idontwanttothanks

I mean I don't like that they feel they have to spoon feed this stuff to people who can't get past their issues, yes. But I'm really fucking annoyed by the "pandering to shippers" comments.

They aren't. They're "pandering" as you call it, to people who refuse to see what's right in front of them in favor of hating on a character.

Like I literally found the video and watched what he said. Took five minutes to do it all myself But for all the complaining about Twitter fans, some people here are acting just like them.

Wow, this comment section blows now.

Sorry guys but you are blowing this out of proportion.

Number one, he did not say he changed anything to appease shippers, that's your own bias showing.

Number two, what he DID say as far as I can tell was that he got the impression that *how they meant Top to come across* was not how people were reading it (shocker, since people hate Top and won't shut the fuck up about it). Which to me translates to them not changing to appease anyone, but to try to spoonfeed what they're going for to the audience even more than they already are.

You sound ridiculous. But I can see everyone already gearing up to blame this or GMMTV for whatever ending they don't like. It's exhausting.

ETA I'm sorry but the problem is that people aren't picking up what he's putting down. He's not "changing his vision due to Twitter polls", he's flat out trying to get his vision across because some people are too stuck in their own interpretation of the show or their rigid opinions of its characters to see what they're going for. They're literally trying to make people understand them. Which yeah, does blow, because it proves that anything complex is beyond basic fandom. But that's not their fault. It's fandom's.

Nope I'm still here checking in every once in a while.

Like I'm living an AU life, tbh. I am my own evil (?) twin.

Dammit I was excited for a hot second. The novelty of being called a minion of Ray after being accused of being a Ray hater for weeks would be something. 🤣🤣🤣

Is anyone who disagrees with you considered a Ray minion? Because I have never been called one of those before but I guess there's a first time for everything. 😂

I do not think it was chemistryless, but I think it was deliberately painted to be more romantic and less sexy - everything from the music to the coloring to the way it was shot. It makes a ton of sense to me that it was done this way, too, because it's supposed to symbolize a shift in the relationship.

Yeah, that could definitely be it, although he's paralleled her situation to his before. On some level I think he knows he has a problem, he just really doesn't want to face it. Which is Ray all over tbh - he does this in pretty much every aspect of his life.

And yep, he definitely has a "they can fix me" problem. I've seen this a LOT in real life, too. It never works because other people can't be responsible for your happiness. They can be a part of it, but they can't be the whole.

I was just thinking about that, actually - Ray trying to make Sand his entire existence. I thought he'd pull it with Mew when they started dating but he swerved that to chase Sand nonstop instead. However, I can't help but think that he's definitely going to do it with Sand. I hope not, but they're not high hopes, lol.

No way to tell, honestly. He might for a bit, because I do think Ray's gonna seem to get better at first because he's happy an in the honeymoon phase of the new relationship, but as you said it won't last.

Thus far he seems to be fairly clear eyed on Ray, though, which is why I wonder if he's dealt with something similar before. I expect him to fuck up spectacularly though, because it's his turn, lol. And he's human and only 22 at most. I've said it before, but it's hard to deal with someone with Ray's issues when you have far more years of experience under your belt. I do not see them working out at all but I'm once again back on the I hope they can salvage a friendship out of it train.

Horrible things probably, because First is a troll. 🤣🤣

I mean, 100% changed? No of course not. But I'm still hopeful for him to be on a real upward swing at the end. I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility.

Also we don't know he gets arrested - that was in the mock trailer so could very well have been replaced by the scene in the hostel.

I think they can last, but it's a lot of work and the road is very very hard. I do not think that Sand and Ray will, though. Because as you said, old patterns will emerge. They emerge even when the person getting help actually wants it and thinks that they have a problem, let alone when they very much dont!

I'm not going to go around in circles with you on this.

Let's just accept that you see him as a weak doormat for Ray and I do not, and move on.

Yes, this. Ray still can't admit that he has a problem! You see it all over his face every time someone brings up his drinking, even if he doesn't say it (although he does say it - "I don't have a problem, I just drink when I want to" (paraphrased I can't remember the exact line). Every single time, he gets this look - he's rejecting what's being said even as he nods and goes along to shut up whoever is speaking. And yeah, he's in a better place right now because things are going well, but the second that stops what will happen?

I think Ray also thinks that other people will fix him - not his addiction, because he doesn't think that that's a problem - but definitely his depression. He flat out tells Mew that, and I think we'll see it with Sand, too. But that's not how that works either.

Like I said, I hope he comes to that realization because nothing concrete will be done until he does. I'm very worried about what might make him finally see it, though. Very.

I wish I could frame this comment, There's a serious "I can fix them" problem that people get with this kind of thing and I do not understand it. I do think that Sand has so far managed to handle Ray better than most, and it does make me wonder if he's had experience with addicts before or if it's down to his mom? IDK. But he can't fix Ray. I don't think he thinks he can as of right now, but I do worry he might fall into the trap of thinking that he can make Ray want to fix himself, which is...also not going to happen.

...I think you're responding more to fandom than anything Sand has done yet. Not saying he won't, but he hasn't once yet acted like he can magically fix Ray.

Well we have a difference of opinion on Sand and that's fine. :-)

People expecting him to magically fix Ray are funny though. No amount of love can fix a person; they have to want to fix themselves. Ray's not there yet, but I think that he will be eventually. I hope so.

This is Only Friends, where every episode is episode 11.

I genuinely want to see that happen. I want to see Ray's reaction, because I genuinely do not believe he'd take anyone else touching Sand well at all.

Fully agreed. I think this is going to go badly, mostly because he's doing it for Sand and for Mew and not for himself.

I do have hope though that eventually he will want to do it for himself. But he still doesn't think he has a problem, and things like this won't work if you can't even admit you have an issue.

Lol just a little bit. Consider it karma.