how's she supposed to know how to control a power she doesn't have?
She’s a single mom dealing with a lot of trauma and threats on her family. As a child they almost lost him when he innocently went chasing down a butterfly. Thankfully his father, a calm man with plenty of field experience was able to find him. But even he was worried sick when he couldn’t yet see no trace of his son in the vast expanse of the sky.
What is the mother supposed to do without him now? What happens if her kid loses control? (as their powers are finely intertwined with their emotions. Even the dad who has impecable control and years of experience couldn’t help himself from floating when he kissed the mom. So a still growing kid in a non-stable household environment with the grief of a missing parent… ?). What if kid Bong Seok loses control and flies off into the unknown? Panics and fails the landing and falls from too high up? Gets noticed by the NIS or other bad guys because he gets too excited as a kid playing with his superpowers and starts attracting people’s attention? Gets taken away by those guys? Gets deemed a threat by a public panicking to the reveal of superpowers or something?
She did try her best to help him learn some control and learn to stay grounded by himself. During the first few years she rented out that big open space for him to get a sufficient enough hold on his powers.
The mom just wants her kid to live a normal life and not be used like his parents were by the NIS. She likely has some separation anxiety too, building up from when she lost the love of her life twice and felt guilty and responsible for his fate as well. She’s terrified of losing her son, as her husband has said, the only time he’s ever seen her out of her wits was when their kid went missing. She’s a struggling mother, and it’s already hard to raise a child alone and she has so many more worries added on top of that than the average single mom or human. No she can’t be perfect.
When her son complains to her about the harm living in hiding and not learning to fully realise his potential has done to him and the effect it’s had on his personality and emotional health, she does open up to the possibility of letting him fly freely and thus does guide him at all on how to fly.
He’s also almost an adult by now so has better impulse control, ability to rationally assess a situation or idea, emotional stability, understanding of danger or morals compared to that of a child. Like allowing an 8 year old to get behind the wheel vs allowing a 17 year old to drive on a public road.
Electric man destroy 3 bus, but is never fired. LOL!It's why it's a bit confusing about timeline, because in a…
The principal who quite literally sniffs out the supers is shown to have actual powers. His eyes at one point turn into creepy animal eyes. Main powers are a heightened sense of smell.
All of the supers have more durability than normal humans but most of them are mortal. The ones hardest to kill are the ones with healing as their main power. They still feel the pain when they get hurt but heal so quick from everything that they are able to overcome feats otherwise impossible for humans. The eye might’ve had a chance to be saved but the guy was in the middle of battle and the bullet shot by another super looked like it might’ve melded with his eyeball. He’s not a surgeon, has no immediate help available, has been knocked out already for a while and if he waits too long to remove the bullet it won’t heal- how he gained the bullet wound scars on his hand. Probably he couldn’t separate the bullet and eyeball in trying to brutally remove it. Also must’ve hurt like shit to touch it at all.
I do agree that explanation for the powers is lacking but where have you seen this successfully fully satisfactorily with consistency explained in any superhero genre? Marvel and DC are shit at making sense and keeping with in-universe logics and they’re the biggest names in this genre and do just fine in roping the views and cash. If you are okay with watching that without complaints then you should be okay if another country does it. Supernatural stuff will never be explained exhaustively without plot holes because it’s not based in reality. It’s magic and defies physics and sciences at its core.
For the electrical guy, don’t forget they also have the ability to read memories off any electrical device. The father worked in covertly acquiring information and spying prior to his appointment in the superhero special ops field team. And in a fight he can easily shock people to death or as we saw in the last episode, chop people’s arms off with a lightning bolt. Much of todays world is dependent on technology and a power that can manipulate and read electricity is nowhere near useless.
The show doesn’t say that either. But Gyedo was disqualified from being selected because he failed to show any prospects in the field (sucked at PE, didn’t fight, didn’t use his powers to defend himself) and Min was primarily recruiting people for black ops field work and assassin work. Gyedo wasn’t realising the full potential of his powers, hadn’t properly awakened them and while at school didn’t appear to particularly use them or show he had any real abilities apart from making his hair stand up on one end. And Director Min possibly didn’t know about the memory reading aspect but what use is that if the agent can’t control his powers and has no stealth otherwise to sneak in and get his hands on a protected device to read stuff off and is a soft boy easily overpowered by normal humans. The drama does show that the two guys, Gyedo and Kanghoon’s father who were crossed off the list by Min as useless and weak could be useful superheroes too.
