

You're doing exactly what I pointed in my original post by conflating Japanese cultural gender roles with Japanese BL tropes. A Japanese BL trope is "no means yes" and a Japanese cultural gender role is expecting the wife to take care of the housework.

As you can see, they are NOT the same thing and both are irrelevant in regards to Lovely Writer because this isn't a Japanese BL manga. They're not the same just because they're both Asian. Lovely Writer is a THAI BL series. And because of that they are acting within Thai cultural gender norms.

If you read my comment carefully, you'd see that gay Thai people and straight people often act within these parameters in real life. Nubsib and Gene are both rich and Nubsib's family is more traditional. It makes sense for them culturally to talk about sin sod and for Nubsib to take up Gene as his responsibility.

Gender roles in gay relationships differ from country to country and Western morality isn't automatically superior to Eastern morality. The norms in Eastern countries aren't automatically unfortunate and toxic just because they don't fit the Western standards of individualism. I'm not saying that there aren't queer Thai people who totally reject these gender roles (I've seen some backlash to husband-wife culture from gay Thai people as well) because there are, but there's also a large number of people who do live within them, and I don't think it's my business to tell them that they're "problematic" from half way around the world.

I don't think you're being ridiculous but I think you're unnecessarily conflating the "toxic dynamic in Japanese BL manga" with cultural Thai gender roles when they're not the same thing.

"Take care of so-and-so?" "I will." comes up in every single Thai drama and it's not a BL trope. It's Thai gender roles placing a lot of focus on being able to take care of the bride or the passive partner using money which is why dowry paid to the bride is important and vaguely brought up with the discussion of Nubsib exchanging land for Gene. The man is meant to take care of the bride and take on their entire family once the families "merge" and he also has to compensate the parents for the "loss of the daughter in the household". Which is why Nubsib was mainly concerned with Teep's approval and he only thought of possibly having to trade something with him, instead of Gene's mother. Thai culture is still very patriarchal, if the behaviour of the fathers and Nubsib himself didn't make that clear.

If you're wondering about real gay Thai couples still acting within this binary—yes, they do. I know at least one man whose parents received sin sod (dowry) and all Thai women expect it. It might be considered archaic by western standards, but it's very normal in Thailand because of how close-knit families are and how children and their spouses are expected to take care of parents in their old age.

So...yeah, Gene is being treated in a feminine way by the other characters within the context of his relationship. But the reason is not "toxic", and the reason we never see Gene complain about it (despite complaining about Nubsib treating him like a child before!) is because it's a cultural difference.

Most BL ships are not between a masculine and feminine man, there are actually very few feminine men in BL. When feminine gay men do exist in BL they’re treated as jokes or the audience thinks they’re “like women”. What I’ve observed is that woke Western fans exaggerate the dominance of masculine tops and feminine bottoms. Think about the big ships of the last 2 years.

TharnType. Sarawatine. Phutian. Gao Shi De and Zhou Shu Yi.

Like Lovely Writer made fun of in the first episode: BL dramas usually hire two handsome masculine men with one who is just feminine enough without being flamboyant, because they want the bottom character to appeal to female fans. In that sense, yeah I guess KaoUp have a typical BL visual. But there is nothing really feminine about Gene’s personality besides the fact that he likes pink and he’s shy.

To be fair, looking at Gene’s work is literally Hin’s job as his assistant. It’s just weird because Gene told Hin he’d be there for him.

And Gene has been consistent about running away from Sib’s love and affection because he’s a socially awkward introvert with rejection and intimacy issues. That’s not the drama trying to make us dislike Gene, it’s his personality. And one that’s pretty common.

I thought the same about Hin and Gene lmao. He’s not being the worst person ever but Gene is basically going “If you give a man a fish, he will eat for a day. If you teach a man to fish, he’ll never go hungry.” with Hin, and while that would be fine if he actually was busy, Gene was sitting all day at the resort. We’ve also seen multiple scenes where he’s just chilling. Gene really could have given Hin’s novel a quick look over while Nubsib was working.

I’ve read the book and the conversation on the balcony scene isn’t misplaced. It’s meant to happen after they get Gene’s Dad’s approval. Gene is asking Nubsib what he’d HYPOTHETICALLY do if his Dad told Nubsib no.

I’m also confused about what stalking in the episode you’re talking about unless you’re referring to the fan at the end. If you’re talking about Nubsib interrupting Gene’s lunch with Hin: Nubsib and Gene are in a relationship and they agreed to give each other updates because last week Gene went off and almost got assaulted by Aey at a bar until Nubsib showed up. Gene sending Nubsib pictures of his food is them being consistent.

