hvnlyangel

@ Hellomeme. I don’t think that it’s one of her tricks. It could be psychological because she did dream about being locked up when she refused to be the Imperial grandson’s consort/concubine.
Or maybe someone gave her something to drink and made her lose her voice because from the preview on episode 34 she recovered pretty fast.
But maybe the two leads finally communicated better and worked it out and she was able to get over it and she was able to talk again.

Yes

@ Draco I think that the Ming style clothing is fine on both of the men and women though albeit wide. But I guess this drama and Song of Youth is a more accurate depiction of Ming era clothing. Except Avenue X said that the color of the color is more muted than how it was supposed to be during that era. But the colors she shown to be period accurate was much too bright and gaudy for my aesthetics. I like the colors of the clothings, more muted, yet elegant and refined. I’ve learned that it’s hard for productions to be completely period accurate especially the only source of reference to be had is from drawings, and renderings on pottery. I feel that this is close enough to the era , which is good enough for me.
At least they are trying.
I do agree with you about the makeup though. I feel like the natural makeup is fine but they women need some blush or something. Wu Jin Yan in some scenes look really washed out. Maybe it’s also the lighting , some scenes everyone looks fine but in other scenes I wish that they some color in their faces. The makeup isn’t corpse makeup like some YouTubers are saying but some more blush or something will do wonders. But at least the women are not all super pale, Zhi Jin’s makeup looks like she has a little tan compared to people in some other dramas.
Then men look fine.

@ DramaAjumma,
I wanted to add that I don’t think that Zhi Jin is avoiding consummating their relationship in order to let the other consorts have a turn or be on equal footing.
At the beginning on their wedding night Zhu Zhanji avoided going to her rooms and went to the practice yard instead.
I feel that he was trying to give her space and time. She was unwilling and rejected him several times and now she is forced to marry him thought she has accepted it.
His getting hurt again is a pretext of the reason why he couldn’t go to visit her to consummate their marriage. He wanted to give her some time to grow in her affections for him, that is probably his reasoning.
She on the other hand pointed out while she was in the bath that he couldn’t stay because it will be bad for his reputation. If he stayed and consummated their relationship than everyone will know and he would be forced to go to Nanjing.
I think thought Zhi JIn was willing after Zhangji gave her the necklace and says that he is willing to give her some time to grow in her affections for him. But alas he was called away. Then the emperor died and there was a mourning period, and the whole noble consort guo thing happened.

So in the end of episodes 29 and all of epsidoe 30, there whole interactions are funny. He is annoyed with her for taking what he told his mother to heart. He took advice from YIfan to treat her coldly than supposedly she will be around him all the time than .
But as of now no one is willing to make the first move. ZZJ is spending time with his other women but he sees Zhi JIn’s hand in everything that it is giving him a headache. Zhi jin is helping the other consorts but he can see that she is. Zhi JIn also tricked concubine Wu into thinking that wine was stored in the pond. So that makes me question how much Zhi JIn is really helping them. But she might be doing that to Concubine Wu because she knows COncubine Wu doesn’t like her but later she went to apologize to her. But Zhi Jin also stayed the night and knew that the emperor was there. So that with the music and chess moves that she taught the other concubines makes me thinks that she is playing a game to make the emperor think of her. So she is helping them in away but she is making her presence known too.
But ZZJ did mention that since Zhi JIn annoyed the empress dowager and concealed noble consort guo he is punishing her too in a way by treating her coldly.
Otherwise his mother will and can punish her harshly.
I went into my detail in my posts below.

But by episode 31 they should be reconciled., because she is conferred as Noble
consort Sun.

That’s just my take on it. Because at first I was like what is she doing. Someone else mentioned if Zhi JIn is employing some Yanxi Palace tactics. But I don’t think that she was in the beginning before she was forced to marry him, she is now, especially in episodes 30 and what she said to him at the end of episodes 29.
Being in the harem is very precarious the only way to survive is to have status and the emperor’s affection. She is trying to get both now securely.
She said to ZiPing that someone didn’t let her hide and avoid so she won’t and she will do only what she can do. Zi ping asked her about what happened to Noble consort guo and said to avoid that. But Zhi Jin wants to change it. Dowager Empress Zhang even told her all you consorts know what to do is to fight for affection and be jealous of each other, and known of you will have power as long as I am alive. So Zhi Jin is she wants to survive and to change things she has to have powers and the only way to do that is to get the emperor’s love .

