Arclei:
fs... A role reversal romantic sex comedy that's neither romantic, nor sexy, nor comedic, nor role reversal, nor femdom, and also tremendously shallow and lacking in depth. I, really, really wanted to love this drama, I mean, come on, it's me, but I'm only disappointed. It would've been fine had they not hammered home the fact that the leads hate the status quo and wanna do something different. Like it could've been a cute egalitarian rom about two people figuring out they like equality and to switch. But NOOOOOOOOOOOOO, you just HAD to bait me. (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
i was looking so forward to watching this lol. T_T
potatocouch:
Some of these same women salivating over beautiful men in comment sections convince themselves they're not allowed to have expectations in real life??? They'll gush over male celebs and influencers who groom themselves, but as soon as you start talking about dating it's: ahem, appearance actually doesn't matter at all. Women are able to look beyond that, so it's okay that my boyfriend hasn't bathed in four days, and when he does he uses dish soap on his face.
That's crazy to me... Women are always kept very small and ultimately end up keeping themselves there too. It's a shame, cuz so many women suppress desires because society tells them it's wrong. No, it's actually not any more work for a man to be well-kept and well-groomed than a woman!! It's just that women are conditioned to do it since childhood 😭 Ofc personality, compatibility of goals and morals, etc matters more in the end, but acting like appearances don't matter at all is also not the best way to go about it, either... esp when men are never told to settle... 😒
(I wouldn't call his character from Remarried Empress a loser bbg. I read a big chunk of the webtoon, and he's more of a male green tea, but who knows? The screenwriter might give him a loser bbg spin since it's LJS)
AAAAAA, GREEN TEA LETS GOOOOO!!! I hope he's b*tchy!!!! I'm fine with him being a lil bit of a loser, but I'm ngl... it's difficult for me to spin losercore MLs in an RR way 😬 Not that this drama is gonna be RR, but that's kinda what my issue is with his roles (in this case Hot Young Bloods. I don't think losers are RR 😭 They're just your average guy tbh, it's just that the actor's facecard is too lethal we forget)
he also gives loser bbg in Pinocchio, While You Were Sleeping (big loser vibes), and a little in Law and the City from the two episodes I watched.
NOT HIM BEING TYPE-CASTED AS A LOSER IN EVERYTHING, PLEASE 😭😭😭 I'm so sad!! He's honestly a fairly decent actor, so I wouldn't mind him taking on more varied... more demanding roles, ahahah- he kinda ate in everything I've seen him in (augh, his whumping in Big Mouth? GOD TIER). I keep seeing Pinocchio pop up... This might be my sign to watch it...
Are you talking about the one of her cooking like a good housewife with what looks like a sniper rifle strapped to her back? Why did that make you less optimistic?
LMFAAAOO, the sass!!! Yeah, I wonder why... 😭
OH SNAP, I JUST REALIZED SOMETHING!! Not only is Gong Hyo Jin the lead, but the drama's written by Kim Eun Hee! She wrote one of my fav dramas of all time "Signal"
Another drama that everyone and their mom keeps recommending to me... maybe this is also a sign 😂 Yeah, I checked the screenwriter and noticed she had a rather well-respected list of projects. For me it was more mixed because I LOATHED Revenant, but quite enjoyed Kingdom (and am willing to leave any shortcomings on Netflix's shoulders rather than the creators, AHAHAHA)!
I'm still not optimistic about the RR because she mostly writes in the action and thriller/horror genres, and doesn't tend to build up the romantic relationships in them (if they're present at all), but I'm surprised and tickled this is her newest project. If she can at least hit egal or egal with RR leanings, and the story's really good, she might get me.
Hmmmmmmm, I see where you're coming from. If it's even close to Flower of Evil levels of RR then I'll be pretty darn happy too 😌 I hope her husband gets kidnapped and whumped <.< It might've been mostly the actors, but in both dramas I watched the leads had pretty decent chemistry, so it shouldn't be too hard to translate that onto romance, right? 😂 Either way, a solid action/horror writer having a go at romance is interesting! I'm more curious now.
