Kimsamsoom

I think a big part of this reason is that.

For NDS, his path and character arc is very predictable and boring. For SDM and WIJ, their character arc and growth is already set in stone. NDS will be successful, richer than HJP even, he will mature and SDM will love him, blah blah blah Ever since he won the CODA competition, this was his only possible arc. Since that time, his company never faces any real danger.

But for HJP, we literally don't know how his story will end. His character arc is prone to many theories, and it is exciting.

No, the cheating on the test didn't matter, he was still a genius. NDS mentality is that he allows small negativities discount the the big positive things. And he never taps into his potential, often wasting it. What the first few episodes shows is that some people need the right push from the right person to achieve their potential.

For NDS, the one pushing him has always been SDM. It was only her support he needed. But for SDM, NDS gave her the means to reach her goals, but only as a tool, and not as a person. If NDS had not chosen her, and she had chosen another company, she most likely could have still succeeded due to her drive.

I disagree on the notion that NDS feels he didn't deserve certain things. Quite the contrary actually, because of his background, because of his parents, he felt that he has nothing in his life. So whenever he sees this little miracles, or winds of luck, he is quick to latch on.

A person who had more confidence would not latch on to every single positive thing that comes along, but due to NDS lack of confidence, every good thing that comes along he latches on tightly. As his confidence grew, he grew some clarity, and started choosing what he latches on to.

The character of NDS really has a lot to do with bad writing. Yes, NDS is selfish, immature and insecure. The problem is the writers dialed those emotions too much, that most people had trouble relating to NDS, regardless of his backstory. The writers did not find a proper balance between HJP. They knowingly mired NDS character in the mid, while unknowingly set up HJP to be the tragic hero.

They then created a time skip, as part of the plot to "fix" nds poor qualities. It just feels like lazy writing Good writers don't need time skips, as time skips cheapen a lot of the emotions audiences have felt for the characters. Plus the time skip is supposed to be 3-4 years. People get married and have kids and do a lot of great and bad things in that span of time.

I write about HJP cowardice as being his biggest flaw. He still has a lot to grow character wise. NDS has always had his trajectory set in stone. In fact when we were first introduced to Alex from 2STO, I already knew that NDS would eventually come to work for 2STO, his arc was in that sense very predictable and not as exciting.

HJP on the other hand, as you said is already successful, so the hole in his heart arc was quite unpredictable. I think until now, I dont know how his arc will end, as he continues to sabotage his own path to success with his cowardice. Which makes for a more exciting character.

Yeah, to be honest as I've mentioned before, the show in it's first 2 episodes showed a lot of promise. But as each new episodes have come out, it's become a very cliched love triangle story, where the ending has become very very predictable. The show is no longer a smart show, just your standard cliche love triangle type of drama. And that is where I think the writers have drop the ball. The only interesting character is HJP. WIJ could have been one as well, but she has not much screen time.

We cannot judge HJP's path to success, we are not shown his path, so we should not judge how hard or easy it was.

3 Main characters. WIJ, with her amount of screen time doesnt' count. I no longer look at the whose better, whose good, whose bad. I'm looking forward more to the remaining character arc. And SDM and NDS arc for me is already done, their path to success and ending is highly predictable and thus boring to me.

HJP is the one i'm invested in, because I don't know where or how he will end up, and that is what makes me excited.

Be ready for a world of pain :(

I disagree with this.

NDS path to success has always been predetermined and predictable. And all those things that you think are not perfect with NDS will easily be fixed with a simple time skip.

HJP's path to romantic success has shown to be a much more difficult climb. And out of the two main leads, he has more room to grow as a character.

The message that HJP and NDS tells SDM correlates with their personality. HJP is afraid to leave himself vulnerable to be hurt if she does not choose him.

NDS on the other hand only sees one option, to be with SDM, but i'm afraid how he will react if he is not chosen.

Actually career wise, a lot of SDM success can be traced back to HJP, and not NDS. HJP and NDS show their support to SDM in different ways.

NDS shows his support upfront, in your face kind of support. Constantly telling SDM how amazing she is.

HJP is more behind the scenes, gives tough love, tells her if she's wrong kind of support.

I know it has, but its not a very clear picture of what is going inside NDS head. Not clear enough that many were negatively attacking NDS character.

If the writer had written the backstory earlier, they would have garnered more sympathy votes.

Obvious to you maybe, since as you said, you can relate. But not to the general audience.

That's the thing, since you can relate to NDS, you felt he was sweet and apologetic. People who could not relate to him didn't think the world of him.

I think SDM feels more betrayed by HJP than NDS.

Yeah, that doesn't explain it as much. Like they left the reason he is like that up for interpretation, and most people interpreted it negatively for NDS.

