ammmz

My only point is that there’s a double standard and I think viewers are intentionally misconstruing it. I have explained and reiterated over and over; the way you are portraying it makes it seem way more clear-cut and not complex or grey at all. All I said was extend the same grace in putting her circumstances in context. People can easily do this with Min Woo—and his position is way more combative and harmful—but refuse to with Su-mi. It’s telling.

Maybe my delivery is poor but at this point the projections towards me and my comments and refusing to even entertain this train of thought that very few of us has brought up shows how much people balk at this idea, actively get angry, justify harm whether intentional or not and miss how these cases ESPECIALLY this episode’s case tie into this exact thing. Maybe we should re-evaluate why.

Projection. Have a good day

Well said! I think the user above put it perfectly. It’s more complex than just wholesale being evil or good. It’s grey, all confusing, but isn’t it up to us to change the world that lead to these points? you’re completely right abt how she lived in that time too!!!

She had to put her whole life on hold; idk why this is controversial to say cos acknowledging that doesn’t mean we love her and want to marry her like what the fuck???

I stopped after never being in love because you have 0 idea and know way to know of who I am and who I have loved or not and certainly not their gender. But I also wouldn’t be with someone who would do that to me. Have a good day, stay cool

I am saying that the ire towards her making the decision that she wanyed to make and not being in WYW’s life while not recognizing that Tae Su-Mi was asked something draining of her and they made a DEAL is misplaced. I am not saying that her or her actions /right now/ are coming from a good place but also, as someone alluded to above in a really good comment, not a completely bad one. The father is absolutely not this saint and it isn’t WYW and her dad against TSM. It is clear that it’s about them and their personal issues and pain rather than WYW which is understandable. Like someone literally thinks a woman who gives up her child has to contact that child and if not it is Narcisstic. That is what these comments are saying and believe and that is fucked up, unfair, and far from the show’s overt themes and exploration on power structures and of agency in the world. That’s what the show is about! But it’s easier to see where someone like Min Woo is coming from—like it’s legitimate—rather than even give a smidge to Su-mi.

No, she didn’t but I’m not arguing about it. The adoption thing is also untrue because adoption is rife with issues like babies literally being taken away from mothers. Please don’t pretend that you know what you’re referring to. This is not being pro-choice.

no i'm not but i am a fan of women deciding what to do with their bodies. sorry if that offends you but jsyk it's a huge part of this show's theme. good luck to you

yes!!! i loved those eps!!

yes. he didn't JUST ask he fucking begged and promised with all the background information. give me a fucking break dude. . because it isn't his body and he knows what she would have to go through. it is ridiculous and it's sadder that we don't see it as a breach and invasion of trust and autonomy but it doesn't mean i have to follow that shit

i can def see that but i was surprised how frank they were abt sex in ep 10 so! one can dream...

sure absolutely! i'm not absolving her of her behavior now because i think it is nasty behavior. i really dislike how she acted on the previous case too; trying to displace people is also a big issue. i just think people are being not so woman-friendly more than they realize and that the show talks about agency so much and isn't trying to point to who is right or who is wrong between them.

because he diminished choice for her as well and it got to the point where they're at. and yet the woman who made it pretty explicit what she was doing is the only bad one. and like Bluesky20 said: WYW is not even referred to! so it's about them them them and yes including the father.

goood point!!!! good good point

i think asking someone to give birth to a child that you don't want and knowing that it could "move them" while also knowing the issues it takes to procure an abortion is not good. and i do not think the show is trying to show that his decision was as altruistic and self-sacrificing as many of you seem to think it is. i'm talking about how people are acting like her choice to leave after her ex begs her to have a child—and yes being an incubator in this sense because literally she is carrying it to term and giving it to him at his behest and yes this is bonkers to ask someone i'm sorry. and i'm sorry we live in a society that covers just what makes it so nasty to do—is gross and abandoning a child she didn't want because of this request is evil.


i am not saying her actions now are perfect but i am saying we need to put it into context and see the topic of agency in this show as a legitimate one. she is making demands, not that they are expressly legitimate, based off of all of the above that he agreed on. then he becomes angry at her demands and mad because he "saved" WYW but she is bad for "abandoning" a baby /she did not want/ and coming to collect on the promise? and YES she looks bad, and it is fucked up, and she's scared as shit. but it's all connected

i agree with you! sorry i made it seem like that. i actually just watched this ep with my roommate and she has less knowledge of the show but she said the exact same thing. the both of them she didn't feel bad for in that scene.

i think you're totally right about her feelings as well. this isn't black and white; some women/people are fine with aborting the fetus but for many it's a complex tricky thing. i mean in that scene she is panicked and, as my roommate said to me, it wasn't coming from a genuine place because of that but clearly this is something that massively affected her. i think people are equating her in the womb with the person WYW is NOW and that's a problem because it assumes tae su-mi's role was to always be a mother—because she's a woman—and to want to be on the timeline that others want. it may shock people that she loves and adores her son but feels ambivalent or would do something like this.

and feelings/emotions wise it may not be right but it's not because she wanted to have an abortion. anyway you get it and i think maybe a lot of people skew younger or prefer a more anti-choice lean and don't see that the drama isn't trying to make things easy for us. i think more and more i'm seeing that, esp coupled with what went on in ep 10, agency is HUGE as a topic—and fucking timely esp with what happened in SK in 2020 with abortion and now in the US as we slide backwards—and exploring hierarchy, agency, and people's place in the world is not going to give us easy answers, perfect victims, and total clarity. that's when we have to step up and look beyond the law and do societal upheaval so these choices don't have to be MADE. and /this/ is how you write greyness in a drama for a character; you put the individual in the macro structure and see what certain things lead them to.

i would love to see the guiltiness explored bc obviously she was moved in some way. yes she was scared but there's more to it than that. and i think people may have to contend with the fact that she very may well not love WYW. i'm just sorta disappointed not many people get seem to get this

my point is that it is a ridiculous, and offensive, ask. and even though she has money that does not mean it would necessarily be that easy. she didn't want the child but he begged. so she had it and she doesn't have to like her or want her or want them around because that was the deal. women already feel pressure and also women would need extenuating circumstances, to be married, and to have consent from their husband. the whole thing is real fucked up and i do not think it is fair to act like her father is this bastion of a good person when he asked her to do something and it was an invasive ask. it's even worse because they are aware of the strictures of it.

all of a sudden she has to love a child she never wanted? and she's evil for not wanting her? i understand the rest of it but the way people are talking about her they're acting like she physically wanted to murder it and that these perspectives aren't anti-choice or misogynist also misses the point of what i think the show is trying to convey. a lot of people are mad she wanted to make that choice period and are thinking of WYW as an adult first and the woman who carried it second.

but it's not anymore. and women/people need it to be decriminalized. i'm not sure what your point is but it is not fair to ask a woman to have a child that she does not want. that's my point and full stop. i don't think it's fair or acceptable to forget that.

omg ty

sorry!

lmao if one more serial killer comes out i s2g.... also hahah i forgot about that show! i remember that

wondering if a lot of the audience has amnesia nad doesn't remember wyw's father asking tsm to be a human incubator and promised he would flit away. that's not a ridiculous request to ask of someone? some of you need to check your double standards because what she did and was asked to do is way larger than her verbally saying those things. i'm not really surprised at the reaction but it's pretty gross to see.


anyway i'm watching the kiss over and over and it was sensual~* like her initiative and him explaining and him holding on to her and then them making out >:) sometimes their lips would just meet it was very nice. i'm excited to see their relationship grow. it would be very interesting to see how they approach sex