Descending On You

They did, and it was considered a wife's "filial duty" to allow her husband to have a harem and "secure" his "line" 🤡

This is exactly what I think. She wouldn't defend herself against rumors, despite nothing happening, because she was holding that in her arsenal to get out of this sham marriage. She may have spoken up if Gu hadn't already gotten "remarried" and another woman pregnant 🤧

You will have to wait until it's done. There's a LOT of drama and a lot of viewers have become demoralized, but I have full confidence for a happy and satisfying ending!!

VIKI POSTED EARLY

Maybe this did happen, though! They didn't tell us, and so left it up to each of us personally to figure out what happened. Your idea is best case scenario 🤞🏻

She probably did, but they definitely did not do it enough for her to get pregnant re: incorrect timing. Over 2 years, doing it only a few times, it's just not likely. And we saw how she wasn't encouraging him to come home early to hang out with her.

I haven't seen part 2 ep 6 yet, but if he's got a new concubine who's already pregnant after a few months, then that all but confirms their marriage was crap before he abandoned her

I definitely think there will be a happy ending, too!

I need to stop 😭

I am dying Viki T_T

Welcome back!

Hypocrisy is a state of being. One who engages in it is a hypocrite. Once you stop engaging in hypocrisy, you cease to be a hypocrite. That is not calling you a name. I don't think I necessarily commented a moral judgement on hypocrisy, you understood it to be negative (I liked your word! "Derogatory") and took it personally. If you didn't care about being a hypocrite, this conversation would've ended long ago. You would not be arguing with anyone who disagrees with you. You would take the "I said what I said" attitude and move on. What I was trying to do was appeal to your mind that you should go back, internalize the events of that movie, and see that you are objectively wrong. Then you can decide whether a re-watching matters to you or not, and from there choose if you want to change the way you think about one or the other. I doesn't impact me in the slightest if you decide to hate both, love both, or continue being a hypocrite. At worst, it's a label, but it is not a name.

I like emojis, they convey more than just text. Not sure what you mean by digging, considering we've completely moved from the original discussion about the show. And if you want to say goodbye to this conversation, like you've said twice now, why would you want me to keep digging? Wouldn't you rather I go away? This is proof to me that you only said goodbye because you knew you had lost the original argument; now you're ready to play again because you think you caught me slacking when you didn't. I reiterate, hypocrisy is a state of being. How each person interprets it is up to their individual. You obviously don't like it, so the way to drop that label is to no longer engage with hypocrisy. The best way to convince your mind of the state is to watch the movie again with a critical eye. I don't *need* you to do anything to prove my point. It stands alone. That was a recommendation for you to help your growth as a person. If you can admit to hypocrisy, it really helps to understand one's moral positioning (and will strengthen your resolve to them!).

I genuinely hope you have a nice day. And I do hope you have a happy watching, but I don't think you will (for this show at least, not without deciding to change your mind). If it's any consolation, and a throwback to the original discussion, if Gil Chae does start actually cheating on her husband, I will be in the "no good endings for cheaters!" camp, right along side you. Here's hoping she's stronger than you think she will be!

Not names, it's a state of being. It's not like I called you a poopy-face 🤣 Wrong again. I was trying to point out the fallacies in your argument. I'm telling you I just saw the movie, I think you are looking upon the movie with a different memory lens and rewatching might change your opinion 😉 That's not personal. I'm glad you took the idea of being a hypocrite personal, though despite what you say (or you wouldn't have answered). Maybe we'll get some change that way!

I still hope you have a happy watching, but you won't if you hate the leads. Have a nice one 👋🏻

> Realizes he's wrong when confronted with the facts of the situation.
> Having no response, blames the other for getting too "personal".

You're not interested in this exchange because you see yourself losing now that you've actually given some additional information than, "They're cheaters." You have been very interested with everyone else you thought you were schooling. Which part was too personal? The facts, or the education that the way you define words is not correct and fluctuates based on convenience? Because that is also a fact. I caught you in a lie - talking out of both sides of your mouth and holding two separate standards for the same situation (one inspired by the other, we know this) - and now you're trying to bounce. Just admit you are wrong.

I agree nothing else needs said. I would just keep pointing out the flaws of your argument. I agree this was fun and a good intellectual exercise. Happy watching.

Ah yes, so happily married she asks him to not come home early to hang out with her in the evening 😐 but that's beside the point.