The person who had scored highest in training in all aspects was Han Hyo Joo- whose powers are heightened senses. So clearly it’s not a competition of who has the best, most OP abilities for the NIS. But rather how well the people are able to employ their respective powers to their benefit and how focused they are mentally to get the job done. And how good their reflexes are to send in on a stealth or assassin operation.
As for how Gyedo kept his job… for all we know the NIS or some other interested party is paying off his company to keep hush or his boss is secretly a super himself trying to protect him. He’s not subtle and practically advertises his electrical powers to score the job. Maybe he even has some blackmail material accidentally gathered with his powers on his boss or company that he let them know he knows.
I'm betting this is an installment drama. There were a lot of stories they started in the series, but most of…
There’s a whole superhero universe spanning different comics by the writer. As the drama scriptwriter and the comics writer is the same you can bet he set it up for sequels and spin offs for his other related comics in the Kang Full universe. Like the time manipulator guy we got a glimpse of is the main character from Timing. And Bridge has characters from Moving and Timing uniting together to fight off some villains. Timing and Bridge seem like the most likely instalments we’d see adapted into live action. Even Frank is from a different comic, Hidden, from the same universe.
Whether we are given a second season would depend on many things. Right now the chances look good as the drama was a hit. But it’s an expensive production, one of the highest kdrama budgets all time with an equally expensive talented cast.
Bragging about donation has become common for them. This is nothing as compared to Lee seungi donation advertisement…
I mean that’s fair enough. Dude’s hit his 30s and just wants to get married and his fans were super upset and bringing in protest trucks about his choice of then girlfriend.
And their reason for the backlash was that the girl’s father had swindled a lot of money out of poorer people (although serving his sentence). Considering Seung Gi has no shortage of wealth and is also very popular, beloved (has an image of mom’s friend’s model son she would like you to either resemble or marry) and famous in his country and he’s got an ambitious foot in the variety world to do next generation hosting like Yoo Jae Suk plus all that drama from his own agency swindling money from him and betraying him since his debut days….
Makes sense he’d be publicly donating to calm the fans and public. Unless he’d like to either cancel his wedding or his career prospects.
Chasing your husband to his next life? Me likey wobbly time travel.
Premise reminds me of dramas like Rooftop Prince and Queen in Hyun’s Man. I don’t think we’ve had any people from Joseon Era popping into 21st century in dramas recently.
Can’t recognise the other cast but for Se Young + Time Travel = sign me up!
For some reason this reminded me of her Pinocchio character…
That one scene in an early episode when she’s daydreaming during highschool on what she would look like in random future career choices and how her truth syndrome would act up in them. It was pretty funny.
Man at this point I just want Seon Ho to save Himself lmao because I can’t make head nor tails of the negativity in this comment section.
These fans are fucking weird.
By the way the age gap is only 10 years between the actors. That’s like normal in adults. Not like we haven’t seen bigger age gaps that people have shipped in Kdramas. As long as neither of the lead characters are portrayed to be students it’s fine and likely won’t be even be noticeable.
(Just take from Kim Seon Ho’s own filmography. In the drama that gave him recognition, he was heavily shipped by fans with Suzy’s character. Who is 8 years younger than him in real life.)
I wanted to like this one. Instead it made me like the other shows in this genre that I previously thought were shit. Lmao.
Maybe I just prefer character driven plots. Far more scope for depth and emotional attachment and a lingering impression. Plot driven fiction is usually quite hard to actually write and be good. And this one’s definitely not it.
One of the biggest mistakes it made in episode 1 was when introducing us to the show and its characters was the way they just simply put everyone in a stereotype labelled box. It’s like telling me why should I bother to care about these characters that are one-dimensional and nothing like real humans and teenagers? This isn’t a silly cute web series of highschool comedy. Could not connect with a single character or remember any names. Most faces blurred together.
Does not match the supposedly dark and serious vibe of the premise and the message it tries to deliver at the end of part 2.
Can’t say much for the acting. No one is particularly memorable but that is also because they have little screen time, flat characters and a generic script. I might like some of the cast elsewhere even if I don’t remember watching them here.
