peaches_and_cream

Agreed, love this!

Sorry yes, I don't understand Chinese and I interpreted it based on the WeTV English subtitles. Seeing the discrepancy between VIKI and WeTV translations, and seeing Alysha Johnson and Oumaima B's comments as well above in addition to yours, I definitely misunderstood.

Blew my mind when I realized the multiple interpretations and now my mind is spinning trying to process all the new amazing inputs <3

I LOVE THIS, such a good analysis.

That blew my mind🤯 - GOOD CATCH!

omg so interesting - GOOD CATCH!!!!!! and no kidding, we really do need to learn😭

Yes this scene has always confused me actually, every time I watch it I have to keep pausing because the translation is phrased a bit awkwardly. My take on it was:

YS: "if you are willing to deliver this message for me, I will repay you a favour as repayment in the future"
SS: "any favour?"
YS: "Apart from being unfilial, rebelling, treachery, abandonment, and forbidding from asking for your hand in marriage" (i think thats an awkward way of translating, apart from asking for your hand in marriage)
SS: (then SS is shocked) "when have I ever asked you to marry me, when did I say I ever want to marry you?"

and then he further goaded her by saying its appalling to me that you've never thought of marrying me, isn't that why you are stringing me along and isn't it your strategy to cling on to me.

But the other take on it also makes sense ..... omg🤯

So then is he saying, I will do anything except not asking you to marry me, and then she's shocked why he would do that. And he's saying he interprets her lack of action as her clinging on to him, and he's also interested? .... but then she cuts her ties clean with him haha by telling her aunt immediately omg😂

Yes its so nice to have a community to talk about these things with <3. and of course!

Ep 40 - around 31 mins in (this is when they officially meet - after the knife scene)

EP 42 - right at the beginning is when the MFL asks him to fight for her sister, and then around 21 mins in has a few side glances too LOL

In reality these scenes are very minor, but they have impact.

Agreed, his character has a lot of growing up to do!

p.s its so funny and sad that she didn't even stick around to see what that ball he threw at her was supposed to mean. Im still curious what he was going to say LOL

Trying to untangle my thoughts around Yuan Shen as I am rewatching the episodes. Something that was always confusing to me was why SS took such an instant dislike to YS. I was thinking it could be because during the lantern festival while everyone was impressed by his intellect, she was simultaneously thinking it was sad that he's bored and does this every year, that he must have a lot of free time (that in her pragmatic way can be devoted to better things -> he's a pleasure seeking individual), and that he is attention seeking. She is confused when he comes to see her and then her prickly nature kind of compounds on itself as they keep verbally sparring. He really does hit the nail on the coffin when he tells her he would repay her the favour as long as it doesn't involve marrying her lol (of course anyone would be super offended to hear that).

YS seems like a typical type A person. He only gets attention from his parents and teachers when he is intelligent so that's a huge part of his identity. He is desperate for love also. SS initially treats him and gives him the cold shoulder like his mother (I just realized). She ignores him outright and doesn't want to give him any time or attention. Which is unusual compared to all the other girls that chase him. I think since he can't be angry at his mom, some of that resentment may have passed to SS? Also he pursues her because he thinks she is cultured and intelligent, but realizes that while she is smart she is also lacking in education in a lot of areas to make a suitable spouse for him (and a wife like that wouldn't get him the validation he is seeking from his elders).

But as he gets increasingly attracted to her and interested in her, he doesn't have the maturity to handle it so he lashes out. By calling her not attractive, not a good wife candidate, not smart ... and the list goes on. I think he doesn't genuinely think she is sly and scheming but he just can't help but be bitter and jealous (super jealous - lol)

I dunno that's my take so far, but I know we haven't gotten much insight into YS yet.

Just got to the part where he saw her at the lantern festival and wanted to thank you all for your input <3. I had a much better appreciation for the scene after hearing these pov's, and had so many butterflies in my stomach watching them! WL is the king of microexpressions.

I also noticed that when he rescued her from the fire he didn't linger around to get appreciation from her or her family (probably because at that point he really didn't want a relationship). But it must have taken him by surprise when she didn't use that as an excuse to see him later or connect to him via her family to show appreciation, as any other noble girl would have done.