Scarlett told her husbands less about her feelings and thoughts than did Gil Chae. She was more deceptive the whole time. I don't know what you're on about there, your own definition doesn't stand up, and you are just incorrect. You need to go back and watch that movie, I guess - I just did. Then you can admit you're a hypocrite and call it a day. You wanted to hate Gil Chae but for some reason wanted to like Scarlett, so you came up with something. However, your logic makes no sense and is simply based on a falsehood.

Not sure how the husband is going to be a roadblock if she doesn't make him one. Did you forget he's a month's travel away in Korea? He can't prevent her from doing anything unless she makes him prevent her from doing them. That is then called not cheating. Some genius-level stuff right here, I know.

You keep saying she doesn't know, and I've seen other people reminding you, but like with Scarlett's "infidelity" which you won't admit to - you conveniently can't remember that scene where she finds out the husband is trash. I'm going to tell you again... She does know he abandoned her. The slavor told her, before she is even freed by Jang. Not that it even matters because they still aren't cheating - not any more than Scarlett did and you loved her - including by your own definition. I don't know how to get it into your head.

I don't know why you are still watching. It will not get better from here for you. I'd have dropped by now, if I was you.

I am not going to call her a cheater until she is one. You shouldn't either. Today's episode is coming out, we'll see. As of episode 14, she has been loyal to her husband to her own detriment, even if that fact upsets you.

They still aren't having an affair. Ditto on the die thing, though

Gu fumbled hard, but isn't the worst character ever. RE was AWFUL but for some reason is redeeming himself to me. Princess is annoying, but she's a princess lmao what do you expect? There's nobody I can't stand on the screen except the awful AWFUL Joseon king.

To be fair, he was jealous in part 1 as well even before they were married. Jealous before they were engaged because she pinned for a "dead" man, and jealous she ran off with him when he was suddenly alive. I actually agree with you that it was wrong of her to do that - she had an agreement with him made, even if they weren't vows yet - however, it's not out of character for Gu to be jealous, you just don't like that that IS his character. Or rather, the extreme of his character.

She may still try to go back to Gu, you have no idea. Gil Chae has actually done a remarkable job resisting her Jung passions post-nuptials and remaining true to her husband. I can give you a few examples:
1) She refused to ask Jang for help for about a year, despite him being the best chance of her getting out of slavery - and she knew that but chose to wait for her husband anyway.
2) After being saved from the slavers, she stays hidden in her room after Jang has gotten drunk to prevent any sort of "drunken mistake" from happening. Once he is asleep, only then did she come outside to sit. She kept that barrier up between them in a situation she wasn't sure about.
3) At the end of episode 14, Gil Chae is indebted to Jang saving her twice at this point. She's missed him for years, wants to reach out to him while he's unconscious after saving her this second time, yet she realizes she can't, grabs her skirt while shedding a tear, and grabs a rag instead to wipe his face so that their skin does not touch.

What more can she do? She can't control the feelings she already had for him, that have only been heightened because he was so steadfast about her and risked himself to save her twice, which her husband knows about and begged her to marry him despite...

You call them cheaters, but Jang cannot be one. He was in love with her before the husband came around and even still is not tied to anyone else by law or ethically. If he had fallen in love with a married woman out of the gate, I would be in the "dude, pick someone else" camp, like I was in Poldark for example, but he was in love with her long before. So, it's impossible for Jang to be a cheater, but I can see a debate about Gil Chae.

However, she isn't a cheater either. You're angry about something that hasn't happened yet. There has been no physicality between them and she keeps putting up walls. She has tried the entire part 2 to go back to her husband (I reiterate, not Jang, point 1 above) and now that the husband has abandoned her and she is stuck operating with Jang, she is restraining herself.

And obviously the physicality is what bothers you because you think Gone With the Wind had no moral quandary (I am responding to your comment directly to me above now). I assure you, Scarlett was married and widowed twice but was in love with Ashley the entire time. But you have no issue with that - so lingering feelings in a relationship are not cheating by your insinuation. I agree with you if they aren't something you are doing intentionally. However, at this point you need to realize that despite Gil Chae's lingering feelings she has not acted on them and that is what makes her faithful to her husband still. The choice to restrain herself in the midst of temptation is what maintains her fidelity.

So no, neither Gil Chae nor Jang are cheaters. Yet.

I, like you, hope they remain that way. I want Gu to die which then allows the main leads to get together. Gu has always been jealous, that's his character. I agree he is weak, unmanly, and only exists as a roadblock right now, but disagree that he's a cuck - and I don't think that's where this story is headed. Gil Chae has grown up, her final growing moment was realizing she had to honor her commitments and walked away from Jang to marry Gu.