None of the deaths make any sort of emotional impact. Not even the platoon leader’s death. (And what does it say about the show that their most memorable character and ultimate sacrifice is an adult? Not the kids we’re supposed to root for and empathise with their struggles?). There was no sense of danger for the most part because everyone from this one group of kids always lived. And reunited happily too.
Something just went very wrong in the ingredients of this drama. Be it script, directing or even acting or all. This might’ve made a better impact if it were more character driven considering the ending and premise is more suited to a character driven story. As it is, just watch for a brain-off time-pass if you like the cinematography and you’re just really running out of things to watch in this genre and skip on “part 2” i.e the last couple episodes as it gets worse.
Personal rating: 6.5-7.5 max out of 10. Overall MDL rating should be a 8.1-8.3 at a generous best. The current 8.6 is far too high.
Have to post this here for the blindly angry and very likely ignorant comments.
The “BL” content in question you lot are so stressed about being removed is…..
A ROMANCE BETWEEN A 50 YEAR OLD DUDE (possessing a suicidal teenager’s body) AND A HIGHSCHOOLER.
Thank you. That’s it. If you can’t see what’s wrong with that, you obviously don’t care one bit about the LGBT community and only want to fulfil your wild fantasies.
Can someone who hasn't watched S1 watch this season without a problem or will I not understand anything?? I wanna…
As someone that’s basically forgotten everything and isn’t planning to re-watch S1, I guess you can dive in head first for Joon Gi and then later go back to catching up on season 1 as you wait for more episodes of S2 and feel the withdrawal.
There’s a change in lead actors anyway. And I don’t think some of the supporting characters we were curious about back then are all returning either. Maybe it’ll be better to just watch this sequel independently first so it’s easier to accept the change in cast and maybe some dropped plotlines.
Just watch the first one or two episodes of S1 that sets the fictional era and premise, the childhood days so to say.
People were throwing hands in Reborn Rich because of the loveline between FL and Song Joong Ki and his character being a mentally 40 year old creeper. Atleast they were both adults when they met. And he had re-lived a significant part of childhood again.
How’s this webtoon’s premise any different or better?
It’s even worse because the character in question here is a MINOR. A teenager. Two teenagers in fact. One of which is apparently possessed by an adult. A 50 year old adult.
That’s nothing but harmful representation for BL community. Maybe it’s okay as a niche community webtoon but in a live adaptation that will garner more interest, let’s have healthier relationships please.
And it’s entirely possible the original characters are still gay in the drama. Just without a romantic ship of a 40+ dude possessing a teenager x underaged teenager.
I liked the vibe in the late 1990’s storyline that they set. Loved the teenaged Ju Won by Kim Shi Ah. Perfectly captured the mysterious aura of a too old soul in a too young body who has lost interest in really living but is finding something intriguing in years and starting to feel like her physical age once again whilst still holding the maturity of her past lives.
Unfortunately we lose that vibe in the present day. It just goes to a standard quirky bizarre female lead x flustered overwhelmed male lead meet cute. And then little about any of the past lives matter. We could have done so much about the wealth of experiences the FL has had. The premature parting of the leads in her previous life. The murder mysteries. The grieving family and mother especially.
Show had a stronger start, ending was a complete turn off your brain moment and the middle was a wishy washy we’re here for the stellar cast and cinematography even though it’s not really jamming.
PS. I would personally not recommend this drama to introduce someone to Shin Hye Sun, one of my favourite K-actresses. This drama and role was just not it for her. She’s trying her best and one of the key reasons I started and continued watching, but I do feel she was perhaps miscast. The lacklustre writing isn’t helping either.
Oh this is a remake of that TW drama! I wasn’t interested in watching this one because the leads aren’t exactly my favorite (I don’t dislike them, they just aren’t on my to-watch radar) and I found it weird that 30+ year olds were playing students.
But hearing it’s an adaptation of that one Taiwan drama that’s been on my watchlist since it released with raving reviews in my favorite time travel genre… Unfortunately I still haven’t got around to watching it but I suppose now this allows me to watch the Korean version with fresh eyes first and then finally get around to the original.
What's up with the mother taking her daughter to get a contraception procedure at the age of 17 if she does NOT…
(Please tag your comment as a spoiler as the whole call girl thing is an unexpected twist at the end of ep 1.)
