Kimsamsoom

Well, your ramming down my throat that I should love it.

And i'm not trying to convince myself.

I am just posting here to have discussion with my fellow critics. And have smart conversations with a few defenders.

Or is this comment section just for people who love the show? You tell me Charlotte?

I'm trying to ignore the trolls, since they don't really add much to the conversations.

Actually I looked Flixpatrol is missing A LOT of countries, it's not accurate at all. So I won't bother with flix patrol arguments anymore lol.

Ok, people love it, people hate it.

Reminds of every other show in MDL. So what is the argument here?

how about don't use flixpatrol, it's not accurate and doesn't give a clear picture. Ok?

So if flixpatrol doesn't include all countries, they don't use it to prove something then.

You just proved flixpatrol is not accurate. I rest my case.

I will miss this comment section when the show is done, lol.

On flix patrol, the website you are parroting. It's not top 10 there. In India it's top 10. I don't know my geography, is Bangladesh part of India? My apologies if it is. I always though Bangladesh was it's own country.

9 x 3 = 27. It's not triple, barely double. Math is hard.

Yeah let's not talk about local ratings, it wouldn't be fair then.

I'm just peeved all the defenders call us critics haters.

I feel our criticism for the most part, are well written, rooted in facts from the story.

We're not blindly saying stuff like "KTEM is a hot steaming pile of garbage, don't watch it, your mind will explode!"

Normally the critics have come with some pretty smart explanation of said criticism.

I think my writing improved by being in this comment section lol.

Oh lol, I was hoping it was another website other than flix patrol.

I've literally never heard of this website except from here.

Plus like I said, if they keep wanting to use Flix Patrol, then i'm going to keep using Neilsen Korea.

touche

Sure, people watch it streaming, my point being if wavve had like 20 million subscribers, and it's trending number 1, you have a good point. But it's barely over 1 million. While Netflix Korea has 2 million, and Korea itself has 19 million households with TV, and approximately 92% of that 19 million chose not to watch it. I think this fact speaks volumes, don't you think?

So we critics should just stop posting our thoughts? How come? Give me a great reason.

After time unfreezes, LR get's shot right away, he's holding a gun, JY is holding a gun, I don't think people are suddenly going to swarm LG, regardless if they recognize him or not, because there are guns involved.

FOR ME, it's bad, for you it's good. No problem, we view it differently. it's all subjective my friend. You cannot claim a romance is good as a fact/truth of life because you thought so, just like I can't claim the romance is bad as a fact. The best we can do is provide examples within the drama of why romance is good, vs why it's bad.

Do you want to do that? Let's list the times it was good vs when it was bad, complete with episodes number, the point in the episode, plus the theory behind why so called scene is bad or good?

Nope according to Flixpatrol Bangladesh isn't one of the countries TKEM is top 10 in.

And if you bothered to read the whole message I wrote about hospital playlist, I explain in detail why Hospital Playlist is doing well.

Let me repeat some of the parts here for you.

Using Flixpatrol information (who knows how accurate this info is)

The King Eternal is number 9 this Month. Hospital Playlist on the other hand is number 17.

This is quite close to be honest. They are both in the top 20.

BUT, and it's a big BUT

Hospital playlist is absolutely dominating TKEM in local ratings. And it's not just local viewership. Hospital Playlist is even dominating TKEM in Netflix Korea ratings.

Now, TKEM comes it at a staggering 25 Million US dollars in production cost. Hospital Playlist? I doubt even over $10 million if that (I can't find info, but i'm guessing it's much much lower, the main actor even took a paycut for the drama to be produced)

There was also not much hype for hospital playlist.

When you use ratings to discuss a show, you need to discuss all other factors that go with it, including cost of production, viewer ratings, viewer reviews. Heck even in MDL ratings, hospital playlist is...

9.3, let that sink in for a second. in MDL, which is mostly international fans, it's 9.3

KTEM on the other hand? a fairly low 8.3. That's one whole point below Hospital Playlist.

If you think KTEM is good, that's fine, but don't bash hospital playlist to move your agenda.

Thank you!

I have an honest question to the defenders.

It has never bothered me, that people love or like this show. it's your life you do what you want to do.

BUT...

Why does it bother the defenders so much that people hate it?

Why does it bother the defenders so much, that people who hate it, continue to watch it and criticize it?

I'd like a genuine explanation.

I'll add these, although to be fair, more than half of these, the critics agree with, and some of them like the Shinjae arc being good often comes from critics rather than defenders.

Regardless, i've added it to the defenders list.

I'm putting it in perspective, it goes both ways you know. We are having an active discussion. My point being your using a metric that is not very strong. It's misleading to claim a show is trending #1 in an online platform, when said online platform is not very large, as compared to the viewing public of Korea. Wavve does not even compare to Netflix, as the latter hasmore than double the amount of subscriptions.

