Rach loves Xieer

It is because there are a few people that are familiar with the 3 novels, or found it intriguing/refreshing to see such flawed characters. This one is just based on novel 1 and doesn’t showcase their full growth but people enjoy the process which is slow but you can see it at the end hence the 9,9.5,10 star reviews.

"Why people can’t be vocal about situations that don’t seem right? It doesn’t matter if it’s a BL or straight series. I would still have the same opinion about it.”

You can. However, my comment wasn’t a direct response toward you but a general comment based on the BL stans that complain about everything when they can just drop it… but some of them don’t. In my opinion, one should not complain about “toxicity” and how “bad” the show is, if they’re gonna continue to watch it since they know the direction of it. Also, not everyone here is you. Although you said you’d criticize a straight or BL regardless… that is just you. I’ve seen plenty of people just criticize BLs for having toxic/complex/morally gray characters in general because they expect this cute, fluffy, and overall good person of the characters they watch and can’t stand not even a small character flaw because they be putting gay characters and relationships on a pedestal. Like, not every gay relationship or character is or has to be toxic but not every gay character or relationship has to be picture perfect to fit someone else’s conventional idea of what makes a good BL series, character or relationship.

"Even if things are normal in one country, it doesn’t make it right. Where I am from there were normalised so many bad things, and I couldn’t see them until I left. Now I live in another country and I can’t believe how many horrible things are treated like normal. It’s really concerning to me that you say complaining about those things are dumb. In many countries they do so many bad things, for example to women, for them is normal, so does it mean people from outside the world can’t raise their voices against it?”

Again, "Even if things are normal in one country, it doesn’t make it right.” I have a few points to make here with just this sentence.

1. It is a fictional show and the characters aren’t real. None of the things that occurred during the drama actually hurt an actual person.
2. You just proved my point when I said people love to dismiss cultural aspects when they watch things and use their own moral compass to judge things rather than looking deeper into it. Suddenly the Japanese culture and perspective doesn’t matter because you say so? Let me give you an example with something I learned in an anthropology and Global History college course.

There is a tribe called Kawelka who live scattered in the Western highlands, north of Mount Hagen, in Papua New Guinea and these people use pigs as currency, whoever had the most pigs was considered to be the “Big Man” but unlike people in capitalist countries, the “Big Man” also known as Ongka was very giving and helped other people from his tribe whenever he could. However, he had multiple wives and all of them are naked, they walk around naked and took care of his pigs while the men were always fully clothed… to many people this would be outrageous, why do the women have to do it? But the thing is, it is all CULTURAL ASPECTS, to some this is unacceptable because our society said it was wrong but to these people THIS IS THE NORM. For them to survive. The men in this tribe are always gone to negotiate with other tribes in order to keep the peace, they don’t have time to take care of pigs. Therefore, the women take the most important job and helps maintain the pigs for it to be sold and with that they can get fame, foods, and a better life (Also, keep in mind his wives were fully aware of each other and willingly accepted to take care of the pigs). You or I, may not understand why the women have to be naked, or why they have to take care of pigs for their husbands but it doesn’t matter it is a cultural practice that they don’t find weird at all. They’re making a living, it is all to survive and live a good life. They may think our customs and ways of living as weird, just as much as some of us may find their ways of living as weird as well. You finally get what I mean? it all has to do with your perspective based on your cultural background since we think in ways that was shaped by the morals and norms of our society meanwhile someone else in another part of the world was raised completely different and shares a different outlook on life than you, but that doesn’t mean that their cultural aspects are less right than your country’s cultural aspects.

"Even if things are normal in one country, it doesn’t make it right. Where I am from there were normalised so many bad things, and I couldn’t see them until I left.”

You sayin this just shows that you don’t understand Japanese culture or at least try to see in it from a wider perspective or even ask people familiar with the novel (like me) as to why these characters behave the way they do, what they’ve done to change for the better, and how they’ve done it if you were watching it and got confused about the decisions of the creators.

"Apart from that, in other comment they talk about different kinds of relationships, and I understand that, I also understand the character’s backgrounds in this series. But even in a dom/sub relationship, there are behaviours that are unhealthy. And that happens when a lot of lines are crossed , damaging the people involved in that relationship. And I see that in this show.”

There is no such thing as a Dom/sub relationship in this series or novel. Separate the couples you’ve seen in real life from this one because this one is fictional and it definitely did not end like those couples you be talking about. Read my other comment where I give you spoilers from the second novel which follows after the first novel and instead of being toxic like those couples in real life, they actually grow from their past mistakes and learn to balance things in their relationship in a way that doesn’t make each other uncomfortable.

“Humiliation: reduce (someone) to a lower position in one's own eyes or others.”

