Jakksen

Exactly that.

Ok, that is an incredibly sexist statement - one that has been used as a sexist statement for a very long time. An example would be the song "Mood" from a few years back - the word "wet" was censored, so its socially not acceptable conversation to just randomly state in passing - so yes, I did in fact "infer/deduce" ;) a fair amount from your use of that word in that exact context.

Tbh, Etoks, if that is all you walk away from this conversation with - I'm fine with that.

Haha, perhaps you are just unaware that we are also animals - perhaps more attention to how much animals are controlled by what they are and not at all how much they control themselves.

What makes people people - is that we overcame that.

We have not always been as we are now. We are still incredibly f*cked up as a species, even right now today. I don't think there is single "wild inference" - especially considering, I primarily read academic article, much of any said inference would have been originally derived from a scientific assessment.

I actually feel like anyone that actually knows themselves, and what they/all of us actually are - knows that as mostly just common sense, just never before spelled out as plainly as I just did. You wont read that explanation from even a scientist that factually knows all of that stuff - too few latin words for starters.

Also, I've never really concerned myself with the opinions of women regarding me who I want to sleep with, like at all. Finding out that some of them get a kick out of us just being us - I was pleasantly surprised to discover that and then very thankful for the content that they brought into the world.

Prior to 2018-19, I could count on my hands the number of times I'd seen men kiss on screen in not porn - one hand for a kiss in a non aids related production. I can only think of like 3-4 gay things that I'd seen for the first 30 some years of my life, that were not directly related to aids.

If I never see another aids movie, in my life, it will be too soon.

As none of those facts regarding fujoshis have ever changed - I find it interesting that not shaming them is the trend now. I do tend to be ahead of the game, but I've actually never been party to that behavior regardless. So.

Great retort. Til next time - have a great one!

Etoks - occasionally we agree, that has happened. I understand wholly where you are coming from with the criticism regarding content, and BLin general, but I do think that there needs to be some accepting of the occasional "OG type BL" - done with w/e gimmick is able to bring it up to acceptable for the year it airs.

There will be Bad Buddy like shows forever - there will always be another KinnPorsche, in an ideal world that is. I disagree that those two have the same target demographic but I do concede that neither are first intended for gay men. That is totally fine tbh - I don't mind 100% made for fujoshi content, as long as it is sustaining and allowing for actual Gay/LGBTQ content (I like "Queer" as the umbrella myself) and it does do exactly that.

All of us gays and lesbians and queers of all kinds owe those fujoshis - more than we ever want to admit. This genre was literally financed by the sales of the gifts young women would buy the actors in their favorite ships. There was a lot of very exploitative shit happening all around - the very least of it being the women, being into men, being into each other.

Also Etoks, this narrative bothers me a bit - that fujoshis are "problematic" - I've never been considered that exploitative outright. Tbh, I feel like all of this is just the internet revealing to us something that has always, always been there... I literally mean fujoshis, at an evolutionary level.

Since we are of a similar persuasion - I can assume that you also kno that despite all the rainbows and unicorns, there is nothing magical about a gay man or lesbian women, WE are products of evolution just like everything else.

You must realize - apex predators are solo. Males in nature have complicated relationships with other males. Humans are the most complicated species on earth. All things are the results of evolution - stuff like emotions too. The first creature to act selfishly - survived. All the negative emotions came first bc survival is the highest priority on our hierarchy of needs. So, how did we end up with empathy?

If the strongest and smartest man, got all the women in the valley - he had all the kids... We literally occupied like 1 big valley for like 160 million years of ancestors living out mostly family centered "pack animal lives" to get to roughly what we are now. It is said that we learned cooperation from the wolves... but how did we learn trust? At one point, the croods + that creepy guy north of the wall in GoT (with only daughters) = literal human reality of life for a time. Minus the white walkers. How do we go from 1 Man, HIS women/offspring, and HIS cave to "a community" of people ??

In short, bc at some point, a man submitted to a stronger man - in a way that the stronger man could wholly and completely trust him after, and without fear of his women either. Likely before words existed. Only so many ways to do that. The women are key tho - for several reasons. I'm assuming that, going back far enough, before "familial" type social programming existed, a strong man, collecting women and some men, may have tried to "collect" his own sons also, and obviously that was shut down very, very early on considering the deep seated societal stigma to such activity.

Despite the problems of a primal human like animal man - women also had envy, jealousy, lust and all the good stuff programmed at a cellular level just like men. This is the crux of this whole comment Etoks - the first fujoshi women, to encourage their strong man to go collect men, and for real wanted that - that family survived to become a tribe, that tribe is the one that took over the valley. That all happened so far back, thats part of all of all our story - our human story, which explains a lot actually. We literally evolved bisexual. Maybe not at the start but as soon as the first man adopted it, every man had to - or he would have no women... or food.