(She's also writing Iseop's Wish, the drama where Lee Jong Suk plays another losercore ML. The lady is diversifying! Is that what you were talking about earlier instead of Remarried Empress?)
This drama sounds like it might scratch some itches for you in specific... like they could lean so good into alpha x alpha type of dynamic where the man eventually yields... 👀 Fingers crossed it's interesting and they don't make FL pathetic. (also no, I didn't know this drama existed xD)
...and Shadows of Desire, Tigers Sniff the Rose, and even Sweetest Rebellion.
All full-length historicals I'm willing to brave because they look RR, for Daniel's bow mouth, or both. But I can't even mentally prepare because none of them have release dates (at least on MDL).
Ah right, how can I forget your pookie Daniel! 🤣 It's true... they'll give you a trailer three years before the drama airs, but then drop it in an afternoon 😭 Meanwhile kdramas will only give you a trailer the day it releases 😭😭😭 Why can no one be normal with things??? (MDL tends to be pretty quick with updates on release dates so if one is announced, it's usually updated within the day)
OMG HE DOES LOOK LIKE LEO WU! HAHAHAHA. But softer. Leo Wu has an intense aura, even when he's playing kind characters.
That's true! This guy looks like a mix between Leo Wu and Luo Yun Xi 😂
Ugh, I dropped Glory, but the scenes you chose make me want to pick it back up. I'm so weak when it comes to RR content 😂 It's the only thing that makes me go back and forth with myself after I've already made a decision.
No, cuz saaaaaame.... I'm still in denial about dropping Glory and blame my slump for not vibing with it, but this compilation made me wanna continueeeeee 😭😭😭😭😭 I'm so weak for this, bro-
We'll discuss this later. I still can't believe how crappy it ended up being. This is the cruelest bait and switch I've ever seen.
💔💔💔💔
Not sure if anyone's already posted about "Love in Sync", so:
Never even heard of this one!!! Augh, that synopsis sounds SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO promising!!! You know how much of a sucker I am for softspoken emotional men and in a position where his literal job is guiding through other's emotions? AUGH- But then that trailer............... Hmmmm........ it's not good 😬
I'm not sure yet, but I figured it should be on our radar just in case. I'm gonna give it a try and report back.
Keep us posted!! If it has some RR I'll add it to the index!
murderbee:
Yeah I completely dropped Ladies on Top. I actually read the manga it was adapted from (Is It Wrong To Get Done By A Girl?) before it came out, and when I saw the synopsis I was like that's very familiar...
But yeah the manga and the drama were both pretty trad-leaning egalitarian unfortunately.
That's such a shame... I was hoping the drama would improve on the source material, but I've admittedly not read the manga, ahaha... and now I doubt I will, lol.
I've made the thread!
Awesome!
jay:
Nooo I'm so sad to hear that about Ladies On Top. Oh well, I won't be watching anymore of it lol. I skimmed the first episode when it was coming out and decided to wait for the whole thing to be finished, but ugh what a nasty bait and switch. Why even bother titling it like that? 😅
Thanks for your review Arclei 🙏 hopefully it helps other RR fans avoid the whole mess and save their time...
I had also waited to be able to binge it cuz I was sure I was gonna love it... The first 4 episodes had some nice visuals and moments for sure, but after that? Cruel!! I have no idea why the baited us like that... it's hard to only think of it as ignorance... 😬
I took the L so y'all don't have to 💝
ree0:
i was looking so forward to watching this lol. T_T
I knoooowww, it's SUCH a bummer 😭😭😭 The betrayal is real!!
Junntsuki:
Hmm, tbh ABO (Female Alpha x Male Omega) is probably the biggest trope in GB.
AYYOOOO??? You mean MY BREAD AND MFING BUTTER?????? Ahem, I mean, normally and totally respectfully... like... idk, drop some titles or something 👀👀👀👀
I don't really have favourites, but I can say that I really liked Love and Leashes, The Glory (Chen Duling & Xin Yunlai) and Glory (Gulinazha & Hou Minghao).