As of the bedroom preference thing, we don’t know that dowager empress said to Zhi Jin while they were alone and ZhanJi was waiting outside. Maybe dowager empress Zhang told her to not take all of the emperor’s affections, etc. Who knows. So maybe Zhi jin is partly avoiding the emperor because of that.
Well their avoidance of each other accomplishes multiple thing:
Zhi JIn doens’t receive harsh punishment
The emperor spends more time with other consorts( and rather or not they find favor with him is up to them)
It allows the dowager empress to see that Zhi Jin isn’t going to be like another noble consort guo who lords the emperor’s affections over everyone.
The emperor can’t stop thinking about Zhi Jin.

@ DramaAjumma
Your analysis of Zhi Jin’s character is very interesting. I have a different take on it.
I feel that when Zhi JIn met the Hu Shanxiang she did sympathize with her and partly rejected Zhu Zhanji because of that. When he learned of her background and identity and he said I won’t let anyone hurt you. She first lets him embrace her but when she senses or sees Hu’s presence she pushes him away. She also wants to stay at the food bureau and rise in her career on her when merit and interests.
When Empress Zhang, then the Crown Princess wanted her to be ZZJ’s secondary consort she asked her if she wasn’t afraid of bringing calamity. It could be she was resentful of what happened or she will bring disharmony to his harem.

I also questions the relationship ZZJ has with his concubines. In Episode 25 they are mocking Zhi Jin for the CP ZZJ not staying the night after their “wedding ceremony” ( I put that in quotations because they didn’t have a real wedding ceremony.” They mockingly said that it was because she smelled oily from the kitchens and the CP couldn’t stand the smell so that is why he didn’t stay the night and consummate. The CP HU said that it was because the CP wound opened again.
It was only when they saw that Zhi Jin was receiving gifts from the ML that they knew that she was in favor. The ML avoided all of them except for Hu in the beginning so I really wonder about his relationship with them, did he ever consummate his relationship with them. I wonder if he did for the sake of duty one time and then avoided them altogether or he never did but they aren’t going to let the others know that. But in episode 30 he did let concubine Wu massage his arm so that seems to me that there relationship could be more intimate.

But in regards to Zhi Jin she is kind and wants everyone to succeed and do well. I don’t know if she would apply that to the harem. She did help his other consorts but ZZJ can tell right away that she was involved somehow, She helped one of them with the game, and he got annoyed because the ML knew that she helped coach her, She taught the other one that song and the bracelet she gave concubine Wu all reminded him of her. With her intelligence she will definitely know by doing these things he would know that it was her helping h. She wasn’t being subtle, Zhi JIn wanted her presence known. Otherwise she would teach the concubine another musical piece etc . On my comments below I wrote what I think she was doing.
Zhi JIn can be kind and wiling to help the other concubines get his affection but honestly who is really willing to share the man she loves, without having a firm hold on his affections.
As of now, she knows how much ZZJ loves her but he is still unable to defy his mother with giving her the noble consort title and he said that all of his concubines were the same in his eyes. So she is like fine go to them instead.
Right now Zhi Jin has no position her status is the same as before and she is on equal footing as Concubine Wu. She has no real power. The dowager empress Zhang said as long as I am alive you all will have no power. And from their conversation Zhi JIn was saying that since Noble consort guo has 3 sons and she has to be forced to be buried with the emperor regardless this sets a dangerous precedent that isn’t inline to what came before. Therefore in the future if Zhi JIn or anyh other ZZJ’s other consorts/concubines have sons they won’t be exempt from being forced to die and be buried with him.
So I feel that right now Zhi Jin wants to have a solid footing in Zhu ZHanji’s heart , she wants as high of a status as she can have that he is able and willing to give her. IF she wants to have any influence to change things she needs his backing and status and power. Now she is in limbo. So from the episode 31 promo I feel that she is hiding in his study with a puppet and she is going to coax him out of his bad mood, which resulted from her in the first place.
She will help the other concubines too, her nature is kind, but I feel that she wants to be confidant first that she is first in his heart. She is kind of like Ruyi in that sense of being kind to the emperor’s other woman and seemingly generous with sharing his affections, but Ruyi was also sure of her place in the emperor’s heart, for awhile at least.