They specifically say she’s getting the procedure to help with her piano performance so her menstrual cramps don’t mess up her condition again during a competition. I think the doctor even mentions something about studies and exams.
It’s not that uncommon. Is it messed up? In the drama, it is obviously supposed to be, as the mom is struggling to healthily cope with her divorce and her cheating ex and trying to force her expectations on her daughter instead. But she’s in no way trying to prostitute her daughter.
Plenty of girls at my highschool took contraceptive pills for exam time because they got really bad menstrual cramps or had other issues like irregular periods. A friend of mine at university got the procedure done because she had both terrible cramps and too frequent periods. I also remember visiting the high school nurse for something totally unrelated and she’d automatically assumed I was there for contraceptive pills as it was near exam season even though it was the first time I’d even stepped foot in her office.
Is it a particularly healthy approach? Not really. But it’s not all to do with sex and prostitution.
Did anyone catch who that last ghost rider was? I guess it was a cameo, but I couldn't recognize her. Was it a…
A reference to their kdrama Mama. Mom/son role in that. It’s actually a pretty good family kdrama. The premise is that the mom is trying to find a loving home for her son because she’s secretly dying and it explores the situation from all points of view. The mom, the kid, the ‘new’ family which includes the mom’s ex, friends, etc. The drama won a lot of awards and was quite popular when it aired. Both mom/son got best actress/best child actor with Song Yoon Ah also bagging a Baeksang.
I loved the main sweet sismance pair in it with two actresses that I first saw as iconic villainesses in other Kdramas (K2 / Vagabond).
I believe Chan Young also moved to the small talent agency that houses Song Yoon Ah about a year or two after their drama aired and they’re still signed on there. They’re still quite close.
What is the mother supposed to do without him now? What happens if her kid loses control? (as their powers are finely intertwined with their emotions. Even the dad who has impecable control and years of experience couldn’t help himself from floating when he kissed the mom. So a still growing kid in a non-stable household environment with the grief of a missing parent… ?). What if kid Bong Seok loses control and flies off into the unknown? Panics and fails the landing and falls from too high up? Gets noticed by the NIS or other bad guys because he gets too excited as a kid playing with his superpowers and starts attracting people’s attention? Gets taken away by those guys? Gets deemed a threat by a public panicking to the reveal of superpowers or something?
She did try her best to help him learn some control and learn to stay grounded by himself. During the first few years she rented out that big open space for him to get a sufficient enough hold on his powers.
The mom just wants her kid to live a normal life and not be used like his parents were by the NIS. She likely has some separation anxiety too, building up from when she lost the love of her life twice and felt guilty and responsible for his fate as well. She’s terrified of losing her son, as her husband has said, the only time he’s ever seen her out of her wits was when their kid went missing. She’s a struggling mother, and it’s already hard to raise a child alone and she has so many more worries added on top of that than the average single mom or human. No she can’t be perfect.
When her son complains to her about the harm living in hiding and not learning to fully realise his potential has done to him and the effect it’s had on his personality and emotional health, she does open up to the possibility of letting him fly freely and thus does guide him at all on how to fly.
He’s also almost an adult by now so has better impulse control, ability to rationally assess a situation or idea, emotional stability, understanding of danger or morals compared to that of a child. Like allowing an 8 year old to get behind the wheel vs allowing a 17 year old to drive on a public road.
Maybe she either set up the foundation for this organisation super spies or was the first recruit.
All of the supers have more durability than normal humans but most of them are mortal. The ones hardest to kill are the ones with healing as their main power. They still feel the pain when they get hurt but heal so quick from everything that they are able to overcome feats otherwise impossible for humans. The eye might’ve had a chance to be saved but the guy was in the middle of battle and the bullet shot by another super looked like it might’ve melded with his eyeball. He’s not a surgeon, has no immediate help available, has been knocked out already for a while and if he waits too long to remove the bullet it won’t heal- how he gained the bullet wound scars on his hand. Probably he couldn’t separate the bullet and eyeball in trying to brutally remove it. Also must’ve hurt like shit to touch it at all.
I do agree that explanation for the powers is lacking but where have you seen this successfully fully satisfactorily with consistency explained in any superhero genre? Marvel and DC are shit at making sense and keeping with in-universe logics and they’re the biggest names in this genre and do just fine in roping the views and cash. If you are okay with watching that without complaints then you should be okay if another country does it. Supernatural stuff will never be explained exhaustively without plot holes because it’s not based in reality. It’s magic and defies physics and sciences at its core.
