never read webtoon or watched anime...I came in this drama with a fresh pair of eyes 👀. Honestly, I was a bit…
I have to tell you, you are my hero. lol
I watched "Debut" without being able to read the title in Chinese, and I've been trying to figure out what it was called ever since!! Every time I put the general plot into a search engine I only found "Lookism" so I was thrilled to find your post directing me to the correct show so I could finally add it into my list!!
This is found on the Pomthani YouTube channel, and it has been recently re-uploaded with English subs.
It's not specifically a BL, because the "main" lead characters are not in a male/male relationship with each other. However, there is a gay couple and one of the three leads is gay. (the other two leads are male & female)
I found it to be just really cute. The leads didn't really have any issues, but they helped friends/visitors in their ice cream shop solve minor issues. Very sweet. Nothing complex. Worth watching if you want to kill some time.
Let's see, how to put this ... because not everyone can fully grasp this kind of relationship-- and that's OKAY!!!Day…
Honestly, you're reaction and first impressions are completely normal. However, I'm also part of my local BDSM community and have witnessed so many things!! So, when I see things that start ugly like this I don't like the beginning - but I kind of see it as just a bad plot device to make the characters start from less than nothing and have to grow from their experiences. In this case, I see them enjoying a bit of pain, dominating and rough/edgy play even after they are deeply in love, so to me that just says they've settled into a happy BDSM relationship like others I've seen.
Is not for everyone, but they're are plenty who like that extra spice. lol
If you're curious at all about what kinds of things can be discussed in these relationships (purely for self education, not trying to convert) then I would probably recommend starting with the following website. I think you'll find they're are many parallels to Day & Brick -- especially if you follow the link at the bottom to "consensual non-consent"
Yes -- this is technically the beginning of it all. Itt & Gear made a bet regarding Night. And Gear raped Night.…
Nan & Mac technically starts a bit before book 3, but then doesn't end until after book 3.
You can read it at any time after book 2, but I would probably wait until at least after 3 -- or just use it as supplemental material and wait until after book 4.
“The rapist can't end up with his victim unless he does something to prove his love right?”No.The rapist should…
If that were the case then there wouldn't be a story to begin with because both Itt and Gear would already be in prison for conspiring on / performing the rape of Night.
Where does it end then? Is it all good for pedophilia to also be added to this list? Is that romantic and enjoyable…
You are failing to see their entire point -- they are saying that pretty much anything goes in fiction, and then it is up to the consumer to choose their limits and boundries for what they are willing to consume. So, just because they feel that anything *can* be used in fiction, it doesn't mean that they will find every topic entertaining.
Let me give a completely boring example though: computer programming happens in real life. It could also be used as a plot device in a work of fiction. Would I, personally, be interested in a work of fiction containing computer programming? Well, no, I wouldn't and I would not choose to read or watch it.
So, if we ramp that up to the current topic: do I enjoy stories where two people fall in love despite their troubled pasts, difficulties and sins against each other? Yeah, I do. Can I, personally, tolerate if they met because one kidnapped, raped and was cruel to the other initially -- specifically because this victim had previously caused the exact same thing to happen to the perpetrator's brother? Yeah, I can tolerate that. Can I, personally, tolerate both parties forgiving each other over time, getting to know each other on a deeper level and eventually falling in love with each other? Yeah, I can. Despite their cruel beginnings *I* like stories where forgiveness and love really can conquer anything, and that's exactly what I, personally, see in this story. (and yes, I've read all the books)
I will also add that I have read similar stories where the parties involved were no both men. I have read historical romance where one tribe or clan invades another land, the leader takes someone hostage, has non-consensual sex and the domineering man and the beautiful women fall in love. Many of those "bodice rippers" follow a similar plot line. Some of them don't include non-consensual sex, because the man teases the woman repeatedly until she just can't help herself and gives in to him... all the while she's telling herself in her mind why she shouldn't be doing what she's doing, why she shouldn't want to be intimate with her captor and how she feels like her body is betraying her.... blah, blah, blah.... but I don't see people ripping apart those novels that are sold basically anywhere that carries books: grocery stores, convenience stores, airports, etc.