Well said.

@ Draco it seems like they are making ZZJ’s father seem more foolish. Historically, Hongxi emperor was a pretty great emperor who’s policies were continued by his son.
He just wanted a personal who was blessed both military and military, 文武雙全, like his son. So he was very looked down upon by his father , who favored his second brother. And his wife, Empress Zhang really helped him a lot. I want to say that his relationship with is wife was much closer than it was portrayed in this drama. I read somewhere that she was a great confidant to him and helped him with his policies etc.
I don’t know why he was portrayed this way in the drama. Although as crown prince Hongxi emperor must have felt very stressed everyday with the way his father treats him and the way his brothers’ are eyeing his position.
I watched a YouTube video who said that it is usually that the son gets his position, or become emperor because of his dad and not the other way around.
It is a big part of the Yongle’s affection for his grandson that he choose Zhu Gaozhi as crown prince. He really favored the Prince Han though because he was the most like his father. But Prince Han was very militaristic and would have brought more war for country.
When the Yongle emperor was debating who to appoint the her apparent one of his advisors brought him a painting of a tiger and its cubs. Basically the advisor stated that they are all your sons from the painting. So even if they are lacking in any way they are at least your children. Plus you have a grandson. This scene was depicted in the drama Ming dynasty.

@ Ines The differed roles that Wu Ji Yan has portrayed are vastly different. WeiYinglou, Haolan, and Zhi Jin all have different temperaments.
Wu JI Yan has said in her interviews that the role of Zhi Jin is her most gentlest portrayal of a character.
Personally, I feel that WeiYinglou’s character is exaggerated. If someone acted like her in palace she would have been in trouble ten times over. I feel that her character in Yanxi Palace was more modern too in a way.
Haolan and Zhi JIn are more poised, reserved, girls from good families who are taught all the womanly skills, of embroidery etc, instrument playing , basically all t womanly traits and skills valued at that time.
WYL was more uncultured, uneducated and more wild in her actions. And for that time more not of the norm especially if one wants survive in a palace setting . She was very admirable though and fearless.

I personally feel those Zhi JIn has more modern ideals she is still very much a product of the times or at least she acts that more than WYL.
I guess it’s a matter of personal taste. I feel that Wu Ji Yan has improved in her acting in this drama. She’s very elegant you can tell by the way she is holding a calligraphy brush etc.
She acted in a drama last summer and she did some crying scenes and that was a little bit cringe to me.
I think that she is portraying the character of Zhi JIn very well. Zhi JIn is a very strong person too, and has her personal ideals . Her heart is more tenderhearted and forgiving.. She really fought for her freedom and dream but alas she continue it because she wasn’t as powerful and was maneuvered into a new direction in life. So she decided to accept it make the most of it and to enact change to help others and herself.
WYL wanted to enact revenge on those that wronged the people she loved. She changed the whole direction of her life because of that. But I don’t remember her doing anything to try to change things overall for everyone else.

But that is my personal opinion, and analysis. We all have our personal preferences.

I do appreciate all the discussion on this thread. This is the first time that I have actively participated in the discussions for a drama so much.

@ stellaris

I am rewatching the episode. There isn’t another historical drama or modern drama that I am interested in right now.

But it’s funny about how You Yi Fan is giving the ML advice on her to deal with the FL. Saying all women are the same and that if you neglect her and don’t pay attention than she would essentially grateful to see you. So the ML went to go do that and it backfired on him. After the conversation, the underling of the Yifan asked him if this method would work. And he replied essentially God knows. Ha!

I want them to be together too. It’s pretty funny now their tactics in dealing with each other. You can tell that the ML really loves the FL lead.

Yes Yanxi palace was sad. Fuhong’s love was so devote and unconditonal for WeiYingLou. I was excited for this CP too when the drama was first announced.

@Red Lotus Pavilion.
The empress doesn’t really have the power to change the rule. So the FL couldn’t change but she is a mother and she can influence her son.
But ultimately the emperor makes the decision because it is the tradition and seemed prestigious I guess. Awful.

I read somewhere that the Xuande Emperor, the ML, decreed to not have any consorts forced to be buried with him. However, his court officials said that since he was such a great emperor that there needed to be consorts buried with him. So 10 were.
After the ml lead’s death it was the Dowager empress Zhang and some officials who held the regency power, the new emperor was only 8 at the time.
The FL lead never held much power while her MIL was alive. Even then she didn’t have as much political influence as her MIL did.

