jpny01

Ye Chan is so hot - that's my ideal man. I love guys like that.

This is surprisingly good - I like the setting and the city vs country angle.

Definitely. It's one of my favorite Korean BLs.

Yes, I agree with you - there's a difference between in-the-moment slap and doing it later.

Well, you're clearly a more generous person than I am - I don't think there was anything between the lines to read, at least not in the series. If you're referring to the novel, I have no doubt it made a lot more sense - but a series has to stand on its own and none of that was covered. I don't think whoever wrote the screenplay (as opposed to the novel) had the ability to draw a complex character and his motivations - all we saw was throwing fits and jealousy. So while I can see what you're saying, I don't think any of that came through in the series, and anything positive was completely overshadowed by the endless cycle of jealousy-fight-binge drinking.

The one thing I don't get in what you wrote is the series being about trust - it was completely the opposite of that, with endless and unreasonable jealousy, which is the result of a lack of trust.

I'd have trouble choosing too.

Awful, lazy writing. This is throwing in every possible terrible cliche - manipulative woman getting in the way, a misunderstanding impossibly easy to clear up... And let's not forget that Souta drove three hours from Tokyo and arrived at just the right instant to see something he would misunderstsand, and Mahiro drove all the way to Tokyo for no apparent reason and showed up at just the right second to see something that nobody understands.

This started out OK, but now it's awful. If Souta isn't going to get naked there's nothing of interest at all.

He wasn't just not interested in her though - he actively used her to attempt to make Mahiro jealous which is just awful. That doesn't mean she should walk around slapping him, but I'm glad at least someone is.

The writing is terrible - so lazy.

That's the worst time to watch this. If you're already bored when you start, you might fall into a coma.

Taiwanese guy and ex would be a nice couple. Mahiro is just as bad as Souta and I think he should die alone too.

I didn't dislike it by any means, but that was underwhelming, Their relationship hasn't progressed at all, and that felt a little like a shopping list of BL cliches - misplaced jealousy, an implausible misunderstanding, and a lot of internal monologue. And still no real romance. But it was cute and Minoru took his shirt off.

I probably wouldn't kick a puppy. I might rub its fur the wrong way, though.

Armenian standards? That's a pretty funny typo.

I agree American standards aren't relevant - but my point is BL is very tame whereas, and I presume it was a rhetorical flourish, you're calling that scene pornographic, when they didn't even show anything. The reluctance to even have characters hug, and making it a huge deal when people in their 20s & 30s even hold hands is rooted in societal homophobia.

I'm not sure what you mean by good values.

Good acting and directing can portray someone being hesitant about feelings they have rather than not showing them at all. It isn't good when we're having a discussion like this because that isn't at all clear (I think you're right, but it's an assumption, not something we've seen).

In BL, an uke (bottom) isn't really true to reality - he's usually a passive person with very little agency in the story - his role is to be "taken care of" by the seme (top). That's just the way BL is - it comes from Japanese Yaoi from a long time ago and hasn't changed all that much. Historically, in many cultures, being penetrated is bad - no man should desire, seek out, or even enjoy that. Because of that, it's common for the uke to have to be forced in some way - either through coercion, pressure, even rape. You're putting a positive interpretation on it, but Tai's resistance isn't really because he's shy, which he really isn't, or hesitant about the relationship, it's because he's a bottom and has to submit to something men shouldn't submit to.

Can you please not assume you're the expert on being gay? A lot of us here are.

I have to go back and watch that scene again. Pat for reasons that are unclear had invested a lot of effort into believing Jeng is straight despite an absolute lack of evidence. Statistically it's not a bad assumption, but straight guys don't usually go on dates with gay guys or look at them the way Jeng looks at Pat.

Pat could be insecure, sure, but that would make him not able to approach Jeng and tell him how he feels. Normally, when you have a crush on something, you see signs that they might be into you that really aren't there - you don't assume that their obvious interest in you is somehow... fake? It doesn't make sense.

