Nepeta 22

On the tag, I see "snake". Does anyone know what that means? Are there snakes in this drama or it has another meaning?

I'm not making anything complicated. It's yourself making it complicated. Also, if you've read the comments, it's just healthy discussions that sometimes involves mention of actors that have done well or not done well in other dramas. I don't see that as promotion of other dramas.

Trying to tell others not to do that is wrong. The point of discussions on a drama forum is to discuss actors/actress' works and suitability for their role here. Someone mentioning a similarity to another drama is not promotion.

Being defensive all the time is actually more harmful than helpful. I hope everyone can just chill a bit and let conversations move along naturally. It's not a page to fakely act on-code for one fandom. This drama is part of a cast, so more openness is needed to accommodate others that come for other actors and production.

Thanks!

I understand. You need to be ready and in the mood with these types of dramas.

Yes take your time.

It's all healthy in general from what I see. Don't let 1 or 2 miserable self appointed gate-keepers put you off, although they may blow a gasket since you mentioned LOZH and that's not permitted here apparently.

If you've never watched a republican drama, then it's good to see the ML has brought you into watching a broader range of c-dramas. Often republican dramas can be laden with too much politics so I suggest these for first time watchers. One that is with politics, one that is a fun detective one and one that will be set at a similar time to this drama.

Fearless Whispers - no English translation at the moment. Set around 1947-8.
War of Faith, a drama that looks at the financial world at the time of 1940s.
Detective L - Fast paced detective drama inspired by Sherlock Holmes.

Please do put those comments in spoiler. There are still new watchers.

FYI, I was told from someone that the emperor was killed by ZBW apparently. Personally, I just don't think cutting corners on that part was right, since it's clear they wanted to sort of show history repeating itself in which father and son did not trust the emperor so seeing his death or at least spend time to hint more would be at least closure. I was also told the first master was some sort of prisoner that was given a chance to live longer and was always destined to be dead after his "mission", all based on some tattoo I barely even saw, but the point is, this obscure info is not for passerby viewers like myself and I think that is unfair and makes me lose some understanding.

They should have spent more time on that and the lady that was hired to train ML on relationships with women. We're just left to assume, 3rd person master just picks up waifs and strays and use them and they're forever thankful. As for ZZX's character, this is so odd. He's suddenly a decent man, even after all the double dealing going on? I can understand why some are asking for a second season. The closure seems unsatisfying in regards to his character.

I'm different from you in that I looked forward to the ML & FL's interaction until it hit halfway and then her character just switched and from there-on her acting went awry and everything just did not seem natural and she was out of sorts. I put that down to her playing against type. Her simplistic arrogant and spoilt persona just did not look right on her. Then her acting like a saint all of a sudden fawning over his cause also seemed out of character. Then they even painted her mother the same way fawning over ML's father, it felt a little cringe.

It's a shame as I said from the beginning the story is there, but the way it was put together seemed odd and if as you say it may have something to do with whether it needed 2 parts or not, then they made the wrong call. Flourished Peony had 2 parts, Lost you forever had 2 parts and also Eternal Brotherhood. Sometimes, some projects are ambitious and grand and requires fleshing out and not because it's deliberate fillers for more advertising. If they wanted to keep to 40 episodes, they really should have shaved the FL's role as she was almost like decoration once you get past half way.

You finished it! Great read and honest one and I cannot fault it because I too also said the same for the FL. Terrible two dimensional role and she looked out of sorts too. One of her sub-par performances. I'll be honest, without XZ, I think there will be more critics on the drama and characterisations. Lots of loose ends and parts just left out thinking it's OK when it's not really OK. That is why I said, it's so focused on central plot all the smaller details especially the masters and the one that self sacrificed and the lady were not delved on which does make for a 2-tiered system whereby there is no interest in these characters because they were there just to serve the ML's purpose.

A rating of 8.4 is actually very good on MDL BTW. Sometimes, people who watch K-dramas see often inflated ratings so the bar has shifted, and dramas that deal with romance as the main plots & Xianxias often get higher ratings regardless of plot, acting or visuals. Outside of MDL, I'm sure the drama has a good rating.