> "She should go back to her husband clear her situation. This is what someone with decent morality should do no matter what her husband does."
I will be disappointed if she decides to become less mature despite what she's gone through (as I outlined above), but it's odd you would think the husband should have complete room to fail, while Gil Chae should get no grace despite her continued efforts to succeed. It would simply be foolish for her to return without an escort right now. And she has no money, she was just released from slavery. A lone (noble) woman travelling for a month all the way from China would be ripe for the re-capture and would nullify the entire first 4 episodes of this part. That would be so annoying...

I hope the story ends up happy for all, but that means Gu must die. I didn't hate him as a love rival and still don't hate his character, though. He just can't live for the outcome I want the story to have. I also think it's exaggerated that Gu would let his wife go missing for 2 months without sending ANYONE out looking for her (especially if they were happy, but then again maybe they weren't). However, that's the story. Gu is a jealous person. If he hadn't wasted all this time and been so wishy-washy, he may have had her back in Joseon right now. Even still, she may choose to be the better person and return like she has tried this entire part. We will see. Hoping for a happy end!

Happy to hear you decided! I'm sorry it wasn't a good fit, and was a stressful watch

I see your points, and they would be true if this were a documentary. However, dramas are fiction, written for a modern audience - so really, watching with 2023 eyes is the intended way to view it 😂

They've already strayed from realism quite a bit, so there's no reason for them to start now to give Officer Gu a happy ending at the expense of the lead characters we're following. Some examples of fictionalization include: 1) The interactions at the very beginning of the story between the young lords and ladies (they say it's particular for Joseon, but everyone's just fine with it lol), 2) Gil Chae's entire personality (she would not have been raised that strong-headed and she was such a flirt she would've been considered a skank and unmarriagable), 3) Gil Chae never would have helped the maid give birth (a minor point, but it did cross my mind), 4) Gil Chae absolutely would not have had the stamina to outrun horses on the beach carrying a baby (as a sheltered noble woman, or a person in general just not being able to outrun horses), 5) No noble woman would've worked outside the home (smithy towards the end of Part 1), likewise 6) No man of Gu's station would've accepted a wife who had, 7) Especially a noble woman who had gone into a gisaeng house, 8) And according to Joseon logic, Gu would've just killed her when she came back after running away with Jung in Part 1, episode 10. He says they were practically married and he was within his power to kill both of them then. Why didn't he? If the argument is he loves her, why didn't he save her from slavery and rape? Both things cannot be true and Joseon rules obviously don't apply, or none of the above-listed things would have happened.

Suffice it to say, the drama has admitted canonically that the characters act outside of Joseon's expected structures (re: point 1, in episode 1 of part 1 if you want to double check me) and if this were to be a very life-like show the story would not have happened at all. All the women would already be dead, Jang would be in Shimyang probably, and we never would have met Officer Gu. A final note is that this show was obviously based off of Gone With the Wind (although we're moving away from it now - which is a good thing in my opinion), and probably the most important aspect is a pseudo-magical, fate aspect of their soul-mate dynamic. People don't have mystical dreams about soul-mates or chance encounters like this. So, I guess that would be point 9 on the above list.

So, if you're categorizing Gil Chae's portrayal as "just wrong" because of the times/setting, then I would say that's because the drama only sort of cares about those rules anyway - we've known about it since the start, and have continually had it reinforced. Really no point in bringing it up now. If you're characterizing it as wrong morally, that's a completely separate thing (which I would agree with you on, but maybe not for the same reasons), however you seem angry about the idea of Officer Gu's death which would actually permit Gil Chae and Jang to be together, both in Joseon times and morally.

I'm just curious, if you would allow me to ask you a question in good faith, what do you hope happens in the story? Do you think the characters/story is poorly written? Why do you continue to watch if you do not like the direction it's taking? I am genuinely curious. I have never hate-watched a show

I get anxiety everytime I watch this show, but I will be VERY surprised if it ends up unhappy. Seriously.That being said, it might benefit you to not drop but pause right now, - especially if it's really taking a toll on your mental health. There's only a few weeks left until it's done, if you pause it now and reply back to this comment once it's over, I would be happy to tell you whether it has a happy ending and you should continue. Knowing there's a happy ending may make the rest of it less depressing

Honestly, I'm in the same boat. I just don't think a sad ending is where they want to take the story... I am disappointed we didn't get the conflict I was hoping with officer Gu and the main couple staying together, but it could still happen since he said he's sending someone to Shimyang and she's with Jang now.

In the end, I think Gu will die - will have to die from a storytelling perspective - and that will let them finally be together. I am curious how they want to tie the first several minutes of the show back in, or maybe they won't and it was just a dramatic opening for the story