I don't remember saying sex is only about anal sex - what I said I think is weird is that two single men who each live alone have not been alone together for a month - nobody does that. In a new relationship you want to spend as much time as possible with your new love.

I also said I don't mind Tai wanting to wait - that didn't bother me. It was the way Tai kept swatting down any attempt by Patts to show him affection, usually with some comment about how lascivious he is, which is clearly not the case if they've been dating for months and not done anything. Sex is not the only thing about a relationship, but it is one thing about a relationship, and physical contact is important for 99% of people.

A good example to me of two people who are together but not having sex is My School President, where everything about the two leads said they were into each other, from the heated looks to the way they leaned into each other when sitting & talking. In La Pluie we're only told, not shown - there's really no sign that Tai is actually attracted to Patts.

What I mean is that he was having scotch, which is hard liquor, and drinking it straight up (with nothing mixed with it) is by definition "as strong as possible". There's no way to make what comes directly out of the bottle stronger. But he also said "on the rocks", which means to put ice in it, which dilutes it as it melts and makes it weaker. It made no sense, and I assume whoever wrote that is unfamiliar with how drinks work.

Pat did have a reaction - a flight reflex (not surprisingly) - he bolted immediately. There was a scene where he was fantasizing about saying things to Pat but didn't actually do it. But I think that might have been before the dancing.

I agree with all of that. Sometimes the uke is really just the writer inserting herself into the story to give herself a fantasy boyfriend. Because she already knows herself, she doesn't bother to flesh out the character.

Man is amazing - he's so consistent and subtle. And hot.

I disagree. First, it's extremely common for the uke to refuse - it's a trope, and while I can see why you see it the way you described, it's rooted in homophobia, not a positive issue of seeking consent. It's based on the idea that a man shouldn't want to seek or enjoy being penetrated, so he has to be forced or coerced. That's also common in straight Asian romances.

The issue for me isn't stopping - it's that they said they had not been alone together in a month. That is absurd and is bending over backwards to avoid depicting sex or even suggesting it.

It's not just a cliche plot devices - all the drama is externally generated and isn't organic to the characters, which have no real arc (Tai has gotten over his soulmate issue, but it wasn't a progression - it was a light switch flipping), which makes them boring to a lot of people. The gf is a cliche, which I've learned to live with, but the problem is Tai showing up at just the exact second to misunderstand the hug. If he'd arrived 5 seconds earlier or 5 seconds later, he would either have seen the gf forcing herself on him or him pushing her away. That is weak and lazy writing.

The other issue is that we're repeatedly told they're soulmates, but we're never shown (in a romantic sense). What makes them two souls that fit together other than a coincidence? Do they have anything in common? Common interests? What do they enjoy doing together? Clearly not much if they haven't been alone for a month.

What in particular do you find interesting about the main pair? I only find what Tai looks like interesting - other than that they just stare at each other a lot. The actors have done a great job overall and the love scenes in particular - none of that weird planking where the top keeps 30 cm between their bodies.

On the other hand, Lomfon is a darker character that is the only organic source of drama in the series - he desires Tai, Tien has to deal with wanting Lomfon while protecting his brother, Tai has (reasonably) minderstood Lomfon's feelings which has caused tensions with Patts, etc.

I definitely agree about UWMA - I was bored into a coma by crybaby and his talking fencepost (that actually applies to the past couple as well) - Win & Team were much more compelling - at least until they got their own series and Team turned into a 6 year old.

If that were better organized, we would not have seen that the earlier pair were previous incarnations of the current pair until much later in the series - that way when they "did that thing they did" it would have been shocking and wrenching and a plot twist we would all have found brilliant. But since I knew what would happen to the past couple in the first few minutes, I didn't care at all about their story and it removed all dramatic tension from the series, especially since Dean & Pharm got together so near the beginning of the series. Win & Team were not constrained by a plot device and so the development of their relationship was much more about two people drawing close to each other.