Love and Leashes is absolutely elite!!! A great pick!
Glory is really good with the RR, I really love how green-tea the ML is and how playgirl-coded the FL is, hahaha. Just wish the writing quality was a bit better 😭 As for The Glory.... I didn't know this dramas was RR 👀 Tell me more!
I am looking forward to Zhou Keyu's upcoming historicals that is radiating RR energy.
Eyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy, another Daniel fan!! @potatocouch, our people! Shadows of Desire looks INSANELY delicious- I'm waiting with bated breath
Xin Yunlai is acting as 'half' a eunuch in Ming Dynasty Adventures, and I absolutely love that, at least we have a real eunuch ML at some point in the story, because castration & physical/symbolic loss of phallic prowess hhhh.
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, we love to see more eunuch MLs!!! Or really in any kinda of prominent role that isn't purely supporting!! Some proper historical dramas have more important eunuch characters (sometimes not even elderly men!!) and they're always interesting! They play such an important part in Chinese history, but are always left in the background... because can you imagine if a ML is something other than a royal, noble, or general???? Whatever would the plot be about???? But I seriously doubt we'll be getting a proper eunuch ML anytime soon... They're always 'faking' and ik it's for censorship reasons 😭😭😭 But hey, if you can tolerate the faking aspect, Dominion and Devotion was interesting (light on the RR, but somewhat present).
As for this drama, the leads aren't giving me anything, which is a shame... 😔 But SFL seems to be a crossdresser, so maybe there's hope for a secondary couple? ahaha
《蛊色撩人》——I'm crying, my RR ship is sinking? That kinda sucks considering they slayed RR, aiya.
My disappointment was only drowned out by Ladies on Top 😭😭😭 Our track record this year was too good with too many solid RR dramas coming in one after another...
The switch is also a subcategory in GB/4i, one that I try to avoid 🫠🫠 Sounds like kinkplay rather than RR proper. I'm just generally dubious about jdramas delivering good RR because they're such a traditional society despite coming up with the most wild and perverted stuff hhh.
Oh God... so I need to watch out for that in GB too???!! 💀💀💀💀 In the genre specifically meant for us??? Ok, nice... VERY nice... I'm not mad, why would you say that?
I had a good track-record with Japan so I was naively more optimistic 😭 But yeah, their traditions and misogyny are inescapable
Recently came out, vshort《将军在上，王爷妻管严》(lit. General on Top, His Highness is Henpecked). I was hoping this would be a promising RR, but after seeing some clips it looks more egalitarian. Sometimes the title says FL on top but it's just a bait 🫠🫠
Ain't that the truth... what a bummer... Ugh....
But yeah the manga and the drama were both pretty trad-leaning egalitarian unfortunately.
Yikes! I skimmed it and ended up dropping it too. What a waste of a good premise and a good setup.
You should definitely try You Have My Heart, it is one of the most RR titles I've watched this year.
Oh wow, that's saying a lot! I'll start it soon.
Hmm, tbh ABO (Female Alpha x Male Omega) is probably the biggest trope in GB.
LOVE omegaverses, and I love this pairing in particular. I didn't see many when I was looking around on novelupdates, so thanks so much for the links! 😊
There's a jjwxc writer called 龚心文 who is a lot of people's gateway intto GB.
I started "Mr. Lizard Outside the Window" last night. The translation is fantastic, and it seems like an adorable, cozy story. It's almost fairy tale-like. I feel like I never would've found this without you, so thanks again.
Looking like a treat fr! This shall be my bedtime watch hhh.
Let me know if you need the link and I'll DM it to you.
I am looking forward to Zhou Keyu's upcoming historicals that is radiating RR energy.