And your response is "you're just a hater!" And I think here lies the problem with most defenders, instead of engaging in thoughtful, fact based, logical discussions, they just call the other side haters.

Are we here to have a proper discussion or what?

That poster, obviously wanted people to think that the PPL's are on fire, thus the show is successful, I joked that CLOY's is making even more for it's PPL.

But if you're just going to be defensive the whole time, and not have an active discussion on the show's merits, then good day to you :)

You certainly can, but keep in mind the number of subscribers that Wavve has is just 1 Million, They are not that big, and it's mired in lot of problems with it's UI, check the article below.

https://www.koreatechtoday.com/wavve-off-to-a-rocky-start/

They will hit 5 Million subscribers (or at least aim for it) by 2023. And for a $6.80/month subscription, this is a pretty lofty goal.

I was actually trying to find a neutral ground that doesn't involve viewer ratings at all, but if you really want to bring ratings to our discussion, then sure we can.

Yes, there are negative comments that are one liners and don't add to the conversation. But a majority of the critical comments I see are valid.

Sure, lots of people watch KTEM and enjoy it, just like a lot watch it and don't

Well, you do know time was frozen when LG and LR met right? So recognizing either LG or LR is a moot point.

That's the thing, even if I want to put myself in their shoes, in their situation, I still can't imagine it. There are a lot of aspects in the show, that I don't find realistic, making it a bit hard to watch at times.

the shop Nari owns BBT - bubble tea

I've gone ahead and distilled the Defender's comments and the Critics and here is what I have. Maybe defenders can list their view here, so I can add it to the list.

Defenders Point of View - Why KTEM so Good

- performances from supporting cast such as Woo Do Hwan, Kim Kyung Nam, Jung Eun Chae, and Lee Jung Jin
- The romance is sweet
- Set design for the interior of the palace... I want Lee Gon's study.
- Shin jae arc is awesome
- The visuals, a lot of the scenes are really prettily built from costume design to lighting. (There is also a visual to go in the cons side such as confusing camera angles)
- It's LMH and KGE, two of the top stars in Korea
- The comment section here is reaching "Untamed status"
- I'm so confused about the story, but I love it
- Set design for the interior of the palace... I want Lee Gon's study.
- It gets better after episode 10
- It's trending on twitter, and international fans love it, trending in all countries
- ranking #16 of top 20 in global Netflix (no proof). Only Kdrama to rank that high
- Local ratings don't matter, netflix ratings is all that matters
- Look at how much PPL is selling, sold out everywhere!
- If you didn't like it, you probably were just confused, or not thinking too hard
- it's a thinking drama

Critics Point of View

- The romance/chemistry is non existent. The love happened too fast
- The show is mired in some controversies including the usage of korean and japanese imagery in regards to the temples and battleships which is confusing.
- The show is confusing.
- There are too many plot holes, too many characters introduced that make it confusing.
- The theories and science, much more the math of the show is inconsistent and changes several times throughout the drama
- There is too many contradictory scenes.
- The characters, other than the main leads, are poorly developed without much of a backstory
- Did not like how they handled the progression of the villain
- The supposed plot twist were too predictable
- They wasted a lot of the acting talents of it's staff
- There is excessive PPL to the point of distraction
- The editing is not the best, the CGI is also not the best considering how big their budget was
- Did not like LMH and KGE acting
- This is not the best way to portray parallel world nor time travel, it's been done better by other show and is more clear in other shows.
- Too much inconsistencies, and logical holes
- too much leap of logic
- too much cringy scenes and awful pick up lines
- the pacing is way too long, takes too long to get invested

I'm sure there are more for both sides, but these are just on the top of my head. If the defenders want to defend the drama, more power to them, but let's do it at a level that allows smart discussion complete with facts, theories, and logical exposition.

https://www.koreatechtoday.com/wavve-off-to-a-rocky-start/

I mean this is fun, let's just keep linking articles to prove out point :)

Wavve has 1 million subscribers, and not everyone is watching KTEM. It's a paid service. $6.80/month

How many households can access KTEM on FREE TV? Oh yeah 19,6M. Yet only 8% of that is viewing it.

http://www.casbaa.com/advertising/countries/south-korea

Like I said, I don't mind ignoring the rating for both local and international, and instead have an active discussion on the shows merits.

Let's discuss :)

https://www.hancinema.net/hancinema-s-news-crash-landing-on-you-boosts-barbecue-chicken-sales-138450.html

70% increase vs only 40%. Seems like a flop for me.

I'm just kidding. People may joke about the obscene and distracting amount of PPL, but I must admit I am craving BBQ Chix and The Alley BBT.

But, this still doesn't meant he show is successful., but the PPL seems to be.