And for ME SPECIFICALLY -- I won't speak for others -- the biggest difference between all of these examples and the one you gave is that everything I've mentioned is between adults. Maybe not always consenting adults, but still adults. I, personally, do not feel that minors should be involved in sexual material. I can handle quite a bit of variety between adults, but for me, I don't think minors have any place in mature materials.
OK, but you're comflating something that's morally unjust with something that's morally unjust in a work of fiction.…
I applaud you for what you've said. 99% of people just can't see past the ends of their own noses to realize that we've all faced struggles and battles, but we all face different struggles and battles. It's wrong to say that one person's battles are worse, or harder or more valid that someone else's. Yet, that's exactly what they're doing when they feel like their version of "wrong" is more severe or "more wrong" than someone else's version of "wrong."
I experienced sexual assault (not rape) and I can empathize with how other victims may feel. I experienced domestic violence from my first husband and I can empathize with those who have been abused. However, at no point in time have I ever tried to say that my experiences are worse than anyone else's or that another person should base their morality or judgements based on what happened to me.
So, I find it disgusting that other people try to tell me, or you, how we should feel about any form of media or entertainment just because there may be moral issues involved.
Also, because it's my fantasy world when I'm reading or watching media it's OKAY for someone to have a bad experience and have an unrealistic response. Just because the character was kidnapped, raped and experienced brutality from their tormentor does not mean that in a fantasy world they can not also learn to view that same person differently and learn to love them. It is possible to forgive others, especially after you've gotten to know them better, learn their motivations and admit your own wrongdoings that may have contributed to their inappropriate actions. It doesn't excuse their actions, but everyone needs to take responsibility for their own part of a bad situation.
I think that's one of the things that is missing in much of today's society in general. There is a lack of responsibility taken. People are so entitled they think they deserve things, or they're so egotistical they can't see how they have also contributed to causing something to occur.
Anyway, hopefully I've been able to make my point, but who knows. It's 3:50am and I took my meds to put me to sleep a while ago - so, who knows how well I wrote this. It all made sense in my head, but whether or not I got the words out correctly could be a whole other story. lol
Yes -- this is technically the beginning of it all. Itt & Gear made a bet regarding Night. And Gear raped Night.…
They used different cast/actors but a couple of the characters from LS3 were the main characters in Unforgotten Night -- Kim and Kamol. Also, Day and Itt (diffrent actors, but same characters) were in Unforgotten Night and Kim even went and stayed with them and Itt's nephew Salmon during that show.
I recommend this film - "Dangerous Drugs of Sex", this is just a rough ride! Dark and captivating story.Warning!!!…
I think to truly enjoy this you need a good understanding of BDSM dynamics, sub-space and how these true BDSM relationships can be fulfilling and healthy.
While DDoS does start out unhealthy because of how damaged and traumatized they both are, eventually they both grow over time and find happiness in their relationship and become healthy because of what they found together. But, I think they did so by utilizing BDSM dynamics and principles.
I just finish the first book and it is rape for the three couple (Night/Gear, Day/Brick, Neil/Nick) there is no…
I could be mistaken here, but the impression I got from the initial post here wasn't that there wasn't rape involved, per se -- but rather that it wasn't exactly the crux of the story the way the synopsis here makes it sound. The synopsis here makes it sound like the non-consensual sex was the brick and mortar of the story, when in reality it was just the driveway leading up to the main event -- which were the relationships that we spent 4 books reading. So, while the synopsis is *technically* accurate -- it does not give a complete picture of what the whole story is really about.
Hi guys I'm currently reading love syndrome on wattpad although I'm enjoying it, its fair to say its very problematic,…
Let's see, how to put this ... because not everyone can fully grasp this kind of relationship-- and that's OKAY!!!
Day & Brick started off violently, with sheer and hatred in their hearts. Over time they were able to see things in each other that they liked, and eventually loved. It took many, many months, almost a full year. During that time Nick offered to help Brick leave Day and even call the authorities if necessary, but when he really thought about it Brick realized he was exactly where he wanted to be.