Anyways, I think its actually rather natural for a women to actually have a level of attraction to men displaying affection for each other - I don't mean thru any of any of our modern lens either.

Just something to think about when you're shaming people for being all people like.

I was just watching My Stubborn and now I'm rewatching this. I'm serious - this put Yoon in a different league for me. I think I will be happy to see him, whenever I see him, maybe forever - so if anyone reading this is making a BL, he is a great pickup, I will always think that whenever I see him in a cast. This show is why.

If you haven't seen this yet - it was the most popular show in Thailand the year it aired, and I'd even say that it does require a fair amount of previous viewing of Thai media, specifically BL, to really appreciate, but if you happen to be gay or are just familiar with campy type productions anyway, and you like them at all - just press play.

I don't even kno who he is.

I appreciate your pointing out the mental health concerns - I will not further address this and I will not elaborate on their activity.

I do feel that is very important for the poster to realize tho, that the extent of their behavior on this page, does in fact exactly qualify as behavior demonstrating a mental illness.

I don't feel they are lacking in cognitive ability and this isn't a personal attack like that at all.

Episode 3 @ 42:30 - that is one of my favorite scenes in all of cinema. I'd maybe give it an asterisk, since its a humorous scene, but I truly think thats so brilliant - I've never wanted to make a BL more than I do right now.

I'm positive my actors would hate me but I feel like it would be hilarious.

All in all, this wasn't a bad series at all - very funny.

Addicted was my first BL - I had seen a random clip of Timmy and Johnny acting far too gay to not be actually gay and thats how I found the show.

Had Chai Jidan found a way around the problematic content from her novel that was forthcoming in the series - and the show continued along the same quality to a slightly revised playing out of the time skip and what not, that show could have been a true masterpiece of gay storytelling.

Are you actually getting paid to do this?? Fr - that is a truly genuine question, do you get paid for this activity? What is it you are paid to do?

I can't actually understand behavior like this otherwise - you don't even seem to have an actual defined position or narrative that you are cleverly framing/pushing between your many, many accounts. What exactly is your agenda that explains the nonsense you've done to this page?

Is this all just so you can react and respond to other people's comments?

I've noticed you post Thai political issues. Do you have a connection with the show or the actors??

I think the reason we are shown so much of the masked man and know so much of his significance thru out ZH's life is so that we slowly come to realize that our mastermind is himself being played.

His sheer acceptance of the masked man as he was proves that he was blinded by his hatred and his lust for revenge, a pot his masters that raised him stirred frequently and kept at a simmer. Who trusts someone they have never seen the face of but have known personally, and have been alone with many times, for over a decade? Bc of his experience and consequential upbringing - he just readily accepts that everyone is out to assist "him" with "his" revenge.

He was raised to be a weapon. He was another's tool until the last few episodes and he didn't even know that. This is a revenge plot but its not depicting that in a positive light - hence the struggle and luck playing in. He ought to have died several times but his desires suited others interests - that is far more an accurate revenge story than most. His intelligence doesn't actually matter much - bc he can't see even what is right in front of him. Considering who the big bad is - the story is kind of a circle isn't it?

This is actual theme of this show, that revenge isn't worth it, and the writers went thru great lengths to tell and show why that is a true statement. ZH is shown multiple times refusing to change course and at the end he has only the women at his side he leaves with.

Antu is to humanize him - their romance isn't really necessary to the story and is something that ZH frequently denied himself in pursuit of his revenge despite a life with her being the right and better path. Her presence at the end is to give us to hope for their bright future but in reality she is merely the silver lining.

At the end, them showing him recalling walking into the city at the start was telling. Its more than simply how far he's come. Then his future, tho still darkened by his quest, was brighter than his future now - now he has attained all that he has sought after and great power, but that didn't make him happy. It never can bc he knows how foolish he was, how lucky he got - he wants distance between him and his mistakes. Had he not been so blinded by revenge and made different choices - him and Antu's children would have much different lives for example.

For him to be reflecting on all this already as he leaves - implies a weight upon his mind in the future. The rather rushed death of his master at the end was to really drive that point home. He merely changed one weight for another. He starts with nothing but hate, succeeds and finds that doesn't want anything that he attained, he now wants what he already had but lost due to his quest.

That is far, far more accurate a depiction of someone who has spent a life pursuing vengeance. That was as intended.

There is no direct media tie in any longer to the actual DMBJ series - that is correct.

This character is still Wang Zhanghai tho. This is still his origin story - the mastermind behind all the serious tombs in that universe.

"The Legend of Zhang Hai" - he just cleverly executed his revenge, that alone isn't all that legendary, as great as it was. That this is only the beginning of his story is what makes him a legend. In fact, what he is remembered for later, has nothing to do with any of this.

Just bc the commercialization of media means this now a stand alone character for corporate purposes doesn't mean his story can't still be canon within the universe - obviously taking certain naming conventions into consideration.