Kiyoi never reduced Hira to a lower position. He never made fun of Hira’s dysphemia, in fact, in the novel when Hira told Kiyoi about his dysphemia. Guess what Kiyoi did? He apologized to him for not knowing about it although he never called him “Hi-hi” like his other classmates. Kiyoi always looked at Hira with curiosity because he thought it was weird for someone to like him THAT much. This is why Kiyoi always addressed Hira as “Kimoi” which translates to many different things such as disgusting, gross, weird, creepy etc. Kiyoi was always referring to Hira’s stalker behavior. Like, honestly I don’t get why people get mad at Kiyoi for telling the truth. Hira is a stalker and that behavior is “Kimoi”. One more thing, Kiyoi never forced Hira to do anything he didn’t want… Hira did it all because he wanted to. So, where’s the humiliation here? Hira doesn’t give a shit about what other people say unless they’re Kiyoi and Kiyoi doesn’t like forcing Hira to do things (becomes more obvious in the second novel).

“Harassment: is behaviour which is intended to trouble or annoy someone, for example repeated attacks on them or attempts to cause them problems.”

I agree with your definition, however, we’re forgetting that the ones who did most of this harassment were the High School “friends” of Kiyoi. Which if you watched episode 5, you would know they weren’t actually his friends. The problem with Kiyoi is that he can be overbearing and was never direct with Hira until he started living with him and doing everything in his power to make up for his bad attitude during High School.

"Constantly abusing the other in from of the class, telling him words like monsters, or disgusting, hitting him with his foot or throwing him to the floor, bullying him along with the rest of the group. How can those things be healthy? (And no, even if you have problems to communicate or if your intentions are good, that doesn’t make it okay) And these are only a few examples, because the other character also has a lot of problems.”

As I previously said, Kiyoi does not “constantly abuse” Hira in front of the class, his “friends” does, they were the ones to call him “Hi-hi” not Kiyoi. Also, when the hell did Kiyoi call Hira a monster? Did I skip an episode? let me know which one was it. I already explained what Kimoi is, and Kiyoi had every right to tell Hira the truth to his face that his stalker behaviors is indeed creepy or as you say, disgusting. If I remember correctly, hitting someone’s shin in Japan has a cultural meaning (If someone knows please remind me). I just know this trope is used a lot in Japanese romance shows whether they’re BL or straight. I agree that pushing him to the floor was not the way to handle things if he really wanted Hira to keep in touch with him, however does that gesture alone make someone toxic? I don’t think so. It doesn’t make it okay, but it still doesn’t make someone toxic either.

"Lastly, shows with problematic situations like this one are usually made to create discussions about what is happening in it. So I’d be nice if people understand that they don’t have also the right to call each other childish or dumb or just dismissing their opinions because we “shouldn’t “ complaint.”

Again, my comment was reply to someone else about something that I’ve seen in the BL fandom for a long time that I believe is dumb. I could go on and on about it but I’m tired of typing. It’s fine to have your opinion, it is just that your interpretation of the show is wrong but I don’t blame you for it because you have not read the novels and because your moral compass does not let you see past what you believe is conventional.

Their flaws is what makes the story interesting, it is a fictional show meant to entertain for a reason. The author didn’t write their relationship dynamic for it to end like the ones you have seen in real life. By the way, the author doesn’t let them go that easily from their mistakes meaning they do not romanticize it. Kiyoi wanted someone to worship him, when he got it then he realized he didn’t want it and now in the second novel he had to work extra hard to have his boyfriend, Hira realize that he can ask of him anything he wants and stop thinking negatively all the time. Kiyoi is determined enough to pull him out of that negative thinking and even encourages him to become a pro photographer. Hira helps Kiyoi in a way that forces Kiyoi to show his vulnerable side and express himself something that he desperately needed in order to move the audience in his theater works. This show is just based on novel 1 and novel 1 alone isn’t the full picture of their growth as characters but just shows how they met, became aware of their unhealthy habits, and got together. Novel 2 & 3 is what shows their growth and it definitely does not end like the couples in real life that you’ve mentioned.

Some people watched this through the lens of their own morals and cultural upbringing while dismissing the character’s background and cultural aspects of the show. This is why we barely see or never see Asians throw the words “fetishizing, romanticizing, normalizing, abuse, and toxicity” every chance they get, they don’t complain or behave how Westerners do or expect the creators to create characters and relationships that fit their ideal image of what’s “Healthy”. It is insane to me how it is mostly Westerners complaining about this show yet Asians (especially Chinese and Japanese) BL fans love the show, they love the characters, and the story the creators had to tell. Chinese fans being the ones that REALLY don’t give a shit, like why would they? When their country enforces censorship and Chinese BL authors are already doing illegal things by even writing BL. They got nothing to lose by watching BL series like Utsukare, they just don’t got the time or the energy to complain about dumb things like “fetishizing, romanticizing, normalizing, abuse, harassing, and toxicity”

Doesn’t eliminate the fact you’re still a fundashi (the male version of a fujoshi). Just say you don’t know what a fujoshi is and that you don’t know the history of the word, and go.

Here’s a link from a Japanese person telling y’all westeners the word have history:
https://twitter.com/kuromantic/status/1160214110769778688?s=20

Also, you watched this show with horrible subtitles therefore shit got lost in translation like the “disgusting” word which wasn’t even disgusting, all Kiyoi called him was “Kimoi” which is referring to Hira’s stalker behavior as creepy, and don’t come here telling me Kiyoi was wrong for telling the simple truth.