After all the toxicity had passed and they both admitted their feelings for each other what was left was a relationship with a lot of jealousy and insecurity on both of their parts because they loved each other more than they even loved themselves. (as was witnessed when they each took a bullet for the other) But also, their intimate life became a reasonably good example of a Master / slave type BDSM relationship that included both sadism and masochism. Day was the Master, Brick was controlled by Day. Day enjoyed inflicting certain amounts of pain in Brick and Brick both loved and hated receiving that pain. It got the point where Brick got even more turned on when Day hurt him. (rough sex, biting him, etc)
I'm not going to say that they are a textbook healthy relationship, especially not with the start they had, but after they had worked through their issues and love had fully taken hold they were a relatively / mostly / moderately healthy BDSM M/s dynamic. Which like I said, that's not for everyone and many people can't comprehend the concept of a healthy consensual relationship like that, but they absolutely, positively exist.
Having said all that -- no Brick never comes to a realization that he's better off without Day. Quite the opposite, actually. The deeper he gets into love, the more he realizes he can not live without Day -- including the controlling, rough and edgy parts of the relationship.
1 
I watched "Debut" without being able to read the title in Chinese, and I've been trying to figure out what it was called ever since!! Every time I put the general plot into a search engine I only found "Lookism" so I was thrilled to find your post directing me to the correct show so I could finally add it into my list!!
It's not specifically a BL, because the "main" lead characters are not in a male/male relationship with each other. However, there is a gay couple and one of the three leads is gay. (the other two leads are male & female)
I found it to be just really cute. The leads didn't really have any issues, but they helped friends/visitors in their ice cream shop solve minor issues. Very sweet. Nothing complex. Worth watching if you want to kill some time.
Is not for everyone, but they're are plenty who like that extra spice. lol
If you're curious at all about what kinds of things can be discussed in these relationships (purely for self education, not trying to convert) then I would probably recommend starting with the following website. I think you'll find they're are many parallels to Day & Brick -- especially if you follow the link at the bottom to "consensual non-consent"
https://domsubliving.com/bdsm-checklist-for-kinks-limits-and-more/
You can read it at any time after book 2, but I would probably wait until at least after 3 -- or just use it as supplemental material and wait until after book 4.
Book 1:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/328025507-d-b-i-1-en
Book 2:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/331828470-d-b-2
Book 3:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/335860896-d-b-3
Book 4:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338096751-d-b-4
Nan & Mac's Book:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338090731-n-m-en
No one in these stories is innocent.
Book 1:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/328025507-d-b-i-1-en
Book 2:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/331828470-d-b-2
Book 3:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/335860896-d-b-3
Book 4:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338096751-d-b-4
Nan & Mac's Book:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338090731-n-m-en
https://www.wattpad.com/story/328025507-d-b-i-1-en
Book 2:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/331828470-d-b-2
Book 3:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/335860896-d-b-3
Book 4:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338096751-d-b-4
Nan & Mac's Book:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338090731-n-m-en
Let me give a completely boring example though: computer programming happens in real life. It could also be used as a plot device in a work of fiction. Would I, personally, be interested in a work of fiction containing computer programming? Well, no, I wouldn't and I would not choose to read or watch it.
So, if we ramp that up to the current topic: do I enjoy stories where two people fall in love despite their troubled pasts, difficulties and sins against each other? Yeah, I do. Can I, personally, tolerate if they met because one kidnapped, raped and was cruel to the other initially -- specifically because this victim had previously caused the exact same thing to happen to the perpetrator's brother? Yeah, I can tolerate that. Can I, personally, tolerate both parties forgiving each other over time, getting to know each other on a deeper level and eventually falling in love with each other? Yeah, I can. Despite their cruel beginnings *I* like stories where forgiveness and love really can conquer anything, and that's exactly what I, personally, see in this story. (and yes, I've read all the books)
I will also add that I have read similar stories where the parties involved were no both men. I have read historical romance where one tribe or clan invades another land, the leader takes someone hostage, has non-consensual sex and the domineering man and the beautiful women fall in love. Many of those "bodice rippers" follow a similar plot line. Some of them don't include non-consensual sex, because the man teases the woman repeatedly until she just can't help herself and gives in to him... all the while she's telling herself in her mind why she shouldn't be doing what she's doing, why she shouldn't want to be intimate with her captor and how she feels like her body is betraying her.... blah, blah, blah.... but I don't see people ripping apart those novels that are sold basically anywhere that carries books: grocery stores, convenience stores, airports, etc.