Is Tiffy a shipper? I don’t think so because we’ve never seen her fangirl over a ship, and assuming Tum and Gene are together cause they’re kinda fruity and standing next to each other, is not shipping. It’s just a dumb assumption that lots of people make about same-sex friends or people that “look gay”. I think the easier explanation is that the plot makes no sense and the writers thought they were being very deep, without even stopping to consider that no bisexual woman would be this stupid about sexuality.

The episode was slower than the last but that's because you can tell it's a building episode where they give us a lot of fluff and set the groundwork for the big final conflict. So I can forgive it. It would be too much if this episode and the final two were stuffed with drama.

I really liked the small insights we got into Teep and Run's history. Run knows that Teep loved Pop the most and Teep loves Gene so much, which is why he was so afraid that he'd turn out like him. I cried when he cried in Run's arms. I only wish that we could have gotten a short flashback of Pop or learned if he was alive or not.

The Tum-Tiffy plot is really dumb to me, I'm sorry. I appreciate that the writers wanted to show non-gender-conforming people in a straight relationship but Tum isn't feminine enough for Tiffy to be this in denial about his sexuality. I could buy this if she was avoiding him and perpetuating the misunderstanding but Tum is literally getting in her face and screaming I LIKE WOMEN AND I LIKE YOU and Tiffy's response is, "Hmph. Liar. Stop messing with my heart!" What anime is this?

The Hin-Gene scenes made me a little suspicious. I used to think that Hin would backstab Gene because he wants to be successful but Gene is being so nice and helpful to him and we've got so little time left, I can't see Hin betraying him anymore.

I loooooved seeing Gene get coddled, cuddled, doted on, and generally loved on by Sib, without all the usual denial where he pretends that he doesn't like it. I loved Nubsib holding him on the balcony and telling him he was worth more than any land deed he could give his father, and later tickling him.

It was also interesting seeing past things they discussed playing out, like Gene texting Nubsib a picture of his cake to let him know where he was and what he was doing. Does it feel like Gene has become more submissive to Nubsib since they got together? Letting him know where he is and letting Nubsib set rules for him. He's even embarrassed about it when Tum asks him to repeat what he said ("Your kid isn't letting me swim in the sea.") and he quickly says it's nothing, but he listens to what Nubsib wants and stays at the resort.

The beach scene was great. Gene being carried bridal style into the ocean and the pink and blue lighting which matched their shirts? Poetic cinema.

The fan catching them at the end wasn't surprising considering how they were carrying on in public. The episode also kind of highlighted how Nubsib and Gene are naive in different ways. Nubsib is so confident in himself and his ability to protect Gene/deal with this, that he's bold in public. He's cocky. Gene is innocent because he didn't even think about all the negative things they could deal with until his Dad brought them up. And now they're both going to pay for being young, stupid, and in love.

Plot twist: Auntie Orn only accepted SibGene's relationship because she can't go through another Zumba class without an accountability buddy.

It's such a weird plot because who would do that in real life? Especially someone who is also LGBTQ. It's not like Tiffy is a "stereotypical" bisexual herself.

Tum rapping his feelings for Tiffy to prove that he isn’t gay was one of the most surreal things I’ve seen in a BL drama.

The tattoo isn't Gene's. The tattoo is a family portrait of Up with his parents and his grandma. Shows would usually cover something like that up but because they didn't, I'm assuming Up told Tee no because it has sentimental value (His grandma passed) for him.

Source: https://twitter.com/luvuppmpt/status/1381482631695507457

You got me, I like Up and I like Gene. Is that meant to be a burn? Should I not like Up became Up compared Kao...to tea? This is the Lovely Writer comment section, I wouldn't be watching a show if I hated any of the cast members or characters. And your icon is literally of Up and Gene—two people that you supposedly hate.

Go touch some grass because all your comments sound like you're on bath salts. When you come inside, you can start learning Thai.

You don’t understand Thai and you’re getting offended over Up comparing Kao to tea? This is irrelevant to the show Lovely Writer and completely delusional. Stop reading so much into an innocuous comment made in a language you don’t even understand.

Bisexuality exists. I don't get why people immediately jumped to him being gay and using Gene's Mom as a beard.

This is so over the top and stupid that it's hilarious. Go touch some grass, Mark.

Sib's Dad's name is Wat.