psychophant

i am responding to how op says she doesnt see this in the states. i think we dont see this in the states because its so large, filled with people, and it has influences all over the world that u are uncancellable. in the worst scenario, it is way easier to bounce back or find a new opportunities with a new identity. in korea, u feel trapped bc korea is overpopulated and korean isnt a universal language which means the feeling of being trapped in a small country increases.
for normal ppl, the precipating factor for suicide isnt cyberbullying. it's prevailing mental health issues, relationship breakdowns, financial problems, and physical ailments. even where cyberbullying is involved (like when it exacerbates mental health problems), when u are dealing with potentially thousands or millions of anonymous commenters writing hateful things about u from everywhere, it's probably more effective to teach ppl to avoid the media and block out the filth than to try to eliminate cyberbullying. thats also what western celebrities do.
when i think about the problem, i think what are the most difficult problems to manage? as aforementioned, cyberbullying is pretty easy to manage. ur devices and social media is an access portal to u and ur bullies, so by denying the portal u deny the haters. u might argue that this restricts the victims' freedom and they shouldnt be restricted, but if cyberbullying is truly a killer in korea, then this solution is literally life saving. u should be treating the online space like poison for them.
what is harder to manage are, at most, the secondary effects of cyberbullying like mental health, recovering destroyed relationships, and resolving financial problems. but during a scandal, both american and korean celebrities probably have relationship problems and mental health which are treated similarly (there might be a case korea lacks mental health care compared to the states, but im not sure that's for celebrities too so i skipped this). i assume money issues was a big problem, especially for sae ron. then when u consider the fact that america faces way less money problems bc literal no name celebrities have faced and settled bankruptcies upwards of $10 and 20 millions, but pretty recognizable Korean celebrities like Ahn Jae Hyun was fighting over about $1.5 million with his ex-wife. this suggests money is more sparse in korea which means celebrities not necessarily at the highest tier will likely have money troubles compared to american celebrities. so when u consider the mounted pressures of being a celeb and u arent necessarily rewarded for them then a scandal occurs whete you feel stuck and hopeless that sort of explains the problem. cultural differences between a collectivist and individualistic society can also play a role.

y would u reply under me with a general statement after asking me a rhetorical question? ofc I would misunderstand.
tell me ur a leftist without telling me ur a leftist. girl, not everything that examines a tragedy critically is victim blaming. im not saying anything about whether sae ron should have or shouldnt have done what she ultimately did or that shes weak or dumb for doing it. idk what she was going thru. what i was alluding to is her situation wasnt normal and ppl under her position mostly get off better bc the original poster is implying this is normal in korea. im also saying look at a person in a similar shoe bc i dont think it is likely the same thing will repeat. u can even examine korea's "cyberbullying culture" in real time and compare it with any other country's celebrity scandal.
i am not talking about it like some business. i am talking about it like a tragedy. when a tragedy happens, ppl note the biggest mistakes and differences so that the events that lead to the tragedy becomes a cautionary tale. u guys r literally doing the same by saying its due to cyberbullying. news reports too. but the reason why reporters arent politicians and scientists is bc they just see the superficial facts and think they have the answer. i am saying that is availability bias. look at the number of similar cases. check how many were unaffected in the long term. see the differences. these are all valid things to examine when u think about this stuff.

thank u for understanding me 😥

i lived in korea for 3 years and studied korean for 8 years. most koreans like ur average salarymen and women dont care if celebrities date. people might joke about it and say theyll never watch them but theyre not being serious. its only their most loyal fanbases that really do care. basically u have to be more successful than ur obsessive fanbase like hyun bin and son ye jin and there wont be a problem. but usually most celebrities rely on their loyal fanbase to survive.
basically if bts members, cha eun woo, or gong yoo started dating, u might get angry stans but there will still be way more supporters bc they are the top of what they do. sadly, its not the same for the vast majority of celebs.
ppl who keep comparing the states and korea dont realize how much bigger the states is.
also, majority of ppl werent mad bc ppl thought sae ron and ksh were dating. ppl got upset bc sae ron posted a pic of herself with ksh during a scandal... they thought it would drag ksh in some way and cause misunderstandings. its also not the reason for her death from any known available info beyond conspiracy theories like her dying on ksh's bday...

yes the suicide is tragic but none of these will prevent it.

wtf? cyberstalking 🤣🤣🤣

hahaha. then explain why kanye can say all that nazi shit and get away with it in the states? u think most americans are nazis?

there is a problem with celebrities but is it only bc there are koreans leaving mean comments online? use ur head a little, dumb dumb. every suicide story has more problems to it like shit ton of debt, revenge porn, internal drama between friends and family, etc.

because the states have more opportunities and everyone isnt clumped in one spot. the state is 50x bigger than korea and there are about 20x more people who speak english than korean in the world. its not like the states have nicer people or something.

stalking is criminalized in korea... she wasn't stalked.

you should ashamed of yourself for your comprehension problems. where did i ever say people should bully someone if they make a big mistake? are u on drugs?

i like that korea is making their celebrities accountable for wrong behavior. i dont think she should have tried to hasten her remorse period by lying, but i also dont think she ever deserved the cyberbullying. these two statements can coexist

the kim soo hyun thing is completely different from what im talking about. yes there are parasocial fans who might have thought they were in a relationship and overprotective kim soo hyun fans who didnt want his name to relate with sae ron during his peak and her scandal, but thats literally every fan group???? why the hell are we going to discuss nonsense when there are more pressing matters at hand? do you really think a bunch of jealous korean girls are the ones who drove sae rom to her death?????