And for ME SPECIFICALLY -- I won't speak for others -- the biggest difference between all of these examples and the one you gave is that everything I've mentioned is between adults. Maybe not always consenting adults, but still adults. I, personally, do not feel that minors should be involved in sexual material. I can handle quite a bit of variety between adults, but for me, I don't think minors have any place in mature materials.
https://www.wattpad.com/story/328025507-d-b-i-1-en
Book 2:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/331828470-d-b-2
Book 3:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/335860896-d-b-3
Book 4:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338096751-d-b-4
Nan & Mac's Book:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338090731-n-m-en
I experienced sexual assault (not rape) and I can empathize with how other victims may feel. I experienced domestic violence from my first husband and I can empathize with those who have been abused. However, at no point in time have I ever tried to say that my experiences are worse than anyone else's or that another person should base their morality or judgements based on what happened to me.
So, I find it disgusting that other people try to tell me, or you, how we should feel about any form of media or entertainment just because there may be moral issues involved.
Also, because it's my fantasy world when I'm reading or watching media it's OKAY for someone to have a bad experience and have an unrealistic response. Just because the character was kidnapped, raped and experienced brutality from their tormentor does not mean that in a fantasy world they can not also learn to view that same person differently and learn to love them. It is possible to forgive others, especially after you've gotten to know them better, learn their motivations and admit your own wrongdoings that may have contributed to their inappropriate actions. It doesn't excuse their actions, but everyone needs to take responsibility for their own part of a bad situation.
I think that's one of the things that is missing in much of today's society in general. There is a lack of responsibility taken. People are so entitled they think they deserve things, or they're so egotistical they can't see how they have also contributed to causing something to occur.
Anyway, hopefully I've been able to make my point, but who knows. It's 3:50am and I took my meds to put me to sleep a while ago - so, who knows how well I wrote this. It all made sense in my head, but whether or not I got the words out correctly could be a whole other story. lol
https://www.wattpad.com/story/328025507-d-b-i-1-en
Book 2:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/331828470-d-b-2
Book 3:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/335860896-d-b-3
Book 4:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338096751-d-b-4
Nan & Mac's Book:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/338090731-n-m-en
While DDoS does start out unhealthy because of how damaged and traumatized they both are, eventually they both grow over time and find happiness in their relationship and become healthy because of what they found together. But, I think they did so by utilizing BDSM dynamics and principles.
As for the original story, there are 4 novels plus a few supplementary books that all of this is based on.
Day & Brick started off violently, with sheer and hatred in their hearts. Over time they were able to see things in each other that they liked, and eventually loved. It took many, many months, almost a full year. During that time Nick offered to help Brick leave Day and even call the authorities if necessary, but when he really thought about it Brick realized he was exactly where he wanted to be.
After all the toxicity had passed and they both admitted their feelings for each other what was left was a relationship with a lot of jealousy and insecurity on both of their parts because they loved each other more than they even loved themselves. (as was witnessed when they each took a bullet for the other) But also, their intimate life became a reasonably good example of a Master / slave type BDSM relationship that included both sadism and masochism. Day was the Master, Brick was controlled by Day. Day enjoyed inflicting certain amounts of pain in Brick and Brick both loved and hated receiving that pain. It got the point where Brick got even more turned on when Day hurt him. (rough sex, biting him, etc)
I'm not going to say that they are a textbook healthy relationship, especially not with the start they had, but after they had worked through their issues and love had fully taken hold they were a relatively / mostly / moderately healthy BDSM M/s dynamic. Which like I said, that's not for everyone and many people can't comprehend the concept of a healthy consensual relationship like that, but they absolutely, positively exist.
Having said all that -- no Brick never comes to a realization that he's better off without Day. Quite the opposite, actually. The deeper he gets into love, the more he realizes he can not live without Day -- including the controlling, rough and edgy parts of the relationship.