You’re welcome!
Someone posted below a link for the episodes that are subtitled on FB. Those are better I think, though it has caught up to the most recently aired episodes yet.

Historical cdramas are especially hard to understand sometimes and hard to translate all of nuance of what is said.
I have to go back and rewatch when I don’t understand and try to read the simplified Chinese or ask my mom. Ha she’s watching this show too.

Xu kai said in an interview that it was easier for him to play the imperial grandson, and playing the emperor was the hardest.

The emperor says something but he is also implying something else in what he says. So it’s like word within words so I can imagine that would be hard to translate.

@ Sirry Usly
Oh that’s an interesting take on it. You are probably right that there is bound to be someone jealous with Zhi jin’s new status and her relationship with the emperor. So what better way to drive a wedge between them than to go after her friend.

The emperor has to administer punishment especially if something happened with the empress. And Zhi jin will be upset with him for punishing her friend.

I do wonder about the scene when she loses her voice.

Also in the spoiler Yin Zi Ping is apologizing to Zi Jin for something. I feel like thr spoiler scenes are out of order sometimes so it’s hard to tell actually what is going on.

Oh I am sorry that I might have spoiled you.

I don’t know. I feel like before when she was still in the food bureau she really wanted to stay there.
She probably felt for the first time she was doing something for herself and not learning things that he likes. She felt a sense of accomplishment. Official meng wants to be the head of all the bureaus in the palace. Zhi jin probably just wants to be head of the food bureau currently.

Later on, I feel like she is employing more tactics. But before when she was still a food official she just wanted her career.

I don’t think that they are being petty. There is a reason of why they are both acting this way. True feelings are hurt. But if you listen to what the emperor says he is partly giving her the cold shoulder too after she rejected eating dinner with him and says fine you can go find my other sisters since we are all so similar.
Zhi Jin hasn’t been punished for concealing and helping noble consort guo. The dowager empress could punish her and she might make it really harsh. So now since the emperor is giving her the cold shoulder that is a pretty big punishment. If you watch other place harem dramas if the emperor doesn’t favor you doesn’t matter how high up you rank the palace staff start to treat you badly by giving you subpar food, fabric allotment or coal allotment etc.
Besides the dowager empress is delaying conferring a new title for Zhi Jin. So if the emperor acts like he doesn’t care for her so much and is “punishing” her than the dowager empress might be more inclined to grant her the title.

And Zhi Jin isn’t being petty. She is making it so no matter which consort he is with he can’t help thinking about her. She is playing a game and employing a tactic. I explained it more in detail in my posts below.

Honestly it kind of makes it more interesting for me their dynamic now. Sometimes shows starts lagging and gets slightly boring to me if the leads get together to soon. Other dramas will think of ways or obstacles of keeping the leads apart.
Zhi Jin and Zhu Zhangi ‘s dynamic is interesting. She resisted being one of his concubines, she wanted her career. She wanted to live for herself. He also wanted that for her too, he wanted to make her happy. But his mother foiled their plans. So at this point he isn’t 100% sure of her feelings for him. She hasn’t expressed it overtly like he has. So now the emperor is waiting for her to make and he has given her overtures by offering her the quartets/palace of the former favored consorts. But Zhi Jin rejected it, because she doesn’t have the title to live there. Plus she mentioned where are the former resisdents of the now? They had a bad end. She wants to change that. She loves and cares for the emperor but she wants a position in his heart and in his harem. She wants to change things and she can’t act passively to get there.
He is now currently at the end of episode 30 brooding and kind of obsessively thinking overly thinking of her. She is affecting him a lot , he can’t escape her presence .
So in episode 31-32 we will mostly see Zhi Jin making overtures of affection towards him. She is probably waiting in his study with the puppet to cheer him up. Then they make up and he convinces or overrules his mom in giving her the title of noble consort.
But this is a drama and prorbably there are jealous people around so other people are going to start to stir trouble for their relationship. The other spoilers are Zhi Jin’best friend being flogged. And she comes to stop it. I wonder what she did.

I agree with you. I mentioned this in another post below.
She heard that comment he made to his mother about all the consorts are similar in his eyes. He was trying to convince his mother to confer title of noble consort on zhi jin.