For the electrical guy, don’t forget they also have the ability to read memories off any electrical device. The father worked in covertly acquiring information and spying prior to his appointment in the superhero special ops field team. And in a fight he can easily shock people to death or as we saw in the last episode, chop people’s arms off with a lightning bolt. Much of todays world is dependent on technology and a power that can manipulate and read electricity is nowhere near useless.
The show doesn’t say that either. But Gyedo was disqualified from being selected because he failed to show any prospects in the field (sucked at PE, didn’t fight, didn’t use his powers to defend himself) and Min was primarily recruiting people for black ops field work and assassin work. Gyedo wasn’t realising the full potential of his powers, hadn’t properly awakened them and while at school didn’t appear to particularly use them or show he had any real abilities apart from making his hair stand up on one end. And Director Min possibly didn’t know about the memory reading aspect but what use is that if the agent can’t control his powers and has no stealth otherwise to sneak in and get his hands on a protected device to read stuff off and is a soft boy easily overpowered by normal humans. The drama does show that the two guys, Gyedo and Kanghoon’s father who were crossed off the list by Min as useless and weak could be useful superheroes too.
The person who had scored highest in training in all aspects was Han Hyo Joo- whose powers are heightened senses. So clearly it’s not a competition of who has the best, most OP abilities for the NIS. But rather how well the people are able to employ their respective powers to their benefit and how focused they are mentally to get the job done. And how good their reflexes are to send in on a stealth or assassin operation.
As for how Gyedo kept his job… for all we know the NIS or some other interested party is paying off his company to keep hush or his boss is secretly a super himself trying to protect him. He’s not subtle and practically advertises his electrical powers to score the job. Maybe he even has some blackmail material accidentally gathered with his powers on his boss or company that he let them know he knows.
Whether we are given a second season would depend on many things. Right now the chances look good as the drama was a hit. But it’s an expensive production, one of the highest kdrama budgets all time with an equally expensive talented cast.
And their reason for the backlash was that the girl’s father had swindled a lot of money out of poorer people (although serving his sentence). Considering Seung Gi has no shortage of wealth and is also very popular, beloved (has an image of mom’s friend’s model son she would like you to either resemble or marry) and famous in his country and he’s got an ambitious foot in the variety world to do next generation hosting like Yoo Jae Suk plus all that drama from his own agency swindling money from him and betraying him since his debut days….
Makes sense he’d be publicly donating to calm the fans and public. Unless he’d like to either cancel his wedding or his career prospects.
….
I guess I’ll just be watching for Lee Se Young then.
Premise reminds me of dramas like Rooftop Prince and Queen in Hyun’s Man. I don’t think we’ve had any people from Joseon Era popping into 21st century in dramas recently.
Can’t recognise the other cast but for Se Young + Time Travel = sign me up!
That one scene in an early episode when she’s daydreaming during highschool on what she would look like in random future career choices and how her truth syndrome would act up in them. It was pretty funny.
These fans are fucking weird.
By the way the age gap is only 10 years between the actors. That’s like normal in adults. Not like we haven’t seen bigger age gaps that people have shipped in Kdramas. As long as neither of the lead characters are portrayed to be students it’s fine and likely won’t be even be noticeable.
(Just take from Kim Seon Ho’s own filmography. In the drama that gave him recognition, he was heavily shipped by fans with Suzy’s character. Who is 8 years younger than him in real life.)
Like for real why????
I wanted to like this one. Instead it made me like the other shows in this genre that I previously thought were shit. Lmao.
Maybe I just prefer character driven plots. Far more scope for depth and emotional attachment and a lingering impression. Plot driven fiction is usually quite hard to actually write and be good. And this one’s definitely not it.
One of the biggest mistakes it made in episode 1 was when introducing us to the show and its characters was the way they just simply put everyone in a stereotype labelled box. It’s like telling me why should I bother to care about these characters that are one-dimensional and nothing like real humans and teenagers? This isn’t a silly cute web series of highschool comedy. Could not connect with a single character or remember any names. Most faces blurred together.
Does not match the supposedly dark and serious vibe of the premise and the message it tries to deliver at the end of part 2.