All i'm saying, if they included the Ep. 9 backstory much earlier, it would have gained more sympathy from fans. And having the backstory earlier doesn't hurt the plot.

Like it's great you understand NDS, but at Ep. 9, people are not going to jump ship anymore. The investment into HJP was too great at that point, and no amount of backstory would change that.

That is my point.

Unpopular long post about HJP, and I apologize to my fellow HJP fans, I have not jumped ship :) Just an observation that made me love HJP even more.

Frankly speaking, I am starting to realize that HJP is a coward. Let me further explain this theory, and give some evidence.

The one thing NDS has over HJP, other than 4 cm, is his fearlessness. And this may seem ironic considering we often see NDS being scared, and panicky, but it's true. But when it comes to SDM, NDS is quite fearless.

Here is examples of where HJP is a cowards when it comes to SDM. Apologies if they are not in order, I am writing it off memory:

1. When HJP was young, he refused to use his real name to write to SDM.

2. When he had the chance to talk to SDM and tell her the truth about the lies, he instead decides to find the real NDS and train him to be the fake dosan, instead of just admitting to SDM herself that he is the Dosan from the letters.

And when he realizes that NDS would not be showing up, it took him a long time to get over his fear of facing SDM to turn his car around and go instead.

3. During Sandbox he gets his secretary to wear the mentor shirt to avoid SDM. He only wears it and helps her out DIRECTLY, after grandma KO'd HJP with her sad story about wanting to meet him earlier.

4. When SDM was stuck in the boonies, he drives to pick her up, and lies about it. He could have just said that I picked you up, because the person you were trying to sell Noongil called me up to tell me you needed a ride.

Problem is, HJP didn't want SDM to mistakenly think that HJP has romantic feelings for her, so he hides that truth, because he is afraid once again to confront SDM about his feelings.

5. Various scenes where he sees NDS and SDM having a good time, and he is tempted to tell her the truth, and he easily could have, but decides not to, because he is not ready to face his fears.

6. He is asked several times if he likes SDM, 3 times in fact, and he says no three times.

7. When the truth finally comes out and SDM confronts him, he actually stays quiet the whole time, paralyzed by fear.

8. Even during his confession to SDM about his feeling he was a coward. He could have stopped at saying I have feelings for you. But he needed to add the words, "this is in no way to pressure you, and I don't expect an answer."

Even before SDM has gotten a chance to react, he has already given her and him a way out.

Now we have to ask ourselves, what is HJP so afraid of?

My theory is this.

HJP is afraid, that the he will not measure up the HJP/fake NDS that SDM has built in her head. He is afraid that by allowing himself to be vulnerable to SDM, once she realizes that he has either changed in 15 years, or is nothing like the letters, she will reject him. And I think this fear is what is driving his character right now.

He is being ruled by fear now, he has all these excuses built into his psyche of why he won't deserve SDM or getting himself ready for if he is rejected.

In fact, we see HJP's fearlessness come out when he is working behind the scenes. When he is sandboxing for SDM, he is confident and fearless, but when he actually has to face her, and talk about feelings, he becomes worse than NDS, paralyzed by fear, mired in the mud.

It's no surprise, the person HJP is most honest to is actually Yong Shil. Someone who will not judge him, someone who will just listen to him.

I mean the evidence is overwhelming. Almost all promo materials are NJH and Suzy. Interviews are just them most of the time. Most TVN pictures in IG is them.

I just can't see it not happening.

Yes, it's an opinion, thus it's not a fact. It's real to me though.

There is a fine line between argumentative and aggressive, and the definition differs based on who is viewing it.

If I had the patience, I can dig up and quote and send them to you, and you be the judge whether argumentative or aggressive. But:

A. I don't have the patience

B. I don't really want to call out people by name.

Also keep in mind, definition lies on the beholder.

I cannot defend HJP fans in other forums like twitter, IG or otherwise since I don't post there, nor do I see their actions. I will take your word for it though.

Being aggressive over a fictional character is not warranted, when you are being aggressive to a real person.

Well, my post is meant to satire the bad NDS fans, so let's leave it at that. No need to be defensive, when you are not the intended target.

I only ever see you reply to me to be honest >.< I mean I don't mind it, it was just an observation.

Well it's happening, so congrats to your ship >.<

To be quite frank, Start Up could have been an amazing show. The first episode is probably one of the more effectual and poignant episode i've seen in 2020. It captivated me from the beginning, and pulled at my heartstrings all at the same time.

I understand you are trying to be unbiased, and I respect that. So I will try to do the same to the best of my abilities. And since you've taken time to write your comment i'll try to address all of them.