The drama is more about three main character and their differences and follows them through that period. I felt there was enough material on the revolutionaries. I'm more concerned that Yuan Shikai was mentioned throughout and never shown which I felt a little disappointed in as it's very clearly so much about him and very instrumental at that moment in time in China.

Could he be the reason there was a stoppage and they deliberately did not show images of him or have even an actor play him for even a tiny bit?

I was very happy to see the Japan arc and actors needing to speak Japanese on long dialogue. It was an important part to the drama and also (in my opinion) quite accurate of China's relationship with Japan at the time. People forget that many revolutionaries were also station in Japan at the time but never mentioned that much in recent times.

It will get worse than what you just mentioned, so maybe not going to be a good watch for you. But honestly, this is a well researched drama and they sure did not pull punches of men's views of women and most importantly, how women lived during that period and the social norms and expectations of them, whether being used when it suited their needs or casting them as mere women and need to be in their place.

I am expecting some nominations next year though, because there are some sterling performances in this.

No it wasn't was it. But to be honest, I applaud him accepting this role. It takes a lot and a risk to star in something like this. I personally think this was a good project for him. May help him get more meatier 3 dimensional roles that will be more complex and layered rather than Mr Good Guy...

Yes, you may change your mind. It's one of those dramas where you really ought to watch right to the very end to form a more rounded opinion, especially on the ML. Enjoy!

I would have liked him more aggressive in this role as it would make him less confusing to read and more understandable, even relatable. I feel by being too controlled, sometimes, it comes across as more wishy washy than single minded determinedness. He's compassionate at times, but then suddenly cold and calculating which can work but the way it's been edited did not feel smooth or coherent. The only way to make it work better is to put more time in building his character to the audience but the drama spent more time on plots and pushing the villains' character and less on his own thoughts. That's my thoughts anyway.

I get you. And I understand your comments on the super heroes. Unfortunately, this drama seems to paint the ML as salt of the earth and a caring person as well. I'm fine with the FL's quest for revenge and violence, but I think, if they had made ML more aggressive it may have been more understanding.

Please stick with it. I would like to see what you think of the ending. Only then can you truly have the full opinion of what went on with the earlier episodes. That's all I can say...

The drama was fine for me, but definitely issues with scripts being light weight, and character development is rushed with no attempt to give depth apart from Duke's character. Very little breathing space and contemplation for the ML which I feel was much needed. FL's character was unconvincing. She changes too drastically to be realistic.

I see you are not up to episode 30 so there will be more twists and turns so I won't spoil you. By the end you will sort of get what some of the episodes feel and you may re-visit your thoughts on the earlier arcs.

But for now, I totally agree, I went through all that. I think the character for the ML is supposed to be naive, and still idealistic to some extent so he flip flops quite easily.

Towards the end you will may re-think his character again, because I think the reuters and trailers gave an air of sophistication when in actual fact, the ML is learning and easily swayed. He is determined but also flawed. In no way like how they advertised this drama. Think of a young man embarking on a journey of discovery even if he spent 10 long years trying to hone his skills, he looks pretty green in a large part of the drama. It's supposed to be his journey of learning the hard way. For large part of the drama, he was never winning until the final episodes.

From beginning to end, he was motivated by personal revenge and then this emotion was nurtured by his handlers with obvious ill intent. The "journey" is when he tries to humanise it by saying all these other court officials are bad, are corrupt and murderous. As you say, that still does not sit well with the full revenge plot. I personally think revenge dramas are getting harder and harder to sell to today's audience if it involves a lot of collateral damage. So unless you are going for ruthless hard-nut realism any other way with so many deaths will soon make viewers get turned off for the cause.

Yes, I had exactly the same feeling. By mid way when you see the damage and the sacrifices fighting against eunuch Cao's security it dawns on you about a 2-tiered system happening whereby the likes of the ML and FL care very little for those that perish. Yes, we see bits of ML questioning why and what, but he still carries on. There is no pause or contemplation,, just a mad rush to push the plot onwards.

That means the master's plans have fully co-opted him and he was played all along. Only do we see ML's final brilliance shine in the final few episodes, but that then leaves a bitter after taste about the sacrifices others made. It reminds me why I don't watch too much court intrigue nowadays and there is an over saturation of it. A spotlight on nobles which are just a select privilege few.