Arclei and I have been DYING to see this!!! The stills, teasers, and trailers look sooooo good! Daniel's (aka Zhou Keyu) got so many upcoming projects, and they either look RR (Shadows of Desire) or egal (Sweetest Rebellion). I'm loving his career trajectory. Hope it stays this way or leans even more RR.
Women are always kept very small and ultimately end up keeping themselves there too.
That part! There needs to be a lot of mental prison breaks.
AAAAAA, GREEN TEA LETS GOOOOO!!! I hope he's b*tchy!!!!
He's very "aren't I a cute puppy—whoops, did I just murder a bunch of people and seize that kingdom? Also, Navier (FL) it's my first time...please be gentle 🥺" in the webtoon. I'm not caught up, but I was loving him where I left off.
I don't think losers are RR 😭 They're just your average guy tbh,
Ooop—😂😂😂😂 Ngl, that got me.
No, not a straight up "loser", but a loser bbg? Sure. Or at least a case can be made depending on the character.
(augh, his whumping in Big Mouth? GOD TIER)
And the crying??????? 😩 I still vividly remember the scene where his wife comes to visit him in jail. He starts sobbing, sniffling, and whimpering as she wipes his tears like he's her pretty princess, and reassures him. I ate it up. I was like FREE MY BBG, HE AIN'T DO IT!!!!
Ooooh!! The scene's on Youtube:
I keep seeing Pinocchio pop up... This might be my sign to watch it...
Oof—good luck. It had a strong start, but I think I ended up dropping it because they started dragging the revenge/mystery to the point where I no longer cared, and the characters didn't either. But idk you might like it. I'm still trying to get a sense of your taste in suspense/thrillers. I feel like I know what you're looking for in romances/historicals, but not suspense/thrillers.
Another drama that everyone and their mom keeps recommending to me... maybe this is also a sign
Phew! Signal had me in a chokehold while it was airing! But it's been 10 years, and it might now be considered overhyped, so idk. The acting was damn good though.
Hmmmmmmm, I see where you're coming from. If it's even close to Flower of Evil levels of RR then I'll be pretty darn happy too 😌I hope her husband gets kidnapped and whumped <.<It might've been mostly the actors, but in both dramas I watched the leads had pretty decent chemistry, so it shouldn't be too hard to translate that onto romance, right? 😂 Either way, a solid action/horror writer having a go at romance is interesting! I'm more curious now.
I hope it gives Flower of Evil vibes!! That would be amazing! Her husband better get kidnapped. Why else would I be watching if the stakes aren't her family's safety, particularly her husband?
That's funny because in the older Kim Eun Hee dramas I watched (Sign and Ghost) the leads had zero chemistry hahahaha. Maybe the casting director just did a bad job? But yeah, seeing her as the screenwriter perked me up a bit more. I haven't watched her stuff in a long time since she wants to keep writing scary stuff. And a random sports drama. So it'll be a long awaited reunion.
This drama sounds like it might scratch some itches for you in specific... like they could lean so good into alpha x alpha type of dynamic where the man eventually yields... 👀 Fingers crossed it's interesting and they don't make FL pathetic. (also no, I didn't know this drama existed xD)
I hope so!!!!! I read the webtoon's synopsis, and the FL's supposed to be super competent, so I hope it stays that way. And I hope she isn't afraid of his sh*t.
That's true! This guy looks like a mix between Leo Wu and Luo Yun Xi
Spot. On.
No, cuz saaaaaame.... I'm still in denial about dropping Glory and blame my slump for not vibing with it, but this compilation made me wanna continueeeeee 😭😭😭😭😭 I'm so weak for this, bro-
Bahahaha! Them clips got to you too! I was like..."Well, maybe I could give it another try...." Talk about being in a toxic relationship. Some RR dramas practically scream, "You'll always come back to me!!" in my face, which is soooo ironic.
Augh, that synopsis sounds SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO promising!!! You know how much of a sucker I am for softspoken emotional men and in a position where his literal job is guiding through other's emotions?
