lol @ the people who keep harping and saying meaningless shit like, "he's innocent until proven guilty in court"OJ…
Hey! OJ has committed himself to finding the real killers. He dedicated his life to it after his trials. It isn't his fault that one best lead led back to himself. Or that second best lead which also turned out to be him. As OJ says, "Sometimes you just have to laugh."
Nowadays, it's hard to have a boyfriend or girlfriend and break up after years because if something happens to…
What terrible times are these, when a self-righteous man can meet, groom and date a young woman, keep her by his side until that is no longer his want? Because when he is merely done with her, she behaves like a child. She hurts him by playing the victim, resorts to suicide just to spite him, and all the blowback is upon him. And all the chaebol's horses and all the studio executive's men won't be able to put him back together again.
The story of Kim Soo Hyun is a cautionary tale. A big warning: Sometimes the good guy doesn't win. And maybe that's a good thing because he's really not!
he needs to go because he faces a penalty of $900k if he doesn't show up.he's going not because of anything but…
Yep. He needs to stop hemorrhaging money wherever and as much as he can, and he also needs to shore up support wherever and as much as he can. This all could backfire on him, or he might just buy time. I daresay Risk & Reward has never felt so palpable for Kim Soo Hyun!
It's another reason why it is so sad that Kim Sae Ron isn't around. She might be the only person around able to understand what it's like to feel that insane level of intense desperation!
What constitutes cyberbullying is down to regional jurisdiction, there is no binding international law. Hopefully…
Yep!
Cyberbullying isn't prohibited in the court of public opinion any more than innocent until proven guilty is required.
Treating someone as "innocent until proven guilty" is the most civilized way to treat a person in a criminal justice system, because any of us would want that for ourselves. And that is why it has spread around the globe (not everywhere) and been adopted in as a standard
But unless you live in a regional jurisdiction where restrictions are in place, individual expression and cyberbullying do not equate.
Can you show me evidence of where and when he was found guilty in the court as a pedophile?????
No one can provide that evidence because it doesn't exist. There is information (not yet vetted) on both sides and people are free to and do form opinions. But we are also waiting for the other shoe to drop. It's all so premature!
The court of public opinion is quick, but the legal system is slow. And we haven't even gotten to the verification of allegations, yet. Testimony and media recordings still need to be vetted. But the process has begun.
And in the court of public opinion, opinions will change when allegations are made, when they are recanted, when they are verified, and/or when both parties no longer dispute them but finally agree.
So choose your side and convince yourself by whatever standards you wish. But you're not going to change a lot of minds. Minds will change when the facts demand it.
She swore she would never pay it. She fought an appeal, lost again. Was fined again. She continued appealing while working her way up the system until it ended one level below the Supreme Court. At this point she owed Trump almost a half-million dollars. Her own attorney—Michael Avenatti—hadn't billed her for his time. He was in for a cut of the proceeds if she won. A year later, she lost her final appeal. The judge from 9th Circuit appeals court ordered her to pay an additional $120,000 in legal fees on top of the amount she had already racked up. https://www.npr.org/2023/04/05/1168215663/trump-stormy-daniels-defamation-lawsuit
Don't hate the drama just because of its actor, hate the drama because of the performance of its actor. But it's…
Yeah. I'm one of them. In my other post I shared how much I enjoyed QOT last year. I watched every episode at least twice. I bawled my eyes out and went back for more. I watched it with subs and I watched it while ignoring the subs, and I watched it with dubs while I did chores while waiting for the next episode to drop.
And now I don't feel like I can ever watch it again simply because of a visceral aversion I feel about watching KSH.
QOT is still a beautiful drama. But it's like a beautiful garden which I don't think I'll be able to visit, anymore. Because I get these visceral feelings I get when I think about it.
This is barely more than pure speculation, but I've been wondering what it must be like to live under someone's thumb, so to speak, and how confusing and demoralizing that might be?
It seems like she was controlled, even gaslit (gaslighted?) He pulled her away from her agency and she became a co-founder and a client of his. She was no longer under the care of her former management team and lived away from her family, so she was more vulnerable to his influence than perhaps anyone else. Time spent on set is like being at the office but also ephemeral. You can't put down roots because it's temporary and next time it will be somewhere else under different conditions with different people. He was her world and her focus.
Their relationship was secret so she couldn't behave towards him or expect to be treated how they might be able to behave together when alone. In her apartment, or his, and perhaps also a few (but not many) other locations too.
But then she was fired. They broke up. Eventually she was ghosted. But before that, maybe they had poor boundaries? Did they go back and forth? Could he have called off their relationship but still sought her out for hook-ups? If so, no wonder she felt confused!
Did she think they were in a relationship while he did not? It wouldn't be the first time for two people to have different understandings about the status of their relationship. A girl in love in a secret relationship with poor boundaries and a domineering mate who is hot and cold might not understand where the lines were drawn.