So in your opinion you believe that Hira should have ended up with Koyama? A man he doesn’t even like? So you’re saying that someone should get together in a relationship with someone else just because they’re nice and not because you have romantic feelings? Hira doesn’t owe Koyama a thing, he doesn’t like him? He shouldn’t feel obligated to be with him in that sense. They’re perfect together as friends anyway, considering how in the novel Hira’s mental health isn’t really good and could have made Koyama resent him in the long run if they actually dated like y’all desperately wanted him to. Also, Hira chose Kiyoi because he loves Kiyoi, there is literally no love triangle in this show, so what else were you expecting? 😂💀

Also, who are you to tell creators that this isn’t a way to go about a BL? Just say you didn’t understand the story and go. The amount of misunderstanding in your review, as someone familiar with the novel makes my skin crawl. It is painful to see something you’re familiar with just get misinterpreted by “holier than thou” westerners

Says the person who only watches BL 💀😭 fam I think you are referring to yourself here.

Ok this is random but it is so nice to see fellow utsukare fans here 🤧😭

To answer some of your complaints, there is a valid reason for most of them.

“ The story and other characters could have been developed more and the ending could have shown more of how Hira adapted and became a real partner for Kiyoi.”

I would like for you to know that this series is based on Utsukushii Kare, a Japanese light novel series. This is just novel 1 out of the 3. The other two novels are Nikurashii Kare and Nayamashii Kare which goes into more detail about both characters as a couple and individually, as well as their growth as people. Novel 1 is just about Hira and Kiyoi’s journey on getting together and recognizing their mistakes as teenagers, but just like in real life humans, change is easier said than done. What I mean is [Spoiler Alert for the 2nd novel] that Hira will continue to idolize Kiyoi, and not just that he will have negative imaginations that will frequently frustrate Kiyoi. In this second part of the novel, you get to see Hira getting out of his comfort zone and being encouraged by Kiyoi to think more positive rather than thinking all the time that he’s unworthy of Kiyoi’s love and that one day he’ll leave him. Kiyoi encourages Hira to find a job which benefited Hira in the long run because he met a boss that pushed him to his fullest potential in photography, and made him feel more confident in his talent. And this is why I disagree with you on “For sure Hira ended up with the wrong person,” who is the right person for Hira then? Koyama? If Hira and Koyama would have become a couple, Koyama would have ended up resenting Hira in the long run with the way his mental health and way of thinking is. That is the exact same thing that caused issues in Hira and Kiyoi’s relationship in the second novel, but unlike anyone else, Kiyoi never gave up on Hira and kept pushing him to be better. I know you don’t know anything about this which is why you’re only basing this on the series, and again, I don’t blame you for it but I just wanted to clarify why the producers didn’t show more of Hira and Kiyoi as a couple and why they didn’t make a huge character development (which make sense one does not change from one day to the other)

“ So Kiyoi does demand that Hira loves him as a person and not a god. That was great. I really didn't see that coming. Then the last scene they are joking about it???”

Mmm????? Where do they joke about it? When they are riding the bike and Kiyoi calls him “Kimoi”? Maybe I’m thinking of the wrong scene but they aren’t joking about it. Kiyoi is just using Kimoi aka “creep” as a term of endearment because he finds Hira’s way of loving strange and amusing. I think you’re reading a bit too much into that scene. Anyway, I hope this comment helped clarifying some things.

OMG I just did it! Everyone I encourage everyone to participate this is very important if you want to read the novel in English

LMAO same! I thought this was hilarious

You basically summarized it. I personally don’t care and don’t mind because I believe your voice is your voice, and while you can improve some details to improve your performance as an actress, Jisoo has completely impressed me considering this is her first role. I didn’t know what I was expecting from her at first, but I was left with wanting to see more of her. I think that overshadowed her voice for me, but not that I cared in the first place.

I checked a bunch of spoilers for the second novel on twt and I can see why some people would be annoyed at Hira, but what’s important is that they will make it through.

I honestly forgot about it, I was lazy too Lmao

thank you, I’m translating the Spanish transcript for a friend so I was like “why are they both called Koyama?'

OHHH that makes sense lmao

you guys, is Koyama’s brothers name also Koyama? or did we ever learn his name? asking for help here...

Honestly, I truly believe this person is just instigating drama for the heck of it. I guess that’s what you call trolling because there’s no way this guy is serious when comparing utsukare and kiekoi 😭😂

Rio is happy somewhere with Kuzumi, The Novelist Playback movie is just as good. Kido and Rio also reunite but not in the way you thinking.

I doubt they ever watched those western series, I’ve seen Shameless US, Free Fall, and Queer As Folk US and I know for sure they would have shat themselves if they’ve seen how imperfect those relationships were.

OMG! At least I am not the only one that wants a M/M/M poly relationship, but I want one where they all end up loving each other instead of ending up a love triangle. I need it, poly relationships aren’t as represented in media as it should be.