To be frank, the actors are doing a great job, I agree, the supporting cast have been great as well, but the story, for the lack of a better explanation, lacks direction. Until now, I still don't quite fully know what the writers mean for NDS to be. The fact that there is so much generalization, theories, bashing, praising for NDS means that the writers didn't create an easily relatable character. Now in terms of acting, this is my first time seeing NJH, so I can't comment on his acting, and since I don't know if the present NDS is what the writers actually wanted, I will just leave it at that, NDS confused me as who he is supposed to be.

Through the course of a Kdrama, the goal is not to satisfy everyone, but to satisfy most people. Kdrama's don't aim to satisfy a niche corner of the market, but rather the majority of the market. Yes your right, everyone has their personal opinion and outlook and understanding, but the goal of the writers, PD's and etc.. is to hopefully create a drama that is loved by the majority, and to create effectual storylines relatable to most people.

It has been mentioned several times already how NDS and SDM is endgame. BUT, the reason for that isn't because they feel like it, or have amazing chemistry. The reasoning that most people, HJP fans especially feel this is because of the amount of romantic scenes shared by NDS and SDM, the lessening amount of HJP screen time, the amount of promotional material, interviews, and etc... of only NJH and Suzy, and the fact that there will be a timeskip.

Yes of course fans cannot control the outcome of the show, that is understood. But just because our voice doesn't have power, doesn't mean we should not use it. I find most of HJP fan's just want a good ending for their hero, NDS fans on the otherhand, have nothing to worry about since their ship has docked.

I've said this in another post.

HJP's character shows us the inner strength that humans have, that we don't know we have.

NDS character shows us the hidden weaknesses we humans have, but refuse to admit we have.

There is quite a few moral lessons we can learn from the show. I agree.

I'll discuss personal growth of NDS and HJP in another post, as it is a huge thing that is worth discussing.

I disagree that most of the downs that SDM experienced were with NDS, which is why he deserves. It's not a fair comparison, because HJP never had the opportunity to be there for SDM. NDS being there for SDM was a matter of convenience due to close work proximity.

People like to debate and discuss different characters and their actions. I feel as long as they do it respectfully, it should be fine and not censored, whether it's NDS fans or HJP fans.

Just because fans are not the writer doesn't mean they cannot complain. The argument, if you don't like the script, then you go write one is a weak one IMO.

It's like saying, you can't be a food critic because you don't know how to cook. Or you don't know what a good book is because your not a writer. This is a false fallacy.

It is known.

I feel the writers dropped the ball, by not introducing NDS backstory earlier.

HJP got his heart wrenching backstory in episode 1, so as audiences, we empathize with him, and even justify his faults due to his rough upbringing and gentle soul. We gave NDS a harder time because he appeared to have an amazing life, and his character became quite inconsistent. Soft and kind, but spiteful and aggressive towards HJP being the best example of this.

For NDS on the other hand, we never get the explanation of why he acts the way he does or anything. So what ended up happening, due to rough writing, his character suffered, as it wasn't a very relatable character. To suddenly insert his backstory in ep 9 seems quite late in the game. By episode 9, the ships were built, painted, lacquered, and the sails were up. People were not suddenly going to jump ship more than halfway through the series.

You are bothered by an opinion based on generalization? Most people make opinions less on facts, but rather opinions. An opinion based on a fact, is simply a fact.

I make my comments based on majority of what I see.

Also I think you misunderstood, my post isn't about the bias of NDS fans. They are called NDS fans after all, so bias is to be expected, it's the needless toxicity, aggressiveness and marking that I am satiring.

Is there none of this in HJP fandom? there is, but if we were to empirically compare both fandoms, I think you will find that the NDS fans are more often than not the aggressor.

I agree that we shouldn't generalize one for the faults of many, but that's not what I am doing, I am generalizing the fandom, which is the only way to do it, considering the recipient.

Once again, I want to repeat, biases are fine. It's the aggression that comes with it that is not ok. Also since we are on the topic of biases, can you pray tell me why NDS fans are not ok that HJP fans are biased? You seem to be ok with HJP fans being biased, how come your fellow NDS fans are not? Are you majority or the minority?

You are entitled to your opinions and analyses of course >.<

BTW, curious question, how come you only reply to my comments. Just curious.

It wasn't pointed at you actually, but if you got hurt, then maybe you should ask yourself that question.

You seem logical and thoughtful though, but that's up to you how long that will be.

And you think this isn't happening, maybe you should read the other comments, not just mine >.<

they wasted the premise.

Potential SIlicon Valley/Cyrano mashup destroyed.

What bromance?

The writing is on the wall. HJP will care for Grandma after she goes blind so that NDS and SDM are free to get married and move to silicon valley.

He plays whiny and brooding quite well.

But his face is just not very expressive.

In Kdrama, with the amount of closeup's they do, the ability to impart emotion with your face is one of the most important talents actors should have.