Again, all of this is barely more than pure speculation. But—to me—this is the kind of stuff that drives a person towards the kind of confusion and despair where thinking that a fatal choice is their best or only option, which is tragic.
Don't hate the drama just because of its actor, hate the drama because of the performance of its actor. But it's hard to like the performance of the actor if you already hate the actor. And if you've already liked the performance of the actor, but learn to hate the character of the actor, it's hard to ever enjoy that actor's performance ever again.
You really believe someone who lies over and over again? You should save your lecture for him, his company and…
All good points. I've been trying to walk that line while also indulging in some team Sae Ron fanboying because I love it when villians get their comeuppance & opaque, corrupt systems give way to transparency & justice. Scripted entertainment has fed this indulgence all my life. As the saying goes, everybody loves a happy ending! But trying to walk that line means I at least have to try to maintain a little self-awareness when stray off of it.
Which is why in other posts I've tried to research and clarify what exactly we do and don't know, and how much we can make of what is being reported. There is a lot of "wait and see" and while we are waiting, we like to speculate. It's human nature.
But at the core, I agree with you. Leaping to conclusions is a recipe for injustice and can (and will) come back to bite us. I don't want to feel bad in the future for having bashed KSH even though over the past couple of weeks it has felt so good! So I guess this makes me a hypocrite, but I'm trying!
Kim Soo Hyun is forcing a lot of people to ask, "What defines a pedo?"
This discussion is entirely complicated because people on opposing sides and even people on the same side may and do have different standards of definition.
Whether you are talking legal standards or moral standards, when it comes to age of consent or the gap between ages they change from place to place and culture to culture. And even in within the same place and culture, differences of opinions exist. Don't forget that we also have to take into account that they change over time.
People who are highly victim-conscious and/or most esteem high moral standards prefer a higher age of consent and a lower gap between ages and thus more subjects will be considered pedos, while people who are highly false-accusation conscious and/or most esteem personal liberty will consider a lower age of content and wider gap between ages to be more reasonable and thus fewer subjects will be considered pedos.
Diplomacy is the art of getting people to agree upon something but it never even begins until after everyone can agree on the definitions of terms. But I don't think any of us even knows how to start.
My main takeaway is when he said he was spun and is uncertain, and even if he said something it wouldn't make…
Here it is:
"How is it that the so-called ‘fans’ are the ones being the least helpful? I didn’t even mention Soo Hyun’s name, and yet people came swarming in instantly… Must be driving you crazy too, not being able to fact-check anything, right? Well, I’ve spent years living with that same uncertainty, trying to convince myself by telling myself over and over again, ‘I guess there was no other choice.’ Somehow, that helps me stay sane. I won’t say anything because I don’t need to add to it. There will be plenty of others giving him a hard time. And even if I did speak up, it wouldn’t become fact anyway—and it wouldn’t help any of you, either. So maybe just don’t poke the bear and move along. Oh… and by the way, aren’t you the ones constantly dragging my sister onto the chopping block over similar issues? The way her name keeps getting brought up all over the place—it’s honestly disgusting."
The story of Kim Soo Hyun is a cautionary tale. A big warning: Sometimes the good guy doesn't win. And maybe that's a good thing because he's really not!
It's another reason why it is so sad that Kim Sae Ron isn't around. She might be the only person around able to understand what it's like to feel that insane level of intense desperation!
Cyberbullying isn't prohibited in the court of public opinion any more than innocent until proven guilty is required.
Treating someone as "innocent until proven guilty" is the most civilized way to treat a person in a criminal justice system, because any of us would want that for ourselves. And that is why it has spread around the globe (not everywhere) and been adopted in as a standard
But unless you live in a regional jurisdiction where restrictions are in place, individual expression and cyberbullying do not equate.
The court of public opinion is quick, but the legal system is slow. And we haven't even gotten to the verification of allegations, yet. Testimony and media recordings still need to be vetted. But the process has begun.
And in the court of public opinion, opinions will change when allegations are made, when they are recanted, when they are verified, and/or when both parties no longer dispute them but finally agree.
So choose your side and convince yourself by whatever standards you wish. But you're not going to change a lot of minds. Minds will change when the facts demand it.
Stormy Daniels lost her suit against Donald Trump. She was ordered to pay him $300,000.00 to cover his legal fees when her suit was dismissed.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/stormy-daniels-must-pay-300k-donald-trump-losing-defamation-case-appea-rcna21002
She swore she would never pay it. She fought an appeal, lost again. Was fined again. She continued appealing while working her way up the system until it ended one level below the Supreme Court. At this point she owed Trump almost a half-million dollars. Her own attorney—Michael Avenatti—hadn't billed her for his time. He was in for a cut of the proceeds if she won. A year later, she lost her final appeal. The judge from 9th Circuit appeals court ordered her to pay an additional $120,000 in legal fees on top of the amount she had already racked up.
https://www.npr.org/2023/04/05/1168215663/trump-stormy-daniels-defamation-lawsuit
When The Supreme Court declined to take her case. She was out of options. Maybe because her attorney didn't earn, he stole $300,000 from her $800,000 book advance, for which he received a 14-year prison sentence.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/attorney-michael-avenatti-found-guilty-stealing-stormy-daniels-rcna14965
But that's just a side-plot; salt in her wounds. The $500,000 Stormy had left from her book deal was just enough to pay Trump's lawyers. Fortunately he didn't sue for further damages. Stormy couldn't pay anyway. She was left with nothing. At least she learned a valuable lesson. (Maybe not?)