Can’t say much for the acting. No one is particularly memorable but that is also because they have little screen time, flat characters and a generic script. I might like some of the cast elsewhere even if I don’t remember watching them here.
None of the deaths make any sort of emotional impact. Not even the platoon leader’s death. (And what does it say about the show that their most memorable character and ultimate sacrifice is an adult? Not the kids we’re supposed to root for and empathise with their struggles?). There was no sense of danger for the most part because everyone from this one group of kids always lived. And reunited happily too.
Something just went very wrong in the ingredients of this drama. Be it script, directing or even acting or all. This might’ve made a better impact if it were more character driven considering the ending and premise is more suited to a character driven story. As it is, just watch for a brain-off time-pass if you like the cinematography and you’re just really running out of things to watch in this genre and skip on “part 2” i.e the last couple episodes as it gets worse.
Personal rating: 6.5-7.5 max out of 10.
Overall MDL rating should be a 8.1-8.3 at a generous best. The current 8.6 is far too high.
The “BL” content in question you lot are so stressed about being removed is…..
A ROMANCE BETWEEN A 50 YEAR OLD DUDE (possessing a suicidal teenager’s body) AND A HIGHSCHOOLER.
Thank you. That’s it. If you can’t see what’s wrong with that, you obviously don’t care one bit about the LGBT community and only want to fulfil your wild fantasies.
There’s a change in lead actors anyway. And I don’t think some of the supporting characters we were curious about back then are all returning either. Maybe it’ll be better to just watch this sequel independently first so it’s easier to accept the change in cast and maybe some dropped plotlines.
Just watch the first one or two episodes of S1 that sets the fictional era and premise, the childhood days so to say.
How’s this webtoon’s premise any different or better?
It’s even worse because the character in question here is a MINOR. A teenager. Two teenagers in fact. One of which is apparently possessed by an adult. A 50 year old adult.
That’s nothing but harmful representation for BL community. Maybe it’s okay as a niche community webtoon but in a live adaptation that will garner more interest, let’s have healthier relationships please.
And it’s entirely possible the original characters are still gay in the drama. Just without a romantic ship of a 40+ dude possessing a teenager x underaged teenager.
Unfortunately we lose that vibe in the present day. It just goes to a standard quirky bizarre female lead x flustered overwhelmed male lead meet cute. And then little about any of the past lives matter. We could have done so much about the wealth of experiences the FL has had. The premature parting of the leads in her previous life. The murder mysteries. The grieving family and mother especially.
Show had a stronger start, ending was a complete turn off your brain moment and the middle was a wishy washy we’re here for the stellar cast and cinematography even though it’s not really jamming.
PS. I would personally not recommend this drama to introduce someone to Shin Hye Sun, one of my favourite K-actresses. This drama and role was just not it for her. She’s trying her best and one of the key reasons I started and continued watching, but I do feel she was perhaps miscast. The lacklustre writing isn’t helping either.
But hearing it’s an adaptation of that one Taiwan drama that’s been on my watchlist since it released with raving reviews in my favorite time travel genre… Unfortunately I still haven’t got around to watching it but I suppose now this allows me to watch the Korean version with fresh eyes first and then finally get around to the original.
They specifically say she’s getting the procedure to help with her piano performance so her menstrual cramps don’t mess up her condition again during a competition. I think the doctor even mentions something about studies and exams.
It’s not that uncommon. Is it messed up? In the drama, it is obviously supposed to be, as the mom is struggling to healthily cope with her divorce and her cheating ex and trying to force her expectations on her daughter instead. But she’s in no way trying to prostitute her daughter.
Plenty of girls at my highschool took contraceptive pills for exam time because they got really bad menstrual cramps or had other issues like irregular periods. A friend of mine at university got the procedure done because she had both terrible cramps and too frequent periods. I also remember visiting the high school nurse for something totally unrelated and she’d automatically assumed I was there for contraceptive pills as it was near exam season even though it was the first time I’d even stepped foot in her office.
Is it a particularly healthy approach? Not really. But it’s not all to do with sex and prostitution.
I loved the main sweet sismance pair in it with two actresses that I first saw as iconic villainesses in other Kdramas (K2 / Vagabond).
I believe Chan Young also moved to the small talent agency that houses Song Yoon Ah about a year or two after their drama aired and they’re still signed on there. They’re still quite close.