So since Zhi jin heard his comment she can just brush it off and eat with him. But than he might
wonder why doesn’t she care about what I said. He will question her feelings for
him. He has up to now been
more open
with his
affection for
him. Her actions hasn’t
been as overt.
So if she acts upset that accomplishes two things.
He gets angry and gives her the cold shoulder. That is like a punishment, the emperor’s affection and favor is how a woman’s survives in the
harem.
So far Zhi jin
has not really been punished
for concealing and helping
noble consort
guo, except for not being
conferred a
title.
So now the
emperor feels like since she is
giving him the cold shoulder than he
will go and spend more time with his other consorts. But every time
he is with
someone else
he is teminded of zhi jin.
So he is annoyed with her but he still wants her to know his place in his heart by giving her new quarters.

But she doesn’t take them. She wants the title too and prestige not
just to live there without
it. Right now her position is precarious. Other consorts are now ranked higher than her she doesn’t have a position except for her previous one. If she is conferred as the noble consort she will be second to the empress.
In the spoilers I think that zhi jin is waiting for him in his study dressed up like the puppet. They will most likely make up and the emperor will confer her with the title.

Well I felt that knew and wasn’t too mad. But it’s a tricky situation. If she shows that she is angry than it shows that she cares for him. If she asks like it’s not a big deal than he will wonder if her feelings for him are genuine.

The dowager empress is cunning. But buy saying all the consorts are similar in his heart than his mother will be more inclined to grant his wish of bestowing the title of rank of noble consort for her. Now the dowager empress says wait and she will think about it.

Well the emperor cannot make Zi Jin the empress without a good reason. Empress Hu is his official wife, they had a marriage ceremony, so when he became emperor Hu would naturally become his empress. His other concubines will have there status lifted depending on the Empress Hu, emperor and dowager empress’s discretion.
The emperor wanted to elevate Zhi Jin’s status to noble consort. However, the dowager empress said that she would think about it and wait awhile.
I think that Zi Jin is disappointed that Noble consort Guo died anyway despite her pleading on her behalf. The dowager empress even said as long as I am alive you consorts of the emperor will have no power.

I feel like Zhi Jin is playing a long game of cementing her position in the emperor’s heart. She doesn’t want to live at the palace quarters, that the emperor prepared for her. She said that her status wasn’t set and she has no right. She even mentioned what happened to those favored consorts who lived there.

Zhu Zhan ji is annoyed with her because since she overheard what he said to his mother she has been unwilling to spend time with him. Also, when he being cold to her and spending time with his other consorts, he sees her involvement with all of them. But he still told his helper to arrange the quarters for her. So he was annoyed too that she wasn’t grateful that he arranged a new quarters for her.. That is why he retreated to his study. I think that she is there waiting for him and that she dressed like the doll in the previews. Whatever happens from the episodes 31 preview she is invested as Noble consort.

Yes matron Hu made Zi jin in charge of the empress’ medicine that the doctor’s prescribed for her. She and the other girl are in charge of the food. But matron hu said to the other girl let zi jin handle the medicine herself.

That’ why Zi jin said to the crown prince I am responsible for her medicine and if something happens to her I will be responsible. That convinced him to help her investigate it.

No one besides zi jin’s family knew about her birth mom. The Yongle emperor choose Hu Shan Xiang to be his grandson’s wife because ppl said that her birth was auspicious and that reached the emperor’s ear. He wanted his grandson’s to have a lucky wife or someone who would bring him good fortune.

I don’t know if there is a conspiracy to kill the empress. Different people diagnosed her condition. One lady medical official felt and took her pulse reported to the imperial physician and diagnosed her as pregnant. It seemed like they just misdiagnosed her. There was an female medical official that was sent somewhere else for saying that empress pulse wasn’t a pregnant pulse too. The other physician got flogged or something for saying that she wasn’t pregnant and her life was in danger if she wasn’t treated. And to the emperor a royal child trumps his wife’s life. So even if she said that she wanted to be treated the other physicians said that it would endanger her child. Plus the noble consort is influencing the emperor too.

They were serving the crown prince food at the time.

The FL wanted Meng head official of the female cooks department to be there. She wanted to give the account of what happened with the emperor’s death.

The prince could’ve dismissed the other people but he didn’t.