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/supreme-court-turns-down-michael-avenatti-s-appeal-of-stormy-daniels-identity-theft-conviction/ar-AA1sjteB
And now I don't feel like I can ever watch it again simply because of a visceral aversion I feel about watching KSH.
QOT is still a beautiful drama. But it's like a beautiful garden which I don't think I'll be able to visit, anymore. Because I get these visceral feelings I get when I think about it.
(Wait… isn't Lee Sa Rang the name of that pesky Gumiho fox? 🦊)
It seems like she was controlled, even gaslit (gaslighted?) He pulled her away from her agency and she became a co-founder and a client of his. She was no longer under the care of her former management team and lived away from her family, so she was more vulnerable to his influence than perhaps anyone else. Time spent on set is like being at the office but also ephemeral. You can't put down roots because it's temporary and next time it will be somewhere else under different conditions with different people. He was her world and her focus.
Their relationship was secret so she couldn't behave towards him or expect to be treated how they might be able to behave together when alone. In her apartment, or his, and perhaps also a few (but not many) other locations too.
But then she was fired. They broke up. Eventually she was ghosted. But before that, maybe they had poor boundaries? Did they go back and forth? Could he have called off their relationship but still sought her out for hook-ups? If so, no wonder she felt confused!
Did she think they were in a relationship while he did not? It wouldn't be the first time for two people to have different understandings about the status of their relationship. A girl in love in a secret relationship with poor boundaries and a domineering mate who is hot and cold might not understand where the lines were drawn.
Again, all of this is barely more than pure speculation. But—to me—this is the kind of stuff that drives a person towards the kind of confusion and despair where thinking that a fatal choice is their best or only option, which is tragic.
Koreaboo's timeline of events is my go-to way to catch up on everything which has happened vis-a-vis the scandal:
https://www.koreaboo.com/series/kim-soo-hyun-kim-sae-ron-relationship/timeline/
Some MDL members have also created this google document (with regular updates). It is even more detailed than the Koreaboo timeline:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gMuaL3YIYNwHQE3OILNpB_2LMYil-T9TU_ZrysSL6lU
Which is why in other posts I've tried to research and clarify what exactly we do and don't know, and how much we can make of what is being reported. There is a lot of "wait and see" and while we are waiting, we like to speculate. It's human nature.
But at the core, I agree with you. Leaping to conclusions is a recipe for injustice and can (and will) come back to bite us. I don't want to feel bad in the future for having bashed KSH even though over the past couple of weeks it has felt so good! So I guess this makes me a hypocrite, but I'm trying!
This discussion is entirely complicated because people on opposing sides and even people on the same side may and do have different standards of definition.
Whether you are talking legal standards or moral standards, when it comes to age of consent or the gap between ages they change from place to place and culture to culture. And even in within the same place and culture, differences of opinions exist. Don't forget that we also have to take into account that they change over time.
People who are highly victim-conscious and/or most esteem high moral standards prefer a higher age of consent and a lower gap between ages and thus more subjects will be considered pedos, while people who are highly false-accusation conscious and/or most esteem personal liberty will consider a lower age of content and wider gap between ages to be more reasonable and thus fewer subjects will be considered pedos.
Diplomacy is the art of getting people to agree upon something but it never even begins until after everyone can agree on the definitions of terms. But I don't think any of us even knows how to start.
"How is it that the so-called ‘fans’ are the ones being the least helpful?
I didn’t even mention Soo Hyun’s name, and yet people came swarming in instantly…
Must be driving you crazy too, not being able to fact-check anything, right?
Well, I’ve spent years living with that same uncertainty, trying to convince myself by telling myself over and over again, ‘I guess there was no other choice.’ Somehow, that helps me stay sane. I won’t say anything because I don’t need to add to it. There will be plenty of others giving him a hard time. And even if I did speak up, it wouldn’t become fact anyway—and it wouldn’t help any of you, either. So maybe just don’t poke the bear and move along. Oh… and by the way, aren’t you the ones constantly dragging my sister onto the chopping block over similar issues? The way her name keeps getting brought up all over the place—it’s honestly disgusting."
https://www.koreaboo.com/news/sullis-brother-calls-kim-soo-hyuns-fans-in-biting-new-update/