r u dumb? do u not know how many non-korean celebrities get booed off stage? look at drake, ice spice, taylor swift, hulk hogan etc. thats not what it means to get harassed.
korea has higher suicide rates because it has a way worse shame culture than others. thats why the leading suicide rates are east asian countries like japan and china. in america, people think u can fk up again and again and as long as u have a chance at success u should keep trying. in suicide victims of shame culture, they think life is no longer living once they lose their success.

a dui that led to destroying a city transformer and fleeing the scene after is not a small thing imo. she could have been dj yesong in another universe. i am also certain if she stayed out of socials and media for about two years, she would have had a better shot of returning (park soo young of afterschool, jaeyi koo, hwang bora, kwak do wan, ki joon hong, yoon tae yong etc). there are hundreds and hundreds of celebrities with duis who follow this formula and return with minor backlash unless your core audience is very young or elderly. but she tried to return within months and when that failed, did some weird stuff to gain sympathy but that backfired too, and got more hate sent her way. if she worked with a proper pr team or applied common sense i am almost certain she would not be in this position. if u want a case example jin ye sol is a current actress who is basically in the same shoe as kim sae ron and just under the 2 year mark since her dui charge. check the "hate" and see whether it s more excessive than what you find on reddit. although, apparently she's getting married so lets see if she's able to return to showbiz if she decides she wants to continue.

what actually happened is she started tutoring actors but as it wasnt enough so she tried to work in a small theatre. she got booed off stage by the audience. then one day, she posted photos of herself working at a cafe wearing a mega coffee apron. an entertainment news reporter wanted to write an article about it so they asked mega coffee hq for some information of how that happened. mega coffee then went through their employment record and disclosed to the reporter that sae ron never worked there, the photos did not represent any of their stores, and that she most likely obtained her uniform from a friend who was working there part time. then she lost fans. afterwards, she posted photos of herself working at a bar but because of the cafe incident people didnt believe her.

now everyone is making up facts that kim sae ron died because she was getting bullied irl. but where were they when she was alive and why didnt they say anything while she was alive? why is her dad only going after a gossip youtuber who is claiming he had approval from sae ron's former manager? because the narrative that ppl were just harassing her irl is a lie. you would get police reports and files charged if that happened.

no, the coporate office of the cafe (mega coffee) looked through their employment records and did not find her there and called her out. then her fans got outraged. it's tragic she took her life but do not distort the history

lmaoo international fans say korean fans are insane, but then you have people like these just frothing at their mouths over the slightest mistakes or criticisms.

"Touch grass instead of using fighting words online over a celebrity. A true fan would just wish him well against all odds. You're embarrassing him with your over-obsession and unnecessary vitriol."
well said.

don't mind the atom951 user down below; i have had my fair share of dealings with them and they are just a sad no-life troll who sits on this site everyday 24/7 and literally enjoys talking to themselves/harassing others on multiple accounts. they also go by lucyl and etoks21 (and probably more).

nah, there have always been slumps in the past too. we normally get like 1-4 year phenomenal runs per decade.

"no way comparable to Hitchcock and Bong Jong Ho."
well, i dont think drama/tv show directors are in the caliber of the greatest film directors just yet. i think those are some of the best dramas we have, but not the best films. i also do think true detective is overrated so i guess we will have to just agree to disagree.

"I just wish it was bolder with its storytelling though. "
not sure what you mean by bolder storytelling from kingdom - no matter how you shape or dress it up, it's a zombie drama at the end of the day. i will admit, the movie was ass and really disappointing, but the drama was great.

"Signal was groundbreaking in the kdrama industry (not outside because Frequency did it first)"
well, i'm not a fan of signal because it has a unique idea. i'm a big fan of signal (and all the dramas i've rated highly) because they were all executed well, seem natural, and implement details that you'd not consider. in signal's case, it's the butterfly effect and how it generates unique, ambivalent problems. yes, individually, all of the themes/plot devices have been done before, but i'm more concerned about the execution.

"It sounds to me like you just hate experimental art."
i'm a fan of all the artists you've listed actually (because i can derive some meaning and a story from the paintings themselves, not meaning from some pretentious meta nonsense). i am not a fan of someone like jackson pollock lol. yes, i'm not a big fan of experimental art film that's just artsy and different. i'd draw the line at mulholland drive, which i thought was great. eraserhead is not something i'd enjoy simply because there's no meaning to it for me personally. some of the experimental films that were different (with a functional purpose) like primer, i'd love.

"among kdrama fans where its common knowledge that most people rate staff based on which actors are in it"
eh, i don't think you'll find many fans like that in the thriller sections lmao. unless they're looking for choi min sik, shin ha kyun, choi jin woong, etc 😂

there's a difference between "fresh and unique" for the sake of being fresh and unique, and fresh and unique that's practical to the storytelling, where it revolutionizes the trajectory of future films. cannes is the former, basically pretentious garbage (since their "freshness" is useless to the storytelling);while the hitchcocks/bong joon ho/spielbergs/kurosawa/etc are the latter. or maybe to put it simply, is it superficially different or essentially different?

it's like (post)modern art - you think abstract art where they insert some random color in the middle of the canvas is top quality art just because it has never been done before in a museum setting? be my guest, but i prefer your "dull" chardins, hieronymus boschs, da vincis and michaelangelos.

sure, it's not the bible, but mdl's scores based on the genre is pretty accurate (that is, if you base dramas based on the genre and not general scores). furthermore, just like all the other rating sites, the newer dramas/films are getting more and more inflated, generally speaking, so there's some slight adjustments you'd have to do. but there's no universe i will think bargain is a masterpiece in the likeness of dramas like beyond evil, signal, kingdom, etc.