Right?!!! I was like, well, well, well...what do we have here? An emotional man? A stoic woman? 😏 And yes, I do know how much you love an empathetic mental health professional 🤭 If only you would write me that book. But sadly, the trailer made it look like the FL would be having most of the emotions :( Which I know is the point, but it should be a gradual thing with her still being repressed, and him feeling everything.
Keep us posted!! If it has some RR I'll add it to the index!
Will do!
As for The Glory.... I didn't know this dramas was RR 👀 Tell me more!
This drama always popped up when I was searching for Glory. I had no idea it was RR too. I would also like to know more...
Eyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy, another Daniel fan!! @potatocouch, our people! Shadows of Desire looks INSANELY delicious- I'm waiting with bated breath
This club is gonna be inundated with so many posts once it starts airing hahaha.
He's very "aren't I a cute puppy—whoops, did I just murder a bunch of people and seize that kingdom? Also, Navier (FL) it's my first time...please be gentle 🥺" in the webtoon. I'm not caught up, but I was loving him where I left off.
That sounds VERY promising!!! I really hope they keep this in. Maybe it'll even be a lil bit RR-leaning 😩 Ik, I'm not holding my breath, but....
Ooop—😂😂😂😂 Ngl, that got me.
No, not a straight up "loser", but a loser bbg? Sure. Or at least a case can be made depending on the character.
Didn't even realize how bad that came out 😭 I think it definitely depends a lot on the character, but more than that, I think it depends a lot on the approach and framing. For me it's kinda like with noona. It can be RR, but it isn't so by default and rarely is portrayed that way. I'm just tired of people claiming pathetic, loser simp men that are just henpecked at best are RR when they really aren't- I think the closest I've seen to an RR 'loser ML' was the ML from Destined? Maybe also ML from Ho Goo's Love? Though I'd kinda hesitate putting either of those in true loser category. Moreso loser 'vibes'.
Loserism is still very much a male-dominated trait, be it so due to societal views of masculinity, for comedy, or whatever. So, for me... it's not RR. But hey, maybe I'm in the minority here. We could poll it now that the feature was introduced XD
I still vividly remember the scene where his wife comes to visit him in jail. He starts sobbing, sniffling, and whimpering as she wipes his tears like he's her pretty princess, and reassures him. I ate it up.
I REMEMBER THAT SCEN VIVIDLY TOO, AHHAHAHA!!!! Augh, rewatching it... his sobbing and whimpering, and those tearful eyes... Giiiiiirl 😩😩😩😩 He might not've done it, but dang were we being well-fed upon this accusation 😌 I loved that drama, but that ending, man.... ⏩⏩⏩
I'm still trying to get a sense of your taste in suspense/thrillers. I feel like I know what you're looking for in romances/historicals, but not suspense/thrillers.
Good point, I'm not really sure what I'm looking for either... I think it's mostly a mix between very character-focused (preferably m/f duos where both are competent), lots of whump, interesting plot that isn't too self-important (bonus points for an unusual approach), and minimal violence against women. Bonus points for role reversal/egalitarian dynamics, sibling dynamics, and disability/mental disorder rep as usual 😄 All my favs tend to have this in common.
Phew! Signal had me in a chokehold while it was airing! But it's been 10 years, and it might now be considered overhyped, so idk. The acting was damn good though.
Yeah, that's what I fear I'll have with the drama 😭
I hope it gives Flower of Evil vibes!! That would be amazing! Her husband better get kidnapped. Why else would I be watching if the stakes aren't her family's safety, particularly her husband?
When there are kids involved, they often have the kids get kidnapped instead 😒 But her husband is a reporter, so he should be nosy enough to get himself into trouble... 😩😩
That's funny because in the older Kim Eun Hee dramas I watched (Sign and Ghost) the leads had zero chemistry hahahaha.
Hmmmm, the chemistry would prolly be lacking for you, yeah.
I read the webtoon's synopsis, and the FL's supposed to be super competent, so I hope it stays that way.
I know better than to hold my breath, but AUGH I REALLY FUCKING HOPE SO!!!