Haha, I completely understand. I had never seen anything like it before and it completely captivated me. The next one I'll recommend is also another bromance, so its going to be a similar subtle and understated romance (I get the cheesy romance 😅) and its also one of my absolute favorites - Word of Honor. I love the leads in that one.

Keeping with Wuxia - Joy of Life 1-2 and Snow Sword Stride - fantastic shows, very slight romance, and excellent casts. Guardians of Dafeng is a fun kinda over the top, almost anime style wuxia, slight romance.

I'll recommend one that is definitely a romance and it is a little cheesy in more ways than just romance even but its an example of maybe like "high/heavy wuxia" bc the genre has a wide range, you'll see light wuxia in a lot of Chinese drama - even ones that don't have that tag, essentially just fancy martial arts. Anyways, Fangs of Fortune is the one I rec for that - it has Neo being very emotional thru out the entire series.

Then there is like wuxia meets mystery genre - also slight to no romance in these and they are just very good shows - The Strange Tales of Tang Dynasty - all seasons, The Mysterious Lotus Casebook (Very good). I always recommend - The Longest Day in Chang'An - its like the series 24 and its epic.

I almost forgot - Nirvana in Fire 1-2, those are both quite good. NiF is often tossed around as one of the best Chinese dramas, its another Revenge plot - more political and if you like that style then that opens up a ton of very well done historical dramas. I could write a book 😅

I just really enjoy a lot of this bc its exclusively Chinese - there really isn't comparable media anywhere else. Its fun - I hope you enjoy!

I haven't been paying close attention here - it fr makes me a little sad that people are hating on ZH and XAT - I thought they were absolutely adorable on that boat ride, there were so many little cute interactions, it felt very much like a kind of first date. That whole scene was very well done. Both actors have done a fantastic job - they have chemistry and are cute together. Its also such a small part of the show - its not even that its forced or downplayed, isn't it almost natural?

ZH goes to the capital, meets a ton of people, becomes important, lives there for awhile, and has frequent interactions with a young women - who is single, attractive, capable, intelligent, rich, and into him - bc he, ZH, is Xiao Zhan and that just makes sense - it would almost be more unrealistic if XAT wasn't interested in him. Tho I will say, I have wondered about Mister 8 😉Otherwise tho, this is really a tale as old as time and its quite well done, understated - is by no means center stage. I really have thought that it feels natural.

This was in a Chinese newspaper? I agree with like all of it. Tbh, I'm really liking the rhetoric and language coming out of China lately - hatred is displaced by higher ideals, those are what we should strive for, not revenge. I actually was sus on this being the direction show was taking already a few episodes ago. XZ is just such a phenomenal actor, you can almost see his doubt even while he is actively pursuing his revenge. I've been very impressed with Huang Jie also - I've not seen much of him before - those two play so well off each other.

Back to the newspaper tho - I can't believe this is a review for a series. That reads like a fine art review - "The dual narrative’s immersive depth sparks debate, yet such discourse reflects audience hunger for genre innovation where gratification meets introspection." - fr, I don't think that the majority of Americans could take anything away from that sentence. If they were still following by the word introspection - that's where they would fall off, as that not a quality most Americans possess. Its a little incredible to me that they using this kind of language to review a TV show made for mass distribution.

I actually just went to EW and read 5 random reviews - one for Dune, a highly political and intellectual series. I did the see the word archetype once - not on the Dune review, that was abysmal.

Haha, I'm caught up now and I completely understand - I agree even 😅

I obviously made an assumption - its why you shouldn't do that. I've just been surprised/happy about how many people have discovered Chinese media after The Untamed and this is the 1st time they've really encountered XZ.

I just want to make sure everyone knows he's like a really big deal 🤣

Xiao Zhan is one of the most famous celebrities on earth - I'll bet he is very high on the list of globally recognizable people under 40. He should only get more famous based on his acting here.

I do get it tho - I remember when I was like, "The Untamed? What is a wuxia? Who is this Sean guy? He's pretty cute, maybe I'll check this out" 🤣

That perfectly sums up my reaction to reading that.

Yeah, like @Val W is saying - this is set far far in the past of the DMBJ universe. I'm on episode 9 and so far, outside the feng shui that is more related to just tomb building of the era in general, I've only noticed a few significant tie-ins to the events that happen in the future - without spoiling anything, the biggest DMBJ universe reveal happened early in the first episode.

I'm really not sure how much we will see of anything else. I wouldn't be surprised if a Zhang shows up at some point. I think in theory it could be ZQL even but I'm not exactly sure where this fits into the timeline other than being before much of it 😅

Definitely check out The Untamed - it made him globally famous and brought many people to Chinese media. If you haven't been introduced to Wuxia yet - its good for that too.

Awesome pfp btw fr 💯