:o I didn't catch that, I will have to pay close attention when I get to that part again! Thanks for mentioning!

I agree with your whole assessment. The scene at the lantern festival broke my heart when her mother didn't buy her anything. I'm just glad she has her brothers to back her up now, whereas I do feel very sad for YY too... she's all alone now. But that's no excuse for the mother to dote on YY and ignore SS. That is emotional manipulation.

Her lucidity when she tries to reason with her mother when the mother is being unreasonable blows my mind (especially the scene with the desk you've referenced and her post engagement to LBY talk).

Her mother reinforces SS's own insecurities and that breaks my heart. Every chance someone compliments SS, her mother either twists it to highlight how SS is not good or rebuffs it by saying the parents have failed her so clearly SS can't have any redeeming qualities on her own. Its super frustrating and I wonder if they will eventually work through this?

The last few episodes we got a glimpse of the mother actually giving some good advice and reflecting on her limitations... but if she is aware of it and is not fixing it - then the mother is not as upright as she thinks she is.

I think they wield power in different ways. Empress through an empathetic approach that is great as a role model, but its not having much success in curbing her kids. She is in a lot of scenes with the Emperor where they entertain important guests and you can tell publicly she plays quite an active role in supporting the Emperor. Where as Consort Yue seem to have not much interest in being involved in day to day matters of ruling, and her personality is firm but fair with her family. With strangers you can see she is quite ruthless if she doesn't like them. But even with the Consort's approach to parenting her kids are unruly too...

The Empress was married to the king as part of an arranged marriage and the Consort is his childhood sweetheart. - so the dynamic there is different for sure. I think he loves Consort Yue but he also has grown to care for and love the Empress in his own way. He treats them both well and there is an understanding and mutual respect between the three of them. I've noticed when he is venting about things the show has included both scenes with the Empress and the Consort .... which kind of signals he is honest with both of them in sharing his worries and burdens.

But the Empresse's character is sad to me because where as the Emperor has the best of both worlds, she only has a one dimensional relationship :(. And you can see she does what she is supposed to do and doesn't complain about how much pressure she is under to be a good Empress when she probably just wants a peaceful and simple life. Her life story seems like everything has happened to her without her control

I agree with everything you said. I even paused at the knifepoint scene with WuLu just to stare at them in disbelief at how good they looked together and had the same exact thought. I never expected to have a drama with them together tho so this just feels even more amazing. Plus there is a lot of side eyes staring in TLB when the MFL is trying to convince Wu Lei to fight the prince that Lusy is being forced to marry. He refuses but those moments also had some tension.

yes LOL .....🥲😂

<3 <3 <3

Oh yes the only way her dad reminded me of Lou Yao was the pastry scene which was super funny and how he lets his wife kind of take the lead on raising their kids (but I think that has more to do with him thinking of her as more cultured since he comes from a different background) . The second uncle is studious but I don’t think he can compare to Yuan and the dad has a military background but I think LBY is in a league of his own. But I totally see the symmatry you mean!

Oooo thanks for sharing :D

I also didn’t realize until just now the day SS was born her parents were called to help protect the Gu city! And to assist marquess Huo 😳😱

When LBY sent the granddad back to the Cheng family before he was banished he said it was to thank SS. I was trying to figure out how that was thanking her until I realized, her granduncle came and exposed the aunt which led to the aunt being sent away. It took me a while longer to realize LBY was picking up on what SS was doing (both in serving justice but also pushing forward her own agenda) by sending him clues, because he is so perceptive and intelligent (I only realized how intelligent he is based on the last few episodes).

So I think even early on they were helping each other (especially LBY who was being kind when he wasn't known for repaying favours). Theres also another line where right after he comes home his soldiers tell him there is a rumour about him being unfilial by not visiting his father and he shrugs if off saying thats a minor thing. So filiality just for the sake of it is definitely not important to him.

I might be overly misinterpreting but this drama is so fun to analyze as they add layers - haha!