Bahahaha! Them clips got to you too! I was like..."Well, maybe I could give it another try...." Talk about being in a toxic relationship. Some RR dramas practically scream, "You'll always come back to me!!" in my face, which is soooo ironic.
I knooooowww, we're so baaaaad- but how can I be normal about Neo Hou being manhandled, pinned down, and pampered??? 😩😭
I do know how much you love an empathetic mental health professional 🤭 If only you would write me that book.
Diabolical 😭
But sadly, the trailer made it look like the FL would be having most of the emotions :( Which I know is the point, but it should be a gradual thing with her still being repressed, and him feeling everything.
Should defs be a gradual thing! Also why did it seem like he was aloof? Like is there actually some kinda supernatural phenomena that switches their feelings??? Cuz, AT THE VERY LEAST HE SHOULD BE AS EMOTIONAL AS HER, THEN. And just... so many trad moments 😬
This club is gonna be inundated with so many posts once it starts airing hahaha.
Cub activity when Shadows of Desire starts airing: 📈📈📈📈
LMFAAAOO, the sass!!! Yeah, I wonder why...
Missed this the first time. I swear it wasn't sass! It was my bluntness striking again, and I was trying to be specific because I didn't understand why it made you more wary T . T Her cooking like a good little housewife, but having the sniper rifle gave more tongue-in-cheek, so it actually made me a little more hopeful.
I think it depends a lot on the approach and framing.
I agree!
I REMEMBER THAT SCEN VIVIDLY TOO, AHHAHAHA!!!! Augh, rewatching it... his sobbing and whimpering, and those tearful eyes... Giiiiiirl 😩😩😩😩 He might not've done it, but dang were we being well-fed upon this accusation 😌 I loved that drama, but that ending, man....
BAHAHAHAHAHA! OF COURSE THIS is the scene that lives rent free in our heads 😂 Why am I even surprised? This is why IU called him "an adorable person" when they asked her about dating him. I believe you, girl!!
I know!!! I wouldn't have minded the ending if it didn't feel like they were determined to make it sad. It felt forced. And if the writers were determined to kill someone off, it made more narrative sense for it to be Lee Jong Suk's character in the end instead of his wife. But I guess they wanted to be unpredictable.
I think it's mostly a mix between very character-focused (preferably m/f duos where both are competent), lots of whump, interesting plot that isn't too self-important (bonus points for an unusual approach), and minimal violence against women. Bonus points for role reversal/egalitarian dynamics, sibling dynamics, and disability/mental disorder rep as usual 😄
Good to know! Queen Mantis hits a lot of your main points except the violence against women :-/ There's more of it against men, but since FL and her copycat are killing men who are violent against women and children, you see some of that too. Still might be worth it for you though. It needed two more episodes to really flesh out the mother/son dynamic and some of the other characters' backstories (believe it or not, all the female characters had the most interesting backstories and the mens' were pretty weak or non-existent. It's usually the other way around, so I'm not complaining, but the men having better backstories would've improved the quality of the drama overall) but I still enjoyed it. The ending made it seem like there'd be a season two, but so far nothing's been announced so what was it for?
When there are kids involved, they often have the kids get kidnapped instead
Kids ruin everything 😒 (LOL)
Hmmmm, the chemistry would prolly be lacking for you, yeah.
When both dramas were airing, I remember most people saying it was lacking 💀I'm gonna choose to blame the casting directors.
I knooooowww, we're so baaaaad- but how can I be normal about Neo Hou being manhandled, pinned down, and pampered???
This makes me more empathetic to people who stay in toxic relationships because look at us 🤷♀️
Shan Bao throws him around so good!! And his eyes get huge every time! It's impossible to be normal about it.
Also why did it seem like he was aloof?
Yeah, I got that too! If they somehow managed to make this supposed empath a tsundere, I'm gonna scream!!!! Why can't mainstream crap write anythings but tsundere MLs?????
And just... so many trad